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Old May 27th, 2008, 02:42 PM   #2301
ChrisZwolle
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Atlanta morning rushhour traffic seems fairly okay.

[IMG]http://i28.************/fmt5kp.jpg[/IMG]
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Old May 27th, 2008, 11:10 PM   #2302
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Atlanta has a ****ed up road system.
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Old May 27th, 2008, 11:20 PM   #2303
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It looks like merging two major Interstates into one going through downtown is the worst part of it all. I like that all Interstates go through the heart of the city but it looks like it would have been better if they somehow kept them as two separate freeways on either side of downtown.
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Old May 27th, 2008, 11:32 PM   #2304
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Atlanta doesn't have a grid system, and neither does it have much direct main road connections to downtown. This means all traffic is moving to the massive freeways. The traffic volumes are very high for the size of the metropolitan area. Only Houston has comparable AADT's.
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Old May 28th, 2008, 04:23 AM   #2305
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The difference in the US and Europe is most of our states are bigger that European countries. North Carolina is the 28th biggest state in land area. It is just a little larger than England.
It is over 500 miles from Manteo on the coast to Murphy in the mounatins. I live in Charlotte and it is 200 miles to Wilington and 130 miles to Raleigh. With these types of miles if I were Europe, I would be in another country.

The differnce here in the US people move all around the country. I have a daughter in the Denver, Colorado area and a son in the Philpadelpha, area. to drive to Penn. it is a ll day drive. To Colorado it is a 3 hour flight from Charlotte. As a rule, for evey hour in the air it is a one day drive.

So here in the US, we can drive the lower 48 states with no trouble.

The USA is a big place. We are only 58 miles from Russia. The Bering Strait separates the United States and Russia by 58 miles (85 km), with a water depth that measures 100–165 feet, (30–50 meters).

In the last few decades some factions have discussed the construction of a bridge over the strait, however, financial and weather concerns have continually stalled the project. Recently, talk of a tunnel under the strait has been on the front-burner, however, the high cost of same will certainly be a factor, but imagine driving from Alaska to Russia. Wow, what a concept!
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Old May 28th, 2008, 06:29 AM   #2306
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FM 2258 View Post


It looks like merging two major Interstates into one going through downtown is the worst part of it all. I like that all Interstates go through the heart of the city but it looks like it would have been better if they somehow kept them as two separate freeways on either side of downtown.
There was a north-south freeway planned to run east of downtown, extending southward from I-85/GA 400, but it was canceled. I believe that it was to feed into I-675 at I-285 at its south end. Parts of the ROW are easily visible on aerial images of the city and the Carter Presidential Library was built where it was to meet the unbuilt GA 10 freeway east of downtown.

Had it been built, I-75/85 would not need to be nearly as wide as it now is in the downtown area.

Mike
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Old May 28th, 2008, 07:22 AM   #2307
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CLTNC View Post
The difference in the US and Europe is most of our states are bigger that European countries. North Carolina is the 28th biggest state in land area. It is just a little larger than England.
It is over 500 miles from Manteo on the coast to Murphy in the mounatins. I live in Charlotte and it is 200 miles to Wilington and 130 miles to Raleigh. With these types of miles if I were Europe, I would be in another country.

The differnce here in the US people move all around the country. I have a daughter in the Denver, Colorado area and a son in the Philpadelpha, area. to drive to Penn. it is a ll day drive. To Colorado it is a 3 hour flight from Charlotte. As a rule, for evey hour in the air it is a one day drive.

So here in the US, we can drive the lower 48 states with no trouble.

The USA is a big place. We are only 58 miles from Russia. The Bering Strait separates the United States and Russia by 58 miles (85 km), with a water depth that measures 100–165 feet, (30–50 meters).

In the last few decades some factions have discussed the construction of a bridge over the strait, however, financial and weather concerns have continually stalled the project. Recently, talk of a tunnel under the strait has been on the front-burner, however, the high cost of same will certainly be a factor, but imagine driving from Alaska to Russia. Wow, what a concept!

I've been to the U.K. and Italy and judging from those two countries the way cities and towns are set up makes the place look much bigger than it really is. I remember taking a bus from Bournemouth to Christchurch and although it isn't far (less than six miles) it felt like we went 30 miles in the United States. They seem to use land very efficiently in Europe and you pass so many stores, homes and businesses in a relatively short distance. I even drove from Catania to Giarre in Italy and that short trip felt really long to me although it was on a tollway.



Quote:
Originally Posted by mgk920 View Post
There was a north-south freeway planned to run east of downtown, extending southward from I-85/GA 400, but it was canceled. I believe that it was to feed into I-675 at I-285 at its south end. Parts of the ROW are easily visible on aerial images of the city and the Carter Presidential Library was built where it was to meet the unbuilt GA 10 freeway east of downtown.

Had it been built, I-75/85 would not need to be nearly as wide as it now is in the downtown area.

Mike

That's interesting, I'll have to take a look. I love Interstate highways but our country needs to get on the ball and figure out a way to make public transportation a truly viable alternative for driving your car.
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Old May 28th, 2008, 11:27 AM   #2308
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mgk920 View Post
There was a north-south freeway planned to run east of downtown, extending southward from I-85/GA 400, but it was canceled. I believe that it was to feed into I-675 at I-285 at its south end. Parts of the ROW are easily visible on aerial images of the city and the Carter Presidential Library was built where it was to meet the unbuilt GA 10 freeway east of downtown.

Had it been built, I-75/85 would not need to be nearly as wide as it now is in the downtown area.

