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Old January 14th, 2013, 01:24 PM   #5161
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Here's me with Met No.1 yesterday while I was on steward duty

It was an awesome day, really enjoyed it. Believe it or not, it was the first time I'd ever been on a steam-hauled train.

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Old January 14th, 2013, 03:11 PM   #5162
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With all the preservated railways in the UK, this is your first steam train journey? Cool!
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Old January 15th, 2013, 12:16 AM   #5163
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Tubeman! You're much younger than I imagined! I completely forgot this was going on- I wish I'd remembered so that I could have seen it.

Also, re: N/L split- it won't until Camden, no?
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Old January 15th, 2013, 12:27 AM   #5164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davidaiow View Post
Tubeman! You're much younger than I imagined! I completely forgot this was going on- I wish I'd remembered so that I could have seen it.

Also, re: N/L split- it won't until Camden, no?
That's is correct as capacity and interchange is poor at Camden town.
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Old January 15th, 2013, 09:21 AM   #5165
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That's is correct as capacity and interchange is poor at Camden town.
As I understood it, one of the biggest passenger flow problems at Camden Town was people stopping to check the arrivals board to see which platform to head for thus clogging up the passageway. With separation of the lines they wouldn't need to do this anymore plus the track infrastructure is fine as it is.

I know Camden Town needs a rebuild because it is no longer fit for purpose but can the lines not be separated sooner?
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Old January 16th, 2013, 01:31 AM   #5166
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With all the preservated railways in the UK, this is your first steam train journey? Cool!
I know... To be honest I'm not a huge steam nut... but I got the bug a bit on Sunday. Steam preservation is making way a little for diesel now, as enthusiasts who actually grew up with steam die out. Diesel galas are becoming ever more popular.

I've said this elsewhere before, but I wish that the Epping-Ongar Railway was re-electrified and became a unique LT preserved railway. I'd love to ride 38 Stocks, A Stocks, and whatever else is still in working condition... Plus Met No.1 and the Chesham coaches / car 393 can become a permanent fixture, Sarah Siddons, etc...
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Old January 16th, 2013, 01:32 AM   #5167
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davidaiow View Post
Tubeman! You're much younger than I imagined! I completely forgot this was going on- I wish I'd remembered so that I could have seen it.

Also, re: N/L split- it won't until Camden, no?
It's happening again next Sunday 20th, let me know if you want the details of the train working (it'll be the evening only, nothing in daylight hours I'm afraid).
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Old January 16th, 2013, 06:13 PM   #5168
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Quote:
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I know... To be honest I'm not a huge steam nut... but I got the bug a bit on Sunday.
One can't escape the steam bug.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tubeman View Post
Steam preservation is making way a little for diesel now, as enthusiasts who actually grew up with steam die out. Diesel galas are becoming ever more popular.
That is a shame... I may be a huge diesel fan, but i am crazy about steam engines. I might not actually want to work in the cab of one, but seeing them flying down the line at high speed, blowing steam hundreds of feet up in the air... It's an indescribable feeling.

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I've said this elsewhere before, but I wish that the Epping-Ongar Railway was re-electrified and became a unique LT preserved railway. I'd love to ride 38 Stocks, A Stocks, and whatever else is still in working condition... Plus Met No.1 and the Chesham coaches / car 393 can become a permanent fixture, Sarah Siddons, etc...
That would be awesome. Might be a bit tight on space, but that could be fixed.
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Old January 17th, 2013, 11:25 PM   #5169
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It's happening again next Sunday 20th, let me know if you want the details of the train working (it'll be the evening only, nothing in daylight hours I'm afraid).
Will you be stewarding again Tubes?
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Old January 18th, 2013, 12:02 PM   #5170
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Quote:
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It's happening again next Sunday 20th, let me know if you want the details of the train working (it'll be the evening only, nothing in daylight hours I'm afraid).
That would be brilliant if you could! Thanks. I'd love to get a glimpse.
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Old January 18th, 2013, 07:05 PM   #5171
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Will you be stewarding again Tubes?
No, I had my turn last Sunday
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Old January 19th, 2013, 10:01 AM   #5172
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That would be brilliant if you could! Thanks. I'd love to get a glimpse.
Timetable for 20th January 2013:

Met No. 1 Steam locomotive (for first 6 minutes only)

Hauled by Sarah Siddons electric locomotive
Depart Kensington Olympia: 18.19
Arrive Moorgate: 18.56

Met No. 1 Steam locomotive

Hauled by Sarah Siddons electric locomotive for return journey
Shuttle service from Moorgate to Edgware Road
Depart Moorgate: 19.15
Arrive Moorgate: 19.52

