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Old June 6th, 2016, 10:34 PM   #1181
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StuZealand View Post
Are most of these works planned to be completed by the time the CBT opens in 2020?
Works which involve reduced capacity will end before the opening of the CBT, works to increase capacity (third track Bellinzona-Giubaisco) will follow later.

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Originally Posted by StuZealand View Post
How was the trip after all these years of waiting for the tunnel to open?

How long did the journey take, given it wasn't at full speed?
I will miss the old line...the northbound shuttles had 32 minutes timetabled between the two portals, but this was a temporary setup just for the opening.

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Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
Via GBT or as now via the old line?
All fast trains will use the new line.

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Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
Actually what kind of traffic will remain on the old line as of next year?
Mainly the hourly RegioExpress service. Then, there will be historic trains, tourist trains, trains diverted from the base tunnel for whatever reason, and in future trains carrying spoil from the second Gotthard road tunnel to the dump sites.

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Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
Why not keep them as is via the old line?
Because it is expected that traffic will decrease strongly after Erstfeld coming from the north, so they want to use bigger trains north of Erstfeld (including double deck trains, maybe). However, this mandatory transhipment is very irritating for passengers. This demonstrates that SBB worked mainly from a technical point of view (because it simplifies train operations), not from an suer point of view.
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Old June 6th, 2016, 10:51 PM   #1182
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Where will the second Gotthard road tunnel be? I thought the whole point of this was to render that sort of thing unnecessary.
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Old June 6th, 2016, 11:31 PM   #1183
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coccodrillo View Post

Mainly the hourly RegioExpress service. Then, there will be historic trains, tourist trains, trains diverted from the base tunnel for whatever reason, and in future trains carrying spoil from the second Gotthard road tunnel to the dump sites.
How about extending every other S10 and every other S20 to Airolo? Line capacity would be no problem any more.
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Old June 7th, 2016, 12:09 AM   #1184
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There is not enough potential traffic for more than one train per hour (+ one extra return trip for students).

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Where will the second Gotthard road tunnel be? I thought the whole point of this was to render that sort of thing unnecessary.
Parallel to the existing one. It was approved by voters on 28.2.2016.

It would have been avoidable, but politicians did everything to make the second road tunnel appealing. But that's another story...
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Old June 7th, 2016, 12:47 AM   #1185
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...why did they try to make it so appealing?

Wouldn't it be better to build more of the base-tunnel cut-offs to cut Zurich Milan to one hour? That would certainly seem to be a better return-on-investment to me.
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Old June 8th, 2016, 08:51 PM   #1186
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 00Zy99 View Post
...why did they try to make it so appealing?

Wouldn't it be better to build more of the base-tunnel cut-offs to cut Zurich Milan to one hour? That would certainly seem to be a better return-on-investment to me.
Make what so appealing?

Better ROI than what?
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Old June 8th, 2016, 09:46 PM   #1187
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Make what so appealing?

Better ROI than what?
...the 2nd Gotthard Road Tunnel

(look at the posts above)
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Old June 8th, 2016, 10:35 PM   #1188
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 00Zy99 View Post
...why did they try to make it so appealing?

Wouldn't it be better to build more of the base-tunnel cut-offs to cut Zurich Milan to one hour? That would certainly seem to be a better return-on-investment to me.
Today's government wants to increase (also) road capacity, rather than (only) rail capacity like the previous governments. Officially the second tunnel is only for safety, but they want to build four lanes promising that two will be used only as emergency lanes (like to stop broken down vehicles). But nobody really think this promise will be kept.

Note that the second road tunnel was opposed also by many right-wing/economy groups, not only by greens, saying that economically it is not justified and that the "B option" (renovating the existing tunnel without doubling it) was purposedly made expensive to make it look like having a bad ROI. Note, however, that non public documents I had the chance to see say that a cost-benefit analysis has not been made, because the doubling was a political decision, not a reasoned choice. However, on public documents the government always said that they did the best choice also from an economical point of view (which might be, but also might not, as they didn't made a CBA analysis).

