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Old December 29th, 2005, 11:38 AM   #301
JDRS
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Justme, I seem to remember something I heard on the news with critiscism of the way all the trains shut over christmas day and boxing day. I'll try and find the news story later.

Another question, do drivers only work on a particular train, area of the line or line. Or do they work all over London, driving various trains?
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Old December 29th, 2005, 12:44 PM   #302
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JDRS
Shocking story Tubeman...glad you didn't derail

The train between Chalfont and Latimer completely stopped today just before pulling into Chesham station and we had to wait for over half an hour while the driver tried everything to move the train forward. Eventually they managed to move the front of the train very slowly onto part of the platform and everyone had to walk up to the only set of open doors on the platform. I think he was driving it manually after we started moving again as it was very very slow and another driver had to be at the other end of the train for some reason?
It sounds like a classic 'No Movement' defect; often the only way movement can be achieved it by getting an assisting driver to drive in reverse from the rear cab. Was it snowy up there? If yes, that was probably thre culprit; even with a very light dusting after a few hundred yards snow gets compacted under the current collection 'shoes' essentially cutting off the electricity supply to the front car. Eventually the batteries (which provide a 50V DC suplly for the power & control circuits) go flat and the train 'dies'. It would still be possible to achieve movement from the rear cab, as the 'shoes' at the back of the train should be ice-free.
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Old December 29th, 2005, 12:51 PM   #303
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redstone
Tubeman

Don't know if this had been asked. Was always wondering.

The MRT (subway) here has another track on the inside of the tracks the wheels run on. And this double track is only at elevated sections.

Why? What is it for?

Thanks!
Hmm... not too sure what you mean, have you a photo illustrating it?

All railway tracks rounding a tight radius curve has a 'check rail'; another running rail a flange width away from the running rail. The flange sits between the normal running rail and the check rail, it makes the train less likely to derail.

What is the MRT power supply? I've been on it, but with the platform edge doors its impossible to see whether its overhead or 3rd rail.

Check Rail:

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Old December 29th, 2005, 12:55 PM   #304
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JDRS
Justme, I seem to remember something I heard on the news with critiscism of the way all the trains shut over christmas day and boxing day. I'll try and find the news story later.

Another question, do drivers only work on a particular train, area of the line or line. Or do they work all over London, driving various trains?
Thanks JDRS, I'd be interesting in reading the story.

We were planning to stay in a hotel in central London, and just travel up to Hemel for Xmas day, natually presuming that the trains would be operating - at least on a reduced schedule. It was only the last minute when we changed our minds to stay actually in Hemel Hempstead.

If we had stayed in central London, we would have had to get a taxi to Hemel and that would have been damn expensive.
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Old December 29th, 2005, 12:57 PM   #305
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justme
Having spent Xmas in and around London, I have another question for you Tubeman.

Why do all Rail services shut at Christmas? London is a major city, and I don't know of any city, major or minor outside of Britain that has no services on Xmas Day.

How do people get around if they don't have a car? It seemed all public transport was shut down that day.

And to make it even more bizarre, there were no mainline rail services on Boxing Day either. My girlfriend and I were in Hemel Hempstead on Boxing day, planning a day in London, and all Mainline train services were closed. Fortunately, I got a lift to Watford underground station but then found that closed as well. We had to get to Rickmansworth before we could find a limited service into London.

It was quite amazing. If we couldn't have got that lift into Rickmansworth there would have been no way to travel into London (even the coaches were closed), and this is totally amazing for one of the top three cities in the world.

I work in IT, and have to work some Xmas's. If not, you would have no Internet Xmas day. There are plenty of other businesses operating, and people need to get to work, as well as people who have the day off, need to reach their relatives for the festivities.

How long has this been the norm, and will National Rail and the Underground wake up and realize it's quite embarrassing?
We used to run an Xmas Day service, but it was pathetically under-used and then withdrawn. I think its quite nice really... Londoners take it as read they can't use the Tube on Xmas Day... even our weedy Boxing Day service is very lightly used. If you don't drive (like me) you have to sit indoors and get drunk... not bad really!

I suppose eventually one day there'll be a Christmas Day service, but it is nice that one day of the year all the transport workers can be guaranteed a day off.
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Old December 29th, 2005, 01:22 PM   #306
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tubeman
We used to run an Xmas Day service, but it was pathetically under-used and then withdrawn. I think its quite nice really... Londoners take it as read they can't use the Tube on Xmas Day... even our weedy Boxing Day service is very lightly used. If you don't drive (like me) you have to sit indoors and get drunk... not bad really!

