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Old September 8th, 2008, 04:37 AM   #2881
Alex Von Königsberg
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Yeah, this method constitutes a speed trap in many states and is prohibited there. In California it is prohibited as well, but one reporter doing a "ride along" in a helicopter stated it is used there contrary to its own legislature
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Old September 8th, 2008, 04:58 AM   #2882
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Hehe I didn't know that I saw these while driving on Highway 401 here in Ontario a month ago and by looking at the odometer noticed that they are spaced exactly 500 m apart, but didn't know that they are used for speed measurement from the air
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Old September 8th, 2008, 06:58 AM   #2883
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I actually like aerial speed enforcement and prefer it to radar-based enforcement, since you actually have a human accuser that you can face in court. The evidence is much more legally solid as well. You never know if the radar or laser is just being weird that day; it's a little more difficult to say that the stopwatch wasn't working properly.

Besides, according to an article I read on Ohio (a state known for its aggressive state police) aerial enforcement, they're much more prone to ticket people for unsafe driving, such as cutting drivers off and tailgating, to just simple excess speed in the clear. They say that looking at the big picture, it makes more sense to do that than just going after whoever's going over 65 mph.
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Old September 8th, 2008, 09:25 AM   #2884
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Interesting sign. It was in the news yesterday in the Netherlands that over 2/3rd of the truck accidents were caused by car drivers.
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Old September 8th, 2008, 04:13 PM   #2885
Alex Von Königsberg
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Washington state likes to make such interesting signs Also, there are plenty of similar signs that read "Fender bender? Drive to the shoulder" or "Fender bender? Drive across the bridge to the shoulder" encouraging people not to block motorway lanes because of a minor accident.

This sign is from Indiana but is very similar to that used in Washington:

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Old September 8th, 2008, 11:30 PM   #2886
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I found myself putting more room between myself and trucks after seeing this sign, out of prudence and decency rather than fear of being pulled over.

There are a lot of non-English speakers around here, but surely anyone can understand the green arrow and "OK."

OT: Thanks for the replies-- I was hoping for more, but that post was pretty impenetrable. I just edited it for readability-- let me know (by PM, so as not to clutter the thread) what you think.

Last edited by Tom 958; September 8th, 2008 at 11:54 PM. Reason: addendum
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Old September 9th, 2008, 12:21 AM   #2887
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom 958 View Post
Seems a better solution to me than ordinary big lights. I wouldn't use it in the day-time though.
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Old September 9th, 2008, 01:57 AM   #2888
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
Seems a better solution to me than ordinary big lights. I wouldn't use it in the day-time though.
Seems like overkill to me. A standard curve warning sign with a speed advisory tab and chevron-type signs on the curve itself should've been sufficient. Maybe rumble strips, too, if there's that much concern. And a crash barrier to prevent overspeeding vehicles from going into the GA 20 roadway.

The only other place I remember seeing this treatment was at three modified single point interchanges on GA 141. I'm too lazy to post a pic, but here's the Google Map link for the southernmost one; the arrows on the map are very helpful in seeing what's going on there.The intersections are efficient, but confusing, and are located under large bridges so they're dark all of the time. When the left turn arrows came on, so did lights in the pavement showing which way to go. It was quite a show, actually. The lights were green at first, but were later changed to white.

The lights were hard to maintain and IIRC no longer work (I'll check next time I'm there), but in the couple of years that they lasted I think they trained enough motorists so that almost anyone who doesn't know what to do there can fake it by imitating someone who does.
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Old September 9th, 2008, 02:29 AM   #2889
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom 958 View Post
Seems like overkill to me.
In fact I'll agree with you here, it's just that some countries fully light all their exits, so I think this is better (more discrete, which is your point after all) than ordinary big lights on poles.
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Old September 9th, 2008, 04:34 AM   #2890
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
In fact I'll agree with you here, it's just that some countries fully light all their exits, so I think this is better (more discrete, which is your point after all) than ordinary big lights on poles.
True, but the problem here is that the ramp is long and straight but with a surprise sharp curve at the end. I don't think lighting alone is either necessary or sufficient to address the problem. I'm also wondering whether there was a bad accident here that prompted the installation of this unusual treatment.

OT: Don't ask me why, but a few days ago I was reviewing the old thread and discovered that that I never answered this post about chain link fenced bridge rails and their anti-suicide/homicide aspects.


Better late than never: A few years ago in Atlanta there was a spate of people threatening suicide by jumping off of freeway bridges. IIRC nobody died or even actually jumped, but the ensuing traffic jams were horrific. So for a couple of years there was a program to fit anti-suicide barriers on freeway bridges, especially in and near downtown. Though there are many locations that never got them, there hasn't been another jumper in quite some time.

Plus, every few years somebody throws a heavy object off a bridge and kills someone, though this tends to happen more in rural areas where this type of barrier is rarely used.

To me, the strange thing about all of this is that there's enough of a concern to address the problem sporadically, but not consistently-- other types of barriers are still being used in some cases.

Last edited by Tom 958; September 9th, 2008 at 04:35 AM. Reason: typo
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Old September 9th, 2008, 03:58 PM   #2891
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Ok, thanks for the answer.
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Old September 9th, 2008, 06:56 PM   #2892
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
In fact I'll agree with you here, it's just that some countries fully light all their exits, so I think this is better (more discrete, which is your point after all) than ordinary big lights on poles.
If these things actually light up, then they probably are overkill, but if they are just passive reflectors, I think they should ideally be installed on all roads, although I personally think they are needed on dark 2-lane roads and not on motorways. In Israel many such roads have reflectors along the outer edges (and sometimes in the middle as well), and it's great.

In Ontario they sometimes put blue reflectors like this on tight curves on provincial 2-lane highways, but not commonly. A few weeks ago I drove on a bunch of country roads near Lake Ontario while coming from a beach, and some roads were pretty bad - while turning left I only knew that there was a road approximately to the left of me, but couldn't see anything at all (it was completely dark) until my car was fully turned with its headlights facing the intersecting road.
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Old September 9th, 2008, 07:29 PM   #2893
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^ Yeah, you must be quite slow and careful on most 2-lane roads at night.
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Old September 10th, 2008, 12:04 AM   #2894
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
^ Yeah, you must be quite slow and careful on most 2-lane roads at night.
A contact of mine at Georgia DOT told me that, overall, reflectors don't improve safety because they make it easier to drive too fast for conditions. But I like them anyway, as do most motorists.
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Old September 10th, 2008, 01:23 AM   #2895
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Reflectors are standard on practically every road in Washington. I can't think of a road off the top of my head that doesn't have reflectors.
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Old September 10th, 2008, 06:32 AM   #2896
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I thought there was a problem with snowplows tearing them out of the pavement? You almost never see the reflectors in Wisconsin.
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Old September 10th, 2008, 11:39 AM   #2897
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Aren't they called "Botts dotts" or something? You see them everywhere in urban California.
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Old September 10th, 2008, 03:57 PM   #2898
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^ Botts' dots aren't reflective, they aren't lights.
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Old September 10th, 2008, 06:02 PM   #2899
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I noticed this freeway in St. Louis, the SR-364, which carries 48.000 vehicles a day, but has an insane 12 lanes! Why the hell is that?
(this picture shows the 10-lane section).
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Old September 10th, 2008, 06:39 PM   #2900
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom 958
OT: Don't ask me why, but a few days ago I was reviewing the old thread and discovered that that I never answered this post about chain link fenced bridge rails and their anti-suicide/homicide aspects.
You'll see these fences more and more in the Netherlands since "stonethrowing" has become so popular here by some sick youth.
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