It has long discussed in the road forum: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=510148
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Old June 9th, 2016, 12:36 AM   #1189
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How much and how will the access fees to GBT be charged? Per axle, like in France? Per train, like in Italy?
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Old June 10th, 2016, 12:37 AM   #1190
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coccodrillo View Post
Officially the second tunnel is only for safety, but they want to build four lanes promising that two will be used only as emergency lanes (like to stop broken down vehicles). But nobody really think this promise will be kept.
Actually, the point isn't if the promise will be kept. If there would be such a proposal (open the emergency lanes and therefore increase the capacity of the road route), the swiss citizens will be asked to vote on this issue.
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Old June 17th, 2016, 12:23 AM   #1191
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The full recording of the opening ceremony on 1st June 2016 can be watched again on the youtube channel of swiss television SRF.



Some remarkable parts:
- Beginning of recording at minute 23:00
- A short summary of the construction history at 26:00
- Departure of the first inaugural passenger trains at beginning of the artistic performance at 2:27:00
- End of performance and arrival of the trains with fireworks at 2:57:00
- More detailed summary of construction at 4:15:00
- Speeches of politicians including Christian Kern (Austria), Angela Merkel (Germany), François Hollande (France) from 4:43:00 on
- Official inauguration at 5:26:00
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Old June 27th, 2016, 09:26 PM   #1192
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http://www.railpictures.net/photo/581112
Georg Trüb, June 22, 2016, Wassen
The upper Reuss valley in the blue hour at 10.18 PM, in a multiple long time exposure. In the foreground the village of Wassen, junction to the Susten pass, in the background the lights of Göschenen and the Schöllenen gorge. The broad light traces in the valley are from vehicles on the Gotthard highway A2. On the right, on the mountainside, we can see the light traces of the northbound Interregio 2442, far away near Göschenen, in the Eggwald part (clearly visible the two red signals of Eggwald track change station) and between the upper Entschigtal avalanche protector and the former linesman house number 23fs on the far right. In the middle, the light traces on the middle level of the loops, between Middle Meienreuss bridge and the lower Entschigtal avalanche protector. The train changed from the left to the right track on the switches before Wassen station. On the left the baroque church of Wassen, built from 1734 to 1742, on a hill. When travelling over the Gotthard line, you can see this church from three different levels.

Another photo of the Gotthardbahn: http://www.railpictures.net/photo/578576/

Found via RailPicture's links, completely off topic but curious: http://www.railpictures.net/photo/580904/ and http://www.railpictures.net/photo/27083/
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Old June 28th, 2016, 02:03 PM   #1193
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coccodrillo View Post
On the left the baroque church of Wassen, built from 1734 to 1742, on a hill. When travelling over the Gotthard line, you can see this church from three different levels
Or you can, like I did several years ago, drive to that church, park your car
there, and stay for a couple of hours, enjoying the view and a parade of
trains going up or down the line, seeing each of them 3 times, above, level,
and below the church. Wonderful moments...
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Old July 9th, 2016, 08:10 AM   #1194
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I see that the Ceneri base tunnel is very close to being entirely lined now.
https://www.alptransit.ch/en/ceneri/tunnel-structure/

Also, the webcam at Vigana has been re-positioned to show a large open flat area. Not sure what's going to be built here. Anyone know?
http://webcam.alptransit.ch/vigana/ceneri_1024.jpg
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Old July 9th, 2016, 11:08 PM   #1195
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Any of you know what will be the final (after start of commercial operation) function if any of access tunnel and exploratory bore?
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Old July 11th, 2016, 11:04 AM   #1196
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@StuZealand: it will likely be the logistic base for railway equipment construction.