Met No. 1 Steam locomotive

Hauled by Sarah Siddons electric locomotive for return journey
Shuttle service from Moorgate to Edgware Road
Depart Moorgate: 20.25
Arrive Moorgate: 21.02

Met No. 1 Steam locomotive

Hauled by Sarah Siddons electric locomotive for return journey
Shuttle service from Moorgate to Edgware Road
Depart Moorgate: 21.35
Arrive Moorgate: 22.12

Met No. 1 Steam locomotive

Final run from Moorgate to Earls Court via Edgware Road
Depart Moorgate: 22.35
Arrive Earls Court: 23.05 (the continues to reverse at Olympia and stable in Lillie Bridge)
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Old January 19th, 2013, 03:55 PM   #5173
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tubeman View Post
I've said this elsewhere before, but I wish that the Epping-Ongar Railway was re-electrified and became a unique LT preserved railway. I'd love to ride 38 Stocks, A Stocks, and whatever else is still in working condition... Plus Met No.1 and the Chesham coaches / car 393 can become a permanent fixture, Sarah Siddons, etc...
I totally agree. If that would eventually happend, how would stock transfers of SSL stock work? Perhaps a connection between LU and NR north of Stratford, where the northern tunnel mouths are on the tunnels for Central Line northeast of Stratford?


Otherwise:
How about running more museum/veteran trains on Northfields-Acton Town?

That stretch is near the museum depot and has four tracks even though only one branch of the Picadilly line runs regulary there. (Yes, I know that all four tracks are used for exampe for movements to/from the depot at Northfields, but the operational problems if a museum/veteran train would break down would probably be far less than at any other place on the network).

With some alterations at Acton Town the museum/veteran trains might even be able to have their own platform (but that would probably involve some demolition and rebuilding of non-rail infrastructure)
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Old January 19th, 2013, 06:51 PM   #5174
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I totally agree. If that would eventually happend, how would stock transfers of SSL stock work? Perhaps a connection between LU and NR north of Stratford, where the northern tunnel mouths are on the tunnels for Central Line northeast of Stratford?
Truck transport perhaps?

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Otherwise:
How about running more museum/veteran trains on Northfields-Acton Town?

That stretch is near the museum depot and has four tracks even though only one branch of the Picadilly line runs regulary there. (Yes, I know that all four tracks are used for exampe for movements to/from the depot at Northfields, but the operational problems if a museum/veteran train would break down would probably be far less than at any other place on the network).

With some alterations at Acton Town the museum/veteran trains might even be able to have their own platform (but that would probably involve some demolition and rebuilding of non-rail infrastructure)
Sounds like a pretty good plan to me.
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Old January 19th, 2013, 08:16 PM   #5175
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Dear Tube Man,

Which is your favourite London Underground line and why?

Regards,

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Old January 20th, 2013, 11:50 AM   #5176
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I totally agree. If that would eventually happend, how would stock transfers of SSL stock work? Perhaps a connection between LU and NR north of Stratford, where the northern tunnel mouths are on the tunnels for Central Line northeast of Stratford?


Otherwise:
How about running more museum/veteran trains on Northfields-Acton Town?

That stretch is near the museum depot and has four tracks even though only one branch of the Picadilly line runs regulary there. (Yes, I know that all four tracks are used for exampe for movements to/from the depot at Northfields, but the operational problems if a museum/veteran train would break down would probably be far less than at any other place on the network).

With some alterations at Acton Town the museum/veteran trains might even be able to have their own platform (but that would probably involve some demolition and rebuilding of non-rail infrastructure)
The big problem with running over the Central Line is signalling incompatibility, as it's ATO. The connection you describe at Leyton was in situ until the early 1970's, in fact British Rail used to run a token diesel service to Epping until 1970 (just the first train in the morning), and goods trains ran to several stations on the Epping branch and Hainault Loop until the mid-1960's.

Now all the conventional signals have been long removed, any heritage trains and Central Line cannot mix. One option which is workable is to carry out transfers after all Central Line services have ceased for the night, essentially take out a 'possession' of the line from Leyton to Epping and run the train under no signals (acceptable as long as the train is 'locked in' and the only one on the line).

Your second suggestion has occurred to me before also, and is a great one... I think it's pretty work-able to be honest, and has the added benefit of conventional signalling. Passengers could board heritage trains at Northfields in the eastbound 'slow' platforms, where they could idle for as long as is needed as they're not blocking anything, they could run to Acton Town and reverse via the East Sidings and back to Northfields (reversing again via the depot). The only conflicts with regular train movements would be at Acton Town where the trains would run through the eastbound District platform (only 7 tph) and cross the eastbound Piccadilly to access the sidings, then crossing the westbound Picc on the way back out. Assuming this would be weekends, I don't think it poses much of a headache operationally.