I suppose eventually one day there'll be a Christmas Day service, but it is nice that one day of the year all the transport workers can be guaranteed a day off.
You know, I can appreciate people having a day off. I enjoyed having Xmas off this year but to be honest there are some services which should run at Xmas day.

Imagine if other services also shut down.

No TV,
No electricity
No Internet
No Radio
No Flights
No Taxi's
No Water or Gas
No Emergency services
No Petrol stations open
No Hotels
etc

Public Transport is a vital service and no less than any of the above. Natually, a reduced service would be all that is required, but it is still needed.

I am wondering how all those people who work to keep the TV, electricity etc running got to workplace, and how many families struggled to get together because there were no services at all available.

It seems to work in other country's, as I have never heard of any other nation shutting down their transportation around Xmas. It's as foreign to imagine as Britain having no electricity on Xmas day as the workers at Power Stations also need a holiday.

Keep in mind, I also work in a 24/7 365 day a year industry, so it's not like I don't understand the implications.
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Old December 29th, 2005, 01:26 PM   #307
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justme
Thanks JDRS, I'd be interesting in reading the story.

We were planning to stay in a hotel in central London, and just travel up to Hemel for Xmas day, natually presuming that the trains would be operating - at least on a reduced schedule. It was only the last minute when we changed our minds to stay actually in Hemel Hempstead.

If we had stayed in central London, we would have had to get a taxi to Hemel and that would have been damn expensive.
Here's the article:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article...952869,00.html

By the way did you stay at the new hotel in hemel hempstead, I'm not sure if it is open yet?
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Old December 29th, 2005, 02:43 PM   #308
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JDRS
Here's the article:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article...952869,00.html

By the way did you stay at the new hotel in hemel hempstead, I'm not sure if it is open yet?
Thanks JDRS. Yes, it's so bizarre and the article nailed it on the head (Many thanks for the link!). I can tell you my girlfriend was rather pleased in a way. I often point out how so many things in Britain operate at better hours or services than Germany, Sunday Shopping, 24 hour giant supermarkets with delivery to your home within 1 hour from the time you purchase on the internet etc etc, but here she had one to tell all her friends and family - A tiny German village has a better train service on Xmas day that mighty London... I get red in the face from embarrassment just thinking about it, and I'm not even British.

By new hotel, I presume you mean the Quality Inn in the town center. Unfortunately, this opens in February. I would have booked it otherwise. Instead I stayed in the relatively new Holiday Inn Express (opened 2004) opposite Apsley Station. It was very good value (£39 per night for double room) although run by a couple of chavs at reception on Xmas and Boxing Day

"Is there any way to get to Watford, as I need a train to London?"

"Like, am I bothered?"

"Do you have a map or bus timetable for the holiday season"

"Like, of cause we have a table, duh"
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Old December 30th, 2005, 01:12 AM   #309
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Will rubbish bins come back to platforms outdoor stations again (Underground)? North Acton is one that had rubbish bins up to 7/7 that I can think of.
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Old December 30th, 2005, 01:47 AM   #310
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Quote:
Originally Posted by samsonyuen
Will rubbish bins come back to platforms outdoor stations again (Underground)? North Acton is one that had rubbish bins up to 7/7 that I can think of.
They were all removed after the IRA left a bomb in a bin at Victoria Station c1990... 7/7 had nothing to do with it (you can't ban men carrying rucksacks!).

A style of bin that had been introduced was a metal ring supporting a clear sack; we have these at Earl's Court; I'm not aware of their withdrawal.
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Old December 30th, 2005, 03:21 AM   #311
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Sir Knob-twiddler: ()

Did you ever give cab rides when you were a driver?

What's the penalty for drivers who give out cab rides these days? (I'm assuming the policy is: no way jose in this day and age).

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Old December 30th, 2005, 10:06 AM   #312
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Ok, here's another one I was wondering about.

Pricing.

Why is it, an offpeak day trip from Hemel Hempstead to London costs around £12.50 and includes the return from Hemel to London, plus all bus, train, Underground, DLR within zones 1 to 6 for the whole day, yet if I was to get an off-peak single from London to Hemel, it costs more than the Travel Card? I don’t even want to mention how much a return costs?

And on the same note, when I had to get that Underground in from Rickmansworth, it was a 6 zone travel card for all bus, train, tube, DLR for £6.xx half the price from Hemel, yet Hemel is only 15minutes drive away, or 4minutes from Watford by train. Why does the price double?
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Old December 30th, 2005, 02:15 PM   #313
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tayser
Sir Knob-twiddler: ()

Did you ever give cab rides when you were a driver?