@Sunfuns:
Amsteg: cables from a traction power substation (15 kV 16,7 Hz)
Sedrun: ventilation in case of event (fire, maintenance, ...)
Faido: cables from a traction power substation (15 kV 16,7 Hz) + ventilation in case of event (fire, maintenance, ...)
Bodio avoiding tunnel: it might house a data center, a private project not linked with rail operations, a wall will be built at the end of this tunnel so it will not be linked with the main tubes anymore
Bodio spoil tunnel: it will be used again to transport spoil excavated from a Gotthard tunnel, this time the second road tube, but not before 2020, it is an indipendent tunnel (no underground link with the GBT); spoil will come from Göschenen and Airolo to Bodio by train and come to the same dump site as for the GBT
Sigirino (two access tunnels): nothing in particular, maybe ventilation in case of event

Each of them, except for Bodio: access and if possible ventilation in case of emergencies, although if possible rescuers will come by train from the portals. In case of accident passengers would if possible be brought out of the tunnel by trains, not via the access tunnel. Maintenance will be carried out only by trains, so not from the access tunnels.
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Old July 14th, 2016, 10:37 PM   #1197
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http://www.railpictures.net/photo/582639/
Georg Trüb, July 08, 2016, Rynächt
The situation on the 57 kilometer long Gotthard Base Tunnel north portal at Rynächt near Erstfeld, viewed from about 400 meter above the valley floor. The Venice-Simplon-Orient-Express (VSOE) pulled by two Re 4/4 II is heading towards Erstfeld and the Gotthard mountain line, crossing the double portal of the Base Tunnel shortly. The red building is the Infocenter of the Alptransit, which will close in December 2016. The long flat roofed rectangular building is the BTG Erstfeld (Bahntechnikgebäude/Building for the railway technics). Right from the cantonal road was the former double track Gotthard line, used till this spring and will be soon renaturalized. On the bright area on the right behind the portal, in the next years, a fish farming will be built, using the clear warm water (about 14 to 16 degrees celsius) coming from the Gotthard Base Tunnel.
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Old July 15th, 2016, 03:45 AM   #1198
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Based on what I remember reading about the Chunnel opening, I'm guessing that VSOE is banned from any of the base tunnels due to fire concerns? A good reason to keep the old lines, I would say!
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Old July 15th, 2016, 07:41 AM   #1199
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Because it is expected that traffic will decrease strongly after Erstfeld coming from the north, so they want to use bigger trains north of Erstfeld (including double deck trains, maybe). However, this mandatory transhipment is very irritating for passengers.
Actually, SBB knows that its passengers don't mind changing trains.
For example: The current direct IR Basel/Zürich - Locarno sees about 80% of its passengers leave in Arth Goldau. Most passengers for Locarno change to the ICN, and then again to the S20 in Bellinzona in order to be there 15 minutes earlier.

So the only purpose of trains over the old route is: Serving locations along the old route (I hope they reopen some stations...) and tourists.

The proposed timetable for the old route is probably only temporary. In 2017 the whole SBB concession is going to be reviewed, and it is possible that the line uses its mainline status, and SBB does no longer have to run trains over it. What then will happen is that the cantons along the line will work out something, and call for tenders to operate the line.

The SOB already has a concept for a tourist orientated service, which they think they can do cheaper than the SBB, and which would reintroduce direct trains from Lugano alternating to Basel and Zürich.

http://www.bahnonline.ch/bo/wp-conte...ahn_7-7-16.pdf
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Old July 24th, 2016, 11:55 PM   #1200
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http://www.railpictures.net/photo/583615/
Georg Trüb, July 23, 2016, between Altdorf and Rynächt
Practice run of the new "Gottardino" train, timetabled from August 2nd, running through the world's longest railway tunnel, the 57 km long Gotthard Base Tunnel, from Flüelen to Biasca, stopping for about one hour in the multifunction station Sedrun. Cab car Bt # 28-94 911, first class cars Apm # 10-90 217, 210, 219 and 221, pushed in the rear by Re 460 # 016 "Rohrdorferberg-Reusstal", between Altdorf and Rynächt, about 3.4 kilometer from the north portal of the Base tunnel.
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