TTC driver shot in the face

DRTO · October 17th, 2005, 04:33 PM

Now there is increased pressure on the province to do something about the escalating gun violence on Toronto streets. What can the province do to curb this violence?
http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/Con...l=969483202845

Mechie · October 17th, 2005, 04:50 PM

control entry to the country more tightly.

Buster · October 17th, 2005, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mechie

control entry to the country more tightly.

Yeah, we need to make sure that American firearms stay south of the border.

ssiguy2 · October 17th, 2005, 05:23 PM

I agree!

DRTO · October 17th, 2005, 07:38 PM

What about tougher sentencing? What if we had life in prison for carrying an illegal firearm? Maybe these people would think twice about carrying a piece then.

Mechie · October 17th, 2005, 07:39 PM

yea, if we controlled access the way THEY do, things would go a lot better. i have a funny story from personal experience actually...ill tell it when im not at work lol

Byron · October 17th, 2005, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRTO

What about tougher sentencing? What if we had life in prison for carrying an illegal firearm? Maybe these people would think twice about carrying a piece then.

Just look at American jails, tough sentences for drugs, and their jails are packed. Many times jail is where most of these thugs learn even more "skills of the trade" . It has to be a change in mindset, not simply tougher penalties.

Mechie · October 17th, 2005, 09:28 PM

We also need better screening regarding WHO we let in the country.

KingWilson · October 17th, 2005, 11:00 PM

"I have to say I'm all for public flogging. One type of criminal that a public humiliation might work particularly well with are the juvenile delinquents, a lot of whom consider it a badge of honor to be sent to juvenile detention. And it might not be such a cool thing in the 'hood to be flogged publicly." - Ann Coulter on MSNBC March 22, 1997

on that note...

I for one agree with controling entry as well... both on illegal firearms and on criminals trying to land as 'economic refugees." Not that I'm against immigration (I'd actually like to see it increased) and real political refugees, say, that are at risk of torture in their home countries. But immigration is not an everyone-wins-all-the-time scenario and imho people have their heads in the sand for thinking that immigration and the rising crime rate are not linked. we should try to fix the system before we start tearing apart at the seams, like in Holland.

It's sometimes hard to have rational discussion on it, tho, when your government/elite has built up, as they say, a national religion around cultural subjectivism as here in canada.

the other factor we have is more and more of an anonymous society and the downfall of religion, but hey that's not exactly something that one government would be able to reverse.

KingWilson · October 17th, 2005, 11:03 PM

and tougher jail sentences do, i suppose get the job done but it doesn't address, and i think in fact exasperates, the problem of the growing canadian urban underclass.

doady · October 18th, 2005, 12:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KingWilson

"I have to say I'm all for public flogging. One type of criminal that a public humiliation might work particularly well with are the juvenile delinquents, a lot of whom consider it a badge of honor to be sent to juvenile detention. And it might not be such a cool thing in the 'hood to be flogged publicly." - Ann Coulter on MSNBC March 22, 1997

Are you serious? This is the dumbest quote I ever heard... I have never heard any teenager gloating about being sent to prison... and the men invloved in this shooting aren't even juveniles; they're in their 20's... and public flogging??? Are we in back in the Middle Ages now?

DonQui · October 18th, 2005, 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buster

Yeah, we need to make sure that American firearms stay south of the border.

Post 3 and we are already blaming the US for your problems...

snoopy · October 18th, 2005, 12:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by doady

Are you serious? This is the dumbest quote I ever heard... I have never heard any teenager gloating about being sent to prison... and the men invloved in this shooting aren't even juveniles; they're in their 20's... and public flogging??? Are we in back in the Middle Ages now?

i guess so... from what i've seen from katrina the usa seems to be in the dark ages now.

but combating crime with corporal punishment DOES NOT work... thats why they teach parents not to spank their children. In the end it just causes more problems. Many a study have been done on this topic by many experts: Straus, Gunnoe, Mariner, Briezena etc all have concluded that spanking in childhood has no positive outcomes and leads to anti-social behaviour later in life (increases in crime and criminal behaviour). Increased Spanking and Regions with High Religious Beliefs in the USA also have direct/positive relationship.

partybits · October 18th, 2005, 12:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mechie

control entry to the country more tightly.

