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Old February 22nd, 2009, 04:47 PM   #3461
iampuking
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It's good in that you get a sense of the complexity, but it's not particularly accurate...
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Old February 22nd, 2009, 08:10 PM   #3462
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...The East London Line extension continues apace... Some track being laid through the site of the former Shoreditch station (NLR, not the ELL one), but still some gaps in the viaduct:

[IMG]http://i41.************/2yxrdq8.jpg[/IMG]
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Old February 23rd, 2009, 10:38 PM   #3463
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New rolling stock

Pardon an out-of-touch Yankee, but I was wondering what the latest release dates for any of the new rolling stock for London's system. Been spending too much time in NYC's system and webstes.
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Old February 24th, 2009, 01:15 AM   #3464
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Pardon an out-of-touch Yankee, but I was wondering what the latest release dates for any of the new rolling stock for London's system. Been spending too much time in NYC's system and webstes.
Well the DLR stock is being rolled out right now, the Overground stock is slowly being rolled out as well I believe, although I'm not sure if they're in passenger service. They will be very soon.

The Victoria Line stock will also be arriving soon enough.

After that it'd be the Javelin trains for the CRTL and then it's the SSL stock. I may be missing out on a few here, though.
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Old February 26th, 2009, 12:47 PM   #3465
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What are your thoughts on Tim O'Toole stepping down, Tubeman? Did you ever meet him in your job? Everyone seems to think he's done an amazing job and it'll be hard to replace him.
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Old February 26th, 2009, 09:43 PM   #3466
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What are your thoughts on Tim O'Toole stepping down, Tubeman? Did you ever meet him in your job? Everyone seems to think he's done an amazing job and it'll be hard to replace him.
Genuinely gutted, he is an inspirational leader / speaker and will be an enormous loss to LU and London. If we can find half the man to fill his shoes we'd be lucky. I do believe he's left a tangible legacy which will positively affect LU for years to come, but losing him just before the next round of pay talks and at a time when we are trying to re-absorb Metronet amidst a huge financial crisis is bad timing for me.
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Old February 26th, 2009, 09:55 PM   #3467
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What do you know about talks to extend the Bakerloo like south of Elephant & Castle? Seems to be a few rumours flying around that the Crossrail TBMs could be retained and put to use on further extending this line.

http://london-underground.blogspot.c...extension.html
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Old February 27th, 2009, 02:41 AM   #3468
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Crossrail TBMs will be far too big... won't they?

Look at the relative sizes here. Why would the Bakerloo line, which uses tube sized stock, require anything bigger than that of on the Jubilee line?

Boris is just talking shite. As usual.
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Old February 27th, 2009, 06:17 AM   #3469
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iampuking View Post
Crossrail TBMs will be far too big... won't they?

Look at the relative sizes here. Why would the Bakerloo line, which uses tube sized stock, require anything bigger than that of on the Jubilee line?

Boris is just talking shite. As usual.
That's what I was thinking... unless the TBM's could be adapted, or the tunnels could be used to carry more than one line... (talking shite now)
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Old February 27th, 2009, 11:45 AM   #3470
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Yeah I'll echo all that... My recollection of the JLE TBMs is that they just turn them to one side and bury them when the two meet... My understanding is that a TBM is wider than the tunnel lining behind it (because it excavates a wider diameter than the finished tunnel to allow for the lining to be put in place) and therefore cannot be extracted without being dismantled. And yes, the Crossrail tunnels will be far wider than the BLE tunnels would have to be, even with a JLE-style walkway.

Crossrail 1 will suck money out of London's transport developments for a couple of decades to come, to be blunt if any Bakerloo southern extension opens before 2030 I'll eat my hat.
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Old February 27th, 2009, 11:52 AM   #3471
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Quote:
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Crossrail 1 will suck money out of London's transport developments for a couple of decades to come, to be blunt if any Bakerloo southern extension opens before 2030 I'll eat my hat.
after Crossrail opens, they'd have to build the things that got shelved due to Crossrail - Crystal Palace tram, etc.
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Old February 27th, 2009, 07:08 PM   #3472
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Found a photo of the new 'S' Stock for the Sub-Surface lines being moved from Derby to Old Dalby test track. This will be the first LU train to have air-conditioning throughout and be fully walkthrough.

Pics here and here.
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Old February 28th, 2009, 12:28 PM   #3473
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iampuking View Post
Found a photo of the new 'S' Stock for the Sub-Surface lines being moved from Derby to Old Dalby test track. This will be the first LU train to have air-conditioning throughout and be fully walkthrough.

Pics here and here.
Great find... they look 'kin smart!

