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Old January 18th, 2006, 02:01 AM   #401
sfgadv02
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So I am planning to stay in London for 4 or 5 days in April. I was wondering what I should get? Should I get the Oyster card for £3 and just reload or should I get the 3-Day Travel Pass?? Since the Oyster card is refundable, would it be cheaper if I get that and just add value into them since most of the attraction is near Zone 1, so I would only be paying £1.50 per trip....as least from what I understand.

Also, If I do stay for 4 nights, should I get the 3-day travel pass and then the 1 day travel pass??
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Old January 18th, 2006, 04:29 AM   #402
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sfgadv02
So I am planning to stay in London for 4 or 5 days in April. I was wondering what I should get? Should I get the Oyster card for £3 and just reload or should I get the 3-Day Travel Pass?? Since the Oyster card is refundable, would it be cheaper if I get that and just add value into them since most of the attraction is near Zone 1, so I would only be paying £1.50 per trip....as least from what I understand.

Also, If I do stay for 4 nights, should I get the 3-day travel pass and then the 1 day travel pass??
Just get an Oyster; it automatically works out the cheapest fare for you and you can bring it back with you when you visit again
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Old January 18th, 2006, 05:16 AM   #403
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Thx, thats what I am thinking to get as well.
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Old January 18th, 2006, 11:09 AM   #404
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Get Oyster. Price capping makes sure you never pay more than a TravelCard. If you get TravelCards you might overpay for days where you do not travel as much as expected.
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Old January 18th, 2006, 01:21 PM   #405
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I'm a little confused on the Oyster for holiday's to London.

So, where do I buy it and how would I top it up?

The other problem is, if I stay in Hemel Hempstead, as I have family there. Would I then get a return to Watford (as a normal ticket) and then let the Oyster take over from there?
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Old January 18th, 2006, 01:53 PM   #406
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You can get Oyster at (almost?) any sales point and (almost?) every station has a machine to top it up, which you can do with cash, creditcard.. whatever you like! If you have a UK address you can even register it and top it up on-line before you go (next time).

If you travel to Hemel it is probably cheapest to indeed use the tube from/to Watford and then perhaps a bus into town. Mainline Euston-Hemel is (was?) £8.80 for a return ticket, so that's amazingly expensive. There is a nice walk into town though, past some horses, a creek, a cricket field and the wonderful magic roundabout.
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Old January 18th, 2006, 03:40 PM   #407
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Capzilla
You can get Oyster at (almost?) any sales point and (almost?) every station has a machine to top it up, which you can do with cash, creditcard.. whatever you like! If you have a UK address you can even register it and top it up on-line before you go (next time).

If you travel to Hemel it is probably cheapest to indeed use the tube from/to Watford and then perhaps a bus into town. Mainline Euston-Hemel is (was?) £8.80 for a return ticket, so that's amazingly expensive. There is a nice walk into town though, past some horses, a creek, a cricket field and the wonderful magic roundabout.
Thanks. Actually a day pass (off peak) from Hemel to Euston costs £12 or so. The same day travel card from Watford is £6. So, I was thinking of getting an Oyster card and then just a return from Hemel to Watford.
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Old January 18th, 2006, 03:46 PM   #408
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Oops, Silverlink doesn't accept Oyster all the way to Watford, so you'll need a ticket from Hemel to Harrow&Wealdstone. Or switch to the Metropolitan but that'll cost you a lot of time. That's the only downside of Oyster: BritRail barely accepts it. Can't blame LT for that one though.
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Old January 18th, 2006, 06:27 PM   #409
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Capzilla
Oops, Silverlink doesn't accept Oyster all the way to Watford, so you'll need a ticket from Hemel to Harrow&Wealdstone. Or switch to the Metropolitan but that'll cost you a lot of time. That's the only downside of Oyster: BritRail barely accepts it. Can't blame LT for that one though.
Its hopefully just a temporary issue; Network Rail will adopt a smartcard system and TFL are pushing for them to take up Oyster (they have other ideas at the moment!). TFL want to assume control of all of London's suburban rail, so hopefully the boundaries between LUL and NR in London will become increasingly blurred.
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Old January 18th, 2006, 08:26 PM   #410
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Why would Network Rail go for a different one, what would be the benefit of a different one? Wouldn't it make more sense to make all systems compatible? That way when more cities adopt a smart card system they could all be compatible, eventually you could travel around the whole uk with just one card, that would be good.
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Old January 18th, 2006, 08:42 PM   #411
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Capzilla
Get Oyster. Price capping makes sure you never pay more than a TravelCard. If you get TravelCards you might overpay for days where you do not travel as much as expected.
Exactly. In fact for me Oyster works out cheaper than before because the price now for using the tube and buses all day on it is £2.60 as if you're 16/17 you get child rates, which were £2.80 before the price rise.
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Old January 18th, 2006, 11:09 PM   #412
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew
Why would Network Rail go for a different one, what would be the benefit of a different one? Wouldn't it make more sense to make all systems compatible? That way when more cities adopt a smart card system they could all be compatible, eventually you could travel around the whole uk with just one card, that would be good.
It is the various franchise owners that have specified different ticketing technology as their tickets machines have needed updating. For example the new machines on the Kent commuter lines, have touch screens and chip and pin payment. There are a variety of different payment cards on offer and no one was keen on a monoply supplier. Franchise owners were not too keen on TFL having the whip hand on this.

