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Old June 9th, 2012, 07:41 PM   #8081
ChrisZwolle
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The people who live in New York County (i.e. Manhattan).
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Old June 9th, 2012, 08:30 PM   #8082
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Public transportation is for suckers.
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Old June 9th, 2012, 08:34 PM   #8083
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I think public transport is very useful in dense cities, but it's an absolute waste of public resources to force public transport in low-density areas (i.e. 80% of urban U.S.) where it should be a social minimum instead of tax money-guzzling facilities. Did you know that for every $ 2.75 fare (the highest fare possible) of the Capital MetroRail in Austin the tax payer has to add at least $ 19.00 just to cover the operational expenses? (which are $ 21.75 per daily passenger) You can hardly justify such practices.
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Old June 10th, 2012, 03:50 AM   #8084
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
The people who live in New York County (i.e. Manhattan).
Manhattan is the county ,there is no NY county....
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Old June 10th, 2012, 03:52 AM   #8085
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
I think public transport is very useful in dense cities, but it's an absolute waste of public resources to force public transport in low-density areas (i.e. 80% of urban U.S.) where it should be a social minimum instead of tax money-guzzling facilities. Did you know that for every $ 2.75 fare (the highest fare possible) of the Capital MetroRail in Austin the tax payer has to add at least $ 19.00 just to cover the operational expenses? (which are $ 21.75 per daily passenger) You can hardly justify such practices.
But highways have no financial return , so why should rail have a financial return....it doesn't matter with Texas because in 20 years that area will be dense....
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Old June 10th, 2012, 04:07 AM   #8086
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Manhattan is the county ,there is no NY county....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_County,_New_York
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Old June 10th, 2012, 04:17 AM   #8087
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Odd , I thought it was NY county...
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Old June 10th, 2012, 06:38 AM   #8088
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Quote:
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High density and high mass transit usage is not a solution to shorter travel times, quite the opposite actually. Manhattan (34 square miles) has longer average commuting times than Los Angeles County (4750 square miles), not to mention less congested and more sprawled out cities like Dallas or Houston.

93% of Atlanta's employment is outside the Downtown / Uptown area and that is why mass transit will never reduce travel times or even provide a remotely competitive mode of transport to the car. Right now there's a bill on the table to spend over 50% of transportation funding to mass transit, which 1% of the population uses. Of course, transit-advocates will say this is a smart way to spend public resources.
All I have to say is "A4". *drops mic and walks off stage*
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Old June 10th, 2012, 12:09 PM   #8089
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Quote:
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All I have to say is "A4". *drops mic and walks off stage*
What does that actually have to do with it? I'm guessing you're pro-PT. Well, if you think the 700 million for the A4 (will be used by 100.000+ cars everyday) is much: have a look at some (failed) PT plans in NL.

All I have to say is Noord-Zuid lijn, Betuweroute, HSL. Want more?

And the A4 is currently U/C
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Old June 11th, 2012, 04:10 AM   #8090
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Public transportation is for suckers.
In most of America, yes. But in Manhattan, driving is for suckers.
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Old June 11th, 2012, 04:42 AM   #8091
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In most of America, yes. But in Manhattan, driving is for suckers.
In the Coastal Northeast PT tops the car...and has been growing a rapid pace since 2000...about to overtake 1940 usage which was the peak....of PT in the US....driving continues to go down....mainly due to gas and a few other things like Toll increases in NY , NJ and PA , Generation Y isn't driving all that much , the Economy is still so bad that owning a car is not worth it anymore ....and congestion has gotten so bad into certain cities that driving in isn't worth it , PT has also slowly been restored to its peak size which was before 1960..... Biking has also gone up... The car could be knocked down number two for commuting by 2020 if everything keeps climbing the way it is...at least in the Coastal Northeast. Several cities are building or enhancing there networks and connecting them to other cities...so you can go just about anywhere by PT.... I could care less what some of the Europeans think the Northeast should have and shouldn't have...so don't even try to knock down our systems... Yes there not as big , there growing , yes ridership often doesn't cover half the Metro's population although that's changing....
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Old June 11th, 2012, 04:48 AM   #8092
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Define "coastal Northeast".
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Old June 11th, 2012, 04:49 AM   #8093
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What are HOV lanes?
You have to have a minimum number of persons on a car to travel on them?!
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Old June 11th, 2012, 04:52 AM   #8094
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In the Coastal Northeast PT tops the car...and has been growing a rapid pace since 2000...about to overtake 1940 usage which was the peak....of PT in the US...
Misleading comparison because population in the area was half of present numbers in 1940.
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Old June 11th, 2012, 05:01 AM   #8095
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Define "coastal Northeast".
Bos-Wash corridor , where most of us live , work , and relax ...of course by 2050 it will be called the Portland-NOVA corridor...it also extends inland to cities like Springfield , Worcester , Manchester , Harrisburg , Lehigh Valley , Northern Delaware....if you take the current population of this corridor which is 44 Million and you factor in how many use PT which is 26 Million....then you already have a decent chunk of the Population. Of course when you break down region by region with the different systems , its only half or slightly less then half of the metro Population but its still alot of people. And usage continues to grow like I said above...
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Old June 11th, 2012, 05:03 AM   #8096
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Misleading comparison because population in the area was half of present numbers in 1940.
and , then the numbers should be lower....they are not....
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Old June 11th, 2012, 05:07 AM   #8097
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Bos-Wash corridor , where most of us live , work , and relax ...of course by 2050 it will be called the Portland-NOVA corridor...it also extends inland to cities like Springfield , Worcester , Manchester , Harrisburg , Lehigh Valley , Northern Delaware....if you take the current population of this corridor which is 44 Million and you factor in how many use PT which is 26 Million....then you already have a decent chunk of the Population. Of course when you break down region by region with the different systems , its only half or slightly less then half of the metro Population but its still alot of people. And usage continues to grow like I said above...
I find it hard to believe that 26 million people use transit in the corridors you mentioned, but if you have any sources, that would be nice. Either way, plenty of people who take public transportation also have cars, it's not really an either or situation.
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Old June 11th, 2012, 05:10 AM   #8098
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In most of America, yes. But in Manhattan, driving is for suckers.
Not to mention that driving (especially the challenge of finding a parking space to begin with) is a challenge in a few other US cities as well. The cities of Boston, DC, Philadelphia, Chicago, San Francisco, and New Orleans are a few examples which come to mind.
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Old June 11th, 2012, 05:20 AM   #8099
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I find it hard to believe that 26 million people use transit in the corridors you mentioned, but if you have any sources, that would be nice. Either way, plenty of people who take public transportation also have cars, it's not really an either or situation.
Its actually 19.4 Million....I used the wrong APTA numbers...it could be slightly higher i only did the major systems...it could rise to 38.6 Million by 2030 due to Gas and Population increases... NYC alone is 10 million , the suburbs NJ - NY - CT another 3 million...includes the Satilite cities like Newark , Stamford , etc

http://www.apta.com/resources/statis...rship-APTA.pdf
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Old June 11th, 2012, 05:21 AM   #8100
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Not to mention that driving (especially the challenge of finding a parking space to begin with) is a challenge in a few other US cities as well. The cities of Boston, DC, Philadelphia, Chicago, San Francisco, and New Orleans are a few examples which come to mind.
I didn't realize New Orleans was that bad , whats the issue with the Big Easy?
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Last edited by Nexis; June 11th, 2012 at 05:48 AM.
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