Mike
That is correct, the I-675 should have connected with the GA-400 (the tollway section). However, i doubt if it would relieve the downtown connector, since i think the majority of that traffic comes from the south(west) and goes north(west) or northeast on I-85, and does not need to use the projected I-675. I think most traffic for that corridor rather comes from the eastern part of the Perimeter (I-285) and local roads.

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Originally Posted by FM 2258 View Post
That's interesting, I'll have to take a look. I love Interstate highways but our country needs to get on the ball and figure out a way to make public transportation a truly viable alternative for driving your car.
The only way to do that is to make the cities more dense. Building a public transportation in the current cities, is mostly unaffordable, you need a very large PT-system to make a significant difference to relief the roadways. No city can make that kind of expenditure. That's why you see only small railsystems being build.

Besides that, building the infrastructure is one thing, maintaining and operating it while you're not making a profite is also very expensive.
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Old May 28th, 2008, 11:55 AM   #2309
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chriszwolle View Post
That is correct, the I-675 should have connected with the GA-400 (the tollway section). However, i doubt if it would relieve the downtown connector, since i think the majority of that traffic comes from the south(west) and goes north(west) or northeast on I-85, and does not need to use the projected I-675. I think most traffic for that corridor rather comes from the eastern part of the Perimeter (I-285) and local roads.
Chris, how do you know all these trivia??
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Old May 28th, 2008, 07:02 PM   #2310
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Atlanta's hilly topography also makes building expressways harder than in flat cities like Detroit or Houston. It is inadequate though.
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Old May 28th, 2008, 08:39 PM   #2311
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I-84 in Oregon:
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Old May 28th, 2008, 08:55 PM   #2312
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Quote:
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I-84 in Oregon:
Have driven this stretch of I-84 (through the Columbia Gorge) many times. Beautiful drive. Trivia: I-84 was originally I-80N. Today's I-80 was I-80S.
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Old May 30th, 2008, 05:04 AM   #2313
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Von Königsberg View Post
There are other purely textual "signs" in the USA that read "Right lane must turn", "Keep right except to pass", "Pass with care", "Reduced speed ahead", etc. Pretty useless, in my opinion.
Actually, these signs are very useful to drivers.
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Old May 30th, 2008, 06:06 AM   #2314
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Quote:
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Actually, these signs are very useful to drivers.
His argument is that to a non-English speaker, they are meaningless (which is true). The question is, is that an issue in the US, while at the same time, are the pictorial signs easily understood simply because one is familiar with them?
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Old May 30th, 2008, 11:26 AM   #2315
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Not at all. It's very simple, and the only thing that takes up a lot of space is the right turn ramps. Surely the intent is to eventually add flyover ramps to convert this to a five-level stack; the land has almost certainly already been bought and the right-turn ramps are there as a cheap means of getting some use out of the reserved land until the interchange is completed.

I'm not a fan of the Texas way of freeway building, but let's criticize it for the right reasons.

Bingo. That's exactly why.
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Old May 30th, 2008, 12:12 PM   #2316
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Actually, these signs are very useful to drivers.
What I meant was that these kind of signs should be represented by pictures and not text. If there are people unable to memorise pictures, rest assured DMV would not give them license to drive
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Old May 30th, 2008, 03:14 PM   #2317
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Quote:
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What I meant was that these kind of signs should be represented by pictures and not text. If there are people unable to memorise pictures, rest assured DMV would not give them license to drive

I see nothing wrong with text based signs in the United States. I never really noticed how many of our signs are text based until the issue came up in this thread. In my opinion they're more helpful than picture signs because there is no question as to what the sign is telling the driver.

I'm not sure how someone would put a "NO THRU TRAFFIC" sign in picture form but the sign works well as designed.
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Old May 31st, 2008, 02:16 PM   #2318
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FM 2258 View Post
I see nothing wrong with text based signs in the United States. I never really noticed how many of our signs are text based until the issue came up in this thread. In my opinion they're more helpful than picture signs because there is no question as to what the sign is telling the driver.

I'm not sure how someone would put a "NO THRU TRAFFIC" sign in picture form but the sign works well as designed.
I never really take notice of them since I'm used to them here. But I think using pictures allows a sign to provide more information, thus probably replacing two or more signs at many intersections with one sign, while providing drivers with more useful information regarding lane designation. A picture design tends to provide more information with a simpler layout, replacing a clutter of works with one or two arrows.

One problem I frequently encounter in the states is not always knowing exactly which lane goes where, which is not a problem in places I'm familiar with, but becomes confusing at times in places I'm new to. Most signs simply say "this and that, right lanes" which is alright, except sometimes some lanes split, and some lanes become solids way before you can make a lane change. This is proven on one or two difficult intersections, where the local residents have obviously complained enough that they got the local government to put up a sign marking the lanes clearly. Why shouldn't this be done for most or all large intersections?

The only problem I see with changing the system is the logistics needed to re-educate the entire population, otherwise the system will take 60 years or more to phase in (just let the drivers who learn the old system die off)
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Old May 31st, 2008, 02:27 PM   #2319
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A picture I found on the CA DMV site.



Now, my only gripe with the American system is the number of "regulatory signs". All the turns signs can be replaced by a lane diagram in big intersections or potentially confusing areas, while all the other signs should be standardized in one way or another. Do not block intersection sign can easily replaced by yellow boxes to reduce clutter, and same with passing zones, etc.

In general, I think the European (well, HK, since it's based on the British system) handles itself much better in terms of managing the clutter vs amount of information delivered ratio.

As for the usefulness of them, however, there's no denying the vast majority of them are useful, if not executed in the best way.
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Old May 31st, 2008, 08:22 PM   #2320
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I've been wondering, are signs in the United States a federal standard or can states also adopt their own system?
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