Please provide stats for us that it is immigrants causing the majority of the crime.

Perhaps it is the children of the immigrants, I don't know, but I somehow doubt that immigrants are the primary sourse of crime.

partybits · October 18th, 2005, 12:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRTO

What about tougher sentencing? What if we had life in prison for carrying an illegal firearm? Maybe these people would think twice about carrying a piece then.

I think that backfires. The California '3 strikes' law has increased the crime rate astronomically in that state and they are considering repealing the law.
It's because if you make a punishment so tough, criminals will just ignore it flat out. Remember, often criminals (who get caught) are well...idiots. They DON'T THINK THEY WILL GET CAUGHT! So increasing punishment to that extreme will not help.

However, I do agree that it should be more stringent then current laws allow, just not an automatic life sentance. Especially on a first offense.

partybits · October 18th, 2005, 12:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by doady

Are you serious? This is the dumbest quote I ever heard... I have never heard any teenager gloating about being sent to prison... and the men invloved in this shooting aren't even juveniles; they're in their 20's... and public flogging??? Are we in back in the Middle Ages now?

Unfortunatly, as sad as it may seem, I have too often seen teenagers gloating about being in prison. It was a cool thing to do. One of my friends from back when I was a teen spent more time in prison (auto theft) than at his home. He was in and out every couple month. (Reason the YOA needs to be more stricter). He laughed about it and got complete respect from his buddies.
Public flogging though...ummmm yeah that's kinda going a bit over board.
I prefer boot camp for teens. Make there lives a living hell and work them to the bones so they know prison is'nt just some summer camp. Force them to continue there education if they want any chance of parole.

Buster · October 18th, 2005, 01:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DonQui

Post 3 and we are already blaming the US for your problems...

Hey, I have nothing against Americans. I just have a problem with your firearms entering our country.

Jaye101 · October 18th, 2005, 02:03 AM

Exactly... btw, this happend across the street from my house.

York Transit · October 18th, 2005, 02:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buster

Hey, I have nothing against Americans. I just have a problem with your firearms entering our country.

It's not entirely US's fault. I mean it's easy to get a gun in a WAL-MART...

rt_0891 · October 18th, 2005, 02:35 AM

I posted this in another thread. I seriously think TO has to attack this problem, or it's going to get out of hand:

Real life in the projects
Russian immigrant, 22, films stories

Underground DVD hot seller downtown

GABE GONDA
CITY HALL BUREAU

It's a $10 passport to the most notorious housing projects in the city.

Real Toronto is the city's hottest underground DVD , a 40-minute film shot this spring that screens like a disturbing trailer for the summer that followed, when young black men gunned each other down weekly in blighted neighbourhoods from North York to Scarborough.

Filmed with a handheld digital video recorder by a 22-year-old Russian immigrant, Real Toronto purports to show viewers, "the reality of living in housing projects and some of the most run-down areas of the city."

It's one part rap video, one part ghetto travelogue and, its producer fears, one part police evidence, depicting young men blasting shotguns, flashing rounds of ammunition in broad daylight and bragging about bullying neighbourhood informants.

"I wanted to show that what people rap about really does happen," said Madd Russian, the film's director and producer, who didn't want his real name used.

Real Toronto imitates, if unconsciously, U.S. products like Stop Snitching, a notorious underground film that featured NBA star Carmelo Anthony rubbing shoulders with gangsters and drug dealers last year.

In one scene, a young man at the Teesdale projects in southwest Scarborough explains, "We're so real, we'll take you to the snitch's door."

Standing in a dimly lit hallway in a highrise at 40 Teesdale Place, the man and a friend point to the "snitch's" apartment and explain he's too afraid to take his garbage to the chute, leaving it in the hallway instead.

"We check his house every hour on the hour," the man says.

The DVD isn't all like that. In the next segment, filmed at Midland and Lawrence Aves. in Scarborough — an area locals refer to as MnL — street rapper Califate brags about helping reclaim a playground for local kids, building a basketball court and shows off his T-shirt, featuring a logo he designed for a line of clothing he markets under the label, "Scartown."