...And the fact there's most definitely 8 cars in that train proves that there isn't going to be a universal 7-car compromise length for all of SSR, so I guess it will be 8 cars Met / 7 cars District / 6 cars for the current C Stock routes.
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Old February 28th, 2009, 05:57 PM   #3474
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Hopefully the C Stock routes will be upgraded to 7 cars though... Even if it means doors will be cut out at a few stations.

I'm also baffled why the train appears to have yellow poles... It's 8 cars and therefore will solely run on the Metropolitan line, purple poles would make it more distinguishable from Circle/H&C trains at stations where they share tracks and would create a more noticeable contrast between the white of the interior for the DDA.
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Old February 28th, 2009, 11:28 PM   #3475
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Why do they move the trains with those tank looking carriages at each end of the consist?
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Old March 1st, 2009, 01:58 AM   #3476
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Why do they move the trains with those tank looking carriages at each end of the consist?
Well they say barrier wagon on them. Googling for that found explanations about carrying dangerous materials. Whats dangrous about a tube train though?! Another website mentioned something about using barrier wagons because of compatibility of couplings. Maybe they just wanted to make sure if anything crashed into it the tube train would be ok!!
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Old March 1st, 2009, 08:19 AM   #3477
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Tubeman, this might sound like a stupid question coming from an entirely uneducated person. But.

How many carriages do tube trains usually have? It depends on the line, doesn't it? I remember reading that the Victoria and Northern Lines have the longest trains, but I have a shocking memory so I could be wrong.

Is the district line ever going to get new trains and a possible revamp? The District Line makes Baby Jesus cry.
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Old March 1st, 2009, 10:47 AM   #3478
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...

Is the district line ever going to get new trains and a possible revamp? The District Line makes Baby Jesus cry.
District line stock is getting replaced with the S stock which is pictured above. But the Met, Hammersmith and City/Circle get new stock first so it will be some years before the District line sees them.

Having said that how long since you have rode a D stock on the district line? All the cars have been refurbished, the last only within the last 6-12 months and are quite nice inside. The problems (delays etc) with the district line don't seem to be cause by the rolling stock but just the complexity of operation, especially around Earls Court.
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Old March 1st, 2009, 10:50 AM   #3479
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iampuking View Post
Hopefully the C Stock routes will be upgraded to 7 cars though... Even if it means doors will be cut out at a few stations.

I'm also baffled why the train appears to have yellow poles... It's 8 cars and therefore will solely run on the Metropolitan line, purple poles would make it more distinguishable from Circle/H&C trains at stations where they share tracks and would create a more noticeable contrast between the white of the interior for the DDA.
I think yellow is 'officially' the most visible colour for grabrails to the partially sighted, hence why it was chosen for the 95 & 96 Stocks (obviously line-coded grey and black wouldn't have been much good!). I assume there will be some form of movement between SSR lines from time to time so it is better to just have one universal stock interior regardless of the line. I don't know the formation, but logically the S Stocks will be produced in 3 and 4 car units such that the Met would be 4+4, District 4+3 and former C Stock routes 3+3.
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Old March 1st, 2009, 11:07 AM   #3480
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Tubeman, this might sound like a stupid question coming from an entirely uneducated person. But.

How many carriages do tube trains usually have? It depends on the line, doesn't it? I remember reading that the Victoria and Northern Lines have the longest trains, but I have a shocking memory so I could be wrong.

Is the district line ever going to get new trains and a possible revamp? The District Line makes Baby Jesus cry.
I'm sure I've explained this before but here goes...

There are 2 approximate different car lengths on LU, I'll refer to them as 'short' and 'long'... a 'long' car is approx 15% longer than a 'short' car such that a 6-car train of 'short' cars (e.g. a Circle / H&C / Wimbleware C Stock) is only as long as 5 'long' cars (e.g. District D Stock), this is apparent when you see C and D stocks standing alongside each other at Wimbledon.

So, in actual length (to the best of my recollection)...

Metropolitan A Stock = 8 short
Victoria 67 Stock = 8 short
Central 92 Stock = 8 short

District D Stock = 6 long
Piccadilly 73 Stock = 6 long

Bakerloo 72 Stock = 7 short
Jubilee 96 Stock = 7 short

Northern 95 Stock = 6 short
Circle / C&H / Wimbleware C Stock = 6 short

Waterloo & City 92 Stock = 4 short

I think the Northern line stock might have a slightly longer car length than standard 'short' as it used to run 7 car 1959 Stocks ('short' cars) and now only runs 6, but with the 1959 stocks as a driver we'd always stop with the cab in the tunnel at most platforms and the rear cab would also be in the tunnel, whereas now the front cab is always on the platform and usually the rear cab too... I don't feel that the current stock is a whole car shorter in overall length than a 7-car '59.

The District Line D Stocks have all been refurbished and are very smart now, the C Stocks on the Edgware Rd - Wimbledon service are a bit tatty (they were the first refurb in the early 1990's).
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