The problem for the commuter operators is that in comparison to TFL's stations a lot of the smaller stations are lightly used and it would be expensive to put in oyster readers. For example the train station I use every morning to work is unmanned, It does not even have a ticket machine, just a permit to travel machine, which I exchange for a weekly pass when I get off at Richmond. At this station the trains between 7am and 8am are the only times there more than 5 people are on a platform. When I go to work on a Saturday I am often the only person at the station.
What if the reader is vandalised? how do you use the system then?

I can't remember the exact details but they are now supposed to have worked out a protocol where different ticketing systems should be able to talk to each other.
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Old January 19th, 2006, 01:59 AM   #413
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Hello Tubeman, heres a question for you.

With the piccadilly line i know that the original line was an amalgamation of two lines, which is why the Aldwich spur got built, but where were the two lines originally going?
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Old January 19th, 2006, 03:11 AM   #414
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James
Hello Tubeman, heres a question for you.

With the piccadilly line i know that the original line was an amalgamation of two lines, which is why the Aldwich spur got built, but where were the two lines originally going?
It was actually 3 lines...

The 3 bills had all separately passed through parliament and were all snapped up by Yerkes

The first was a deep-level express District Line from Barons Court to Mansion House, although only the Barons Court to South Kensington part of the bill was used. This is why there is a 'step plate' junction cavern immediately East of South Kensington; allowance was made for the original route to Mansion House to branch eastwards where the Piccadilly Line veers sharply to the north.

The second... I'm slightly unclear about what the enitre original bill entailed, but it was a line under Piccadilly. This accounts for Knightsbridge to Leicester Square on the Piccadilly Line, bit I'm unsure how far beyond these stations it was intended to go.

The third one explains the Aldwych branch. It was from Strand (Aldwych) to Finsbury Park, Aldwych always was the intended terminus, but extensions were proposed several times before closure (e.g. to waterloo).
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Old January 19th, 2006, 07:26 AM   #415
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Do you ever think that the Aldwych spur would ever be reused, as lets say an overflow tube line for Waterloo, as the tube lines currently serving Waterloo (from what i can see) are overloaded, then possibly further south?

And thanks for that... i always thought from what i read that the line was meant to go to waterloo and beyond.
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Old January 19th, 2006, 09:20 AM   #416
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James
Do you ever think that the Aldwych spur would ever be reused, as lets say an overflow tube line for Waterloo, as the tube lines currently serving Waterloo (from what i can see) are overloaded, then possibly further south?

And thanks for that... i always thought from what i read that the line was meant to go to waterloo and beyond.
The Aldwych Branch is still in use... for filming

A cast-off 1972 Mk1 train lives down there and trundles in and out of the platform as required. Its the train appearing on the cover of the film 'Creep' (although the film mostly used Charing Cross on the Jubilee Line).



The problem that always precluded the branch from being extended was the fact that it joined the Piccadilly Main Line facing north, i.e. away from the busiest section through the West End. If through trains were to be run onto the extended branch from Cockfosters then that would diminish the frequency West of Holborn to the 'core' of the Piccadilly Line between Holborn and South Kensington. If the branch joined the Picc main facing the other way (i.e. at Covent Garden as opposed to Holborn) then it would have been very different I suspect.

I think it will endure as film set for a few more decades, but as soon as the tunnel needs any sort of major overhaul or god forbid the 1972 Stock train languishing down there gives up the ghost then it'll be gone for good.
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Old January 19th, 2006, 03:12 PM   #417
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rational Plan
What if the reader is vandalised? how do you use the system then?
Just try Melbourne's suburban network if you want to see a network that works while ticket machines and validators get frequently vandalised. All you have to do is make it easy for everyone to get away with not paying in the first place.
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Old January 19th, 2006, 06:14 PM   #418
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Here's another question. Can you outline the different types of ticket available and the differences between them? Also, some lines go outside the Greater London boundary, do these sections still come under the same fare system and are they still under TFL jurisdiction?
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Old January 19th, 2006, 07:13 PM   #419
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Here's another question. Can you outline the different types of ticket available and the differences between them? Also, some lines go outside the Greater London boundary, do these sections still come under the same fare system and are they still under TFL jurisdiction?
Pretty simple really... Singles, Returns and Travelcards

Greater London is split into 6 concentric zones, and the cost of a single or return journey is worked out on the basis of these zones (i.e. a single between any zone 4 and zone 2 station should cost the same). That being said, there may be allowance if you're only travelling 1 stop but crossing a zone boundary.

Travelcards are available in several zone combinations including cheaper ones excluding zone 1 (the centre).

2 lines go beyond the GLA boundary; the Metropolitan and Central. Out here in Essex / Buckinghamshire zone 6 gives way to zones A, B and C, but a few years ago it was decided that Epping should be brought into Zone 6 so now the only line to which the additional zones apply is the Metropolitan.

These are essentially zones 7, 8 & 9 and fares are calculated in the same way, I'm not too sure why they weren't called as such. Maybe one day we will get 9 zones... If TFL take over the suburban lines in the London area there's a lot of routes which terminate just beyond the GLA boundary that could be zoned: Tattenham Corner, Epsom Downs, Hayes, Dartford, Grays etc.
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Old January 19th, 2006, 07:24 PM   #420
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On some earlier post en couple of links to geographicalmaps was posted (well it were bus maps but the subwaylines were drawn into it.) Does anybody know a site whith more of these maps? I'm looking for such maps of the Paris metro.

thanx-a-lot
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