At Jane and Finch in North York, though, real-life street violence merges with the stylized glamour of gangster rap videos. A half-dozen young men gather in a semi-circle inside an apartment building, bandanas covering their faces, as each takes turns showing off his gun. One flashes what looks like an Uzi submachine gun while another brags about his "40 Cal." pistol from underneath a maple leaf do-rag.

The DVD tours nine neighbourhoods and in each, locals answer Russian's basic question, "What's it like growing up here?" with the same mix of pride and despair. Complaints about poverty and police mistreatment mingle with gun-wielding braggadocio and boasts about "hos, cars and cash."

Real Toronto went on sale last week at Play De Record on Yonge St., where owner Nav says the DVD is very popular and so controversial he won't provide his last name.

Madd Russian moved back to Toronto last year after studying tourism at a university near Moscow and made the film this spring while working in the kitchen of a restaurant.

He and his family emgrated from Nyzhny Novgorod in 1993, two years after the Soviet Union collapsed. Russian says he fell in love with hip-hop before he could speak English and got the idea for the video while listening to "Where I'm From," a song about living in the projects by Toronto rapper Black Eye. "As he's rapping, I saw the places in my head."

With help from two local rappers, Russian was introduced to locals in one of the neighbourhoods where he filmed and word began to spread about the thickly accented white kid offering a chance to mouth off on camera. Being an immigrant, he says, helped him gain the trust of young men who also consider themselves outsiders. "They didn't see me as white."

Russian says Real Toronto is pure documentary and refuses to judge his subjects.

"This is their side of the story. What they said is what they said. I put it out because it's something people don't get to see."

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=268758

October 17th, 2005, 04:33 PM	#1
DRTO Registered User Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 442 Likes (Received): 0	TTC driver shot in the face Now there is increased pressure on the province to do something about the escalating gun violence on Toronto streets. What can the province do to curb this violence? http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/Con...l=969483202845

October 18th, 2005, 02:03 AM	#18
Jaye101 Midtown Fella Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: █♣█ Toronto Posts: 5,301 Likes (Received): 0	Exactly... btw, this happend across the street from my house. __________________ Jaye's Rant 5: Take Back Your Future! Jaye's Rant 6: Tomorrow's Too Late Jaye's Rant 7: An Afro-centric Solution Jaye's Rant 8: The G-Word

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October 17th, 2005, 04:50 PM	#2
Mechie Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 296 Likes (Received): 0	control entry to the country more tightly.

October 17th, 2005, 05:23 PM	#4
ssiguy2 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: White Rock BC Posts: 4,986 Likes (Received): 45	I agree!

October 17th, 2005, 07:38 PM	#5
DRTO Registered User Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 442 Likes (Received): 0	What about tougher sentencing? What if we had life in prison for carrying an illegal firearm? Maybe these people would think twice about carrying a piece then.

October 17th, 2005, 07:39 PM	#6
Mechie Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 296 Likes (Received): 0	yea, if we controlled access the way THEY do, things would go a lot better. i have a funny story from personal experience actually...ill tell it when im not at work lol

October 17th, 2005, 09:28 PM	#8
Mechie Registered User Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 296 Likes (Received): 0	We also need better screening regarding WHO we let in the country.

October 17th, 2005, 11:00 PM	#9
KingWilson Registered User Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: the centre of the universe Posts: 103 Likes (Received): 0	"I have to say I'm all for public flogging. One type of criminal that a public humiliation might work particularly well with are the juvenile delinquents, a lot of whom consider it a badge of honor to be sent to juvenile detention. And it might not be such a cool thing in the 'hood to be flogged publicly." - Ann Coulter on MSNBC March 22, 1997 on that note... I for one agree with controling entry as well... both on illegal firearms and on criminals trying to land as 'economic refugees." Not that I'm against immigration (I'd actually like to see it increased) and real political refugees, say, that are at risk of torture in their home countries. But immigration is not an everyone-wins-all-the-time scenario and imho people have their heads in the sand for thinking that immigration and the rising crime rate are not linked. we should try to fix the system before we start tearing apart at the seams, like in Holland. It's sometimes hard to have rational discussion on it, tho, when your government/elite has built up, as they say, a national religion around cultural subjectivism as here in canada. the other factor we have is more and more of an anonymous society and the downfall of religion, but hey that's not exactly something that one government would be able to reverse.