What's the penalty for drivers who give out cab rides these days? (I'm assuming the policy is: no way jose in this day and age).

Yeah a couple of mates and wayward family members got lifts when I spotted them on various platforms. Its highly illegal, of course, but its not as if I let them drive or anything!

It can be arranged though, I'd just need to apply for a cab pass for whoever... My Nephew will get a day out on the trains when he's a little older (he's three now).
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Old December 30th, 2005, 02:20 PM   #314
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justme
Ok, here's another one I was wondering about.

Pricing.

Why is it, an offpeak day trip from Hemel Hempstead to London costs around £12.50 and includes the return from Hemel to London, plus all bus, train, Underground, DLR within zones 1 to 6 for the whole day, yet if I was to get an off-peak single from London to Hemel, it costs more than the Travel Card? I don’t even want to mention how much a return costs?

And on the same note, when I had to get that Underground in from Rickmansworth, it was a 6 zone travel card for all bus, train, tube, DLR for £6.xx half the price from Hemel, yet Hemel is only 15minutes drive away, or 4minutes from Watford by train. Why does the price double?
The pricing is a nonsense; a return is normally like 10p more than a single etc, so per mile a return is half the price of a single. I couldn't begin to explain the intricacies of the pricing on Network Rail, I think a lot of journeys might be capped or subsidised.

That being said, there are some great deals out there... the Super Apex means you can travel the length of the country for £30-£40 return... A good example is my ticket to St Ives in Cornwall; its a 10 hour round trip but only costs £32 return. Leeds is around £20 return, Newcastle £30 and Scotland £40. You just need to book 2 weeks in advance.
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Old December 30th, 2005, 02:32 PM   #315
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tubeman
The pricing is a nonsense; a return is normally like 10p more than a single etc, so per mile a return is half the price of a single. I couldn't begin to explain the intricacies of the pricing on Network Rail, I think a lot of journeys might be capped or subsidised.

That being said, there are some great deals out there... the Super Apex means you can travel the length of the country for £30-£40 return... A good example is my ticket to St Ives in Cornwall; its a 10 hour round trip but only costs £32 return. Leeds is around £20 return, Newcastle £30 and Scotland £40. You just need to book 2 weeks in advance.
It's another reason why at least the inner metro surrounding London should be included in a comprehensive pricing scheme for London. It costs a fortune to commute from just outside the GLA. That £12.50 from Hemel is offpeak, and Hemel Hempstead station takes the same time into central London than Rickmansworth on the tube which is half the price.

So, I just can't understand why someone should pay double for Hemel.

Anyway, thanks for your answer Tubeman
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Old December 30th, 2005, 05:32 PM   #316
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tubeman
They were all removed after the IRA left a bomb in a bin at Victoria Station c1990... 7/7 had nothing to do with it (you can't ban men carrying rucksacks!).

A style of bin that had been introduced was a metal ring supporting a clear sack; we have these at Earl's Court; I'm not aware of their withdrawal.
The rubbish bins you talk of with the metal ring and clear sack were along the metropolitan line stations I use prior to 7/7 but ever since then they've been removed everywhere?
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Old December 30th, 2005, 09:19 PM   #317
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JDRS
The rubbish bins you talk of with the metal ring and clear sack were along the metropolitan line stations I use prior to 7/7 but ever since then they've been removed everywhere?
Fair enough... shows how observant I am
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Old December 30th, 2005, 09:44 PM   #318
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Why don't they put the Thameslink on tube maps? It's almost a tube line...
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Old December 30th, 2005, 09:49 PM   #319
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dont they? at least the central portion.
Actually, a check on Tfl and it wasnt there.... I second samsonyuen's question
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Old December 30th, 2005, 10:47 PM   #320
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dont they? at least the central portion.
Actually, a check on Tfl and it wasnt there.... I second samsonyuen's question
Its been and gone, just like the North London Line has

I think its better to either show all suburban mainline or none, showing the odd scrap looks messy. I'd quite like to see all of the suburban mainline network with 4+ trains per hour terminating within Greater London on the map.

Why should Amersham appear with a train every 20 minutes off-peak, but not Clapham Junction with a train every 30 seconds? It illogical... With the new trains and better frequencies I think the suburban network of south London is something to be proud of, it should appear on the 'Tube' Map.
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