October 17th, 2005, 11:03 PM	#10
KingWilson Registered User Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: the centre of the universe Posts: 103 Likes (Received): 0	and tougher jail sentences do, i suppose get the job done but it doesn't address, and i think in fact exasperates, the problem of the growing canadian urban underclass.

October 18th, 2005, 02:35 AM	#20
rt_0891 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Toronto, Hong Kong, Vancouver Posts: 2,697 Likes (Received): 0	I posted this in another thread. I seriously think TO has to attack this problem, or it's going to get out of hand: Real life in the projects Russian immigrant, 22, films stories Underground DVD hot seller downtown GABE GONDA CITY HALL BUREAU It's a $10 passport to the most notorious housing projects in the city. Real Toronto is the city's hottest underground DVD , a 40-minute film shot this spring that screens like a disturbing trailer for the summer that followed, when young black men gunned each other down weekly in blighted neighbourhoods from North York to Scarborough. Filmed with a handheld digital video recorder by a 22-year-old Russian immigrant, Real Toronto purports to show viewers, "the reality of living in housing projects and some of the most run-down areas of the city." It's one part rap video, one part ghetto travelogue and, its producer fears, one part police evidence, depicting young men blasting shotguns, flashing rounds of ammunition in broad daylight and bragging about bullying neighbourhood informants. "I wanted to show that what people rap about really does happen," said Madd Russian, the film's director and producer, who didn't want his real name used. Real Toronto imitates, if unconsciously, U.S. products like Stop Snitching, a notorious underground film that featured NBA star Carmelo Anthony rubbing shoulders with gangsters and drug dealers last year. In one scene, a young man at the Teesdale projects in southwest Scarborough explains, "We're so real, we'll take you to the snitch's door." Standing in a dimly lit hallway in a highrise at 40 Teesdale Place, the man and a friend point to the "snitch's" apartment and explain he's too afraid to take his garbage to the chute, leaving it in the hallway instead. "We check his house every hour on the hour," the man says. The DVD isn't all like that. In the next segment, filmed at Midland and Lawrence Aves. in Scarborough — an area locals refer to as MnL — street rapper Califate brags about helping reclaim a playground for local kids, building a basketball court and shows off his T-shirt, featuring a logo he designed for a line of clothing he markets under the label, "Scartown." At Jane and Finch in North York, though, real-life street violence merges with the stylized glamour of gangster rap videos. A half-dozen young men gather in a semi-circle inside an apartment building, bandanas covering their faces, as each takes turns showing off his gun. One flashes what looks like an Uzi submachine gun while another brags about his "40 Cal." pistol from underneath a maple leaf do-rag. The DVD tours nine neighbourhoods and in each, locals answer Russian's basic question, "What's it like growing up here?" with the same mix of pride and despair. Complaints about poverty and police mistreatment mingle with gun-wielding braggadocio and boasts about "hos, cars and cash." Real Toronto went on sale last week at Play De Record on Yonge St., where owner Nav says the DVD is very popular and so controversial he won't provide his last name. Madd Russian moved back to Toronto last year after studying tourism at a university near Moscow and made the film this spring while working in the kitchen of a restaurant. He and his family emgrated from Nyzhny Novgorod in 1993, two years after the Soviet Union collapsed. Russian says he fell in love with hip-hop before he could speak English and got the idea for the video while listening to "Where I'm From," a song about living in the projects by Toronto rapper Black Eye. "As he's rapping, I saw the places in my head." With help from two local rappers, Russian was introduced to locals in one of the neighbourhoods where he filmed and word began to spread about the thickly accented white kid offering a chance to mouth off on camera. Being an immigrant, he says, helped him gain the trust of young men who also consider themselves outsiders. "They didn't see me as white." Russian says Real Toronto is pure documentary and refuses to judge his subjects. "This is their side of the story. What they said is what they said. I put it out because it's something people don't get to see." http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=268758