I think LU have missed a bit of a trick in terms of preserving its trains. As far as I am aware, the only electric stock preserved and in working order (aside from Sarah Siddons) is a 4-car '38 stock (ignoring the track recording and rail adhesion trains). I'm not sure if any surface stock is in working order? At very least an A, a C and a D stock should be preserved from the current S Stock roll-out... perhaps with the corporate livery cleaned off and the trains restored to original bare aluminium.

It's a shame, there have been some beautiful surface stocks like the R, CO/CP, F, Q, etc... Single motor cars survive, but we'll never see them running again.

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Old January 20th, 2013, 12:26 PM   #5177
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Quote:
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I think LU have missed a bit of a trick in terms of preserving its trains. As far as I am aware, the only electric stock preserved and in working order (aside from Sarah Siddons) is a 4-car '38 stock (ignoring the track recording and rail adhesion trains). I'm not sure if any surface stock is in working order? At very least an A, a C and a D stock should be preserved from the current S Stock roll-out... perhaps with the corporate livery cleaned off and the trains restored to original bare aluminium.
This is just a guess, but I think there is a correlation between how hard it seems to be to get train paths for heritage/museum trains and lack of preserved working stock.

Other rail wehicles and trams are preserved in working order here and there because there are dedicated museum/veteran infrastructure to run on. Noone except health&safety and the board/owners of the museum/veteran organisation can say "stop, you cannot restore and run that train/tram". With underground stock there is no other infrastructure except TfL's and they can do as they please and always being able to hide behind a number of reasons to deny museum/veteran trains to run on their infrastructure.

We have the same problem in Sweden/Stockholm. There is one museum/heritage underground train (with just four cars, of different but compatible stocks) that is taken out on a few runs sometimes and then it just sits in a depot for a few years becaus of all kinds of buerocratic and organisational reasons. The last silly thing was that the train is owned by SL ("Stockholms TfL") and while they have permission from the rail authority to run trains they don't have permission to run trains with passengers (because it's only their contractors who run ordinary passenger trains and they in turn of course have permission to run trains with passengers). At the same time we have loads of different locomotives, rail cars and trams preserved in working order around the country, some running on their own infrastructure and some on infrastructure shared with ordinary trains/trams.

This is why a re-electrified Epping-Ongar would be so great.

Could perhaps one of the Northfields - Acton Town tracks somehow be transfered to the museum? (Single train working on that track) or are all four tracks needed?
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Old January 21st, 2013, 04:04 PM   #5178
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In Marseille, we have no trouble running our heritage tube trains... that's because all the trains are no more recent than 1976 and 1983! (the metro dates from 1976). What with the orange and brown plastic seats and interior, it is like stepping straight into the 1970s.
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Old January 21st, 2013, 08:17 PM   #5179
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This is just a guess, but I think there is a correlation between how hard it seems to be to get train paths for heritage/museum trains and lack of preserved working stock.

Other rail wehicles and trams are preserved in working order here and there because there are dedicated museum/veteran infrastructure to run on. Noone except health&safety and the board/owners of the museum/veteran organisation can say "stop, you cannot restore and run that train/tram". With underground stock there is no other infrastructure except TfL's and they can do as they please and always being able to hide behind a number of reasons to deny museum/veteran trains to run on their infrastructure.

We have the same problem in Sweden/Stockholm. There is one museum/heritage underground train (with just four cars, of different but compatible stocks) that is taken out on a few runs sometimes and then it just sits in a depot for a few years becaus of all kinds of buerocratic and organisational reasons. The last silly thing was that the train is owned by SL ("Stockholms TfL") and while they have permission from the rail authority to run trains they don't have permission to run trains with passengers (because it's only their contractors who run ordinary passenger trains and they in turn of course have permission to run trains with passengers). At the same time we have loads of different locomotives, rail cars and trams preserved in working order around the country, some running on their own infrastructure and some on infrastructure shared with ordinary trains/trams.

This is why a re-electrified Epping-Ongar would be so great.

Could perhaps one of the Northfields - Acton Town tracks somehow be transfered to the museum? (Single train working on that track) or are all four tracks needed?
Makes pulling off a steam engine running through London Underground tunnels with slam-door coaches well over 100 years old, during traffic hours, in passenger service, truly remarkable. We laugh about being so 'Elf n' Safety conscious in the UK, the amount of work devoted to making this happen is truly commendable.

The four tracks between Acton Town and Northfields really are not all needed, so yes equally a single road operating under single line working could work.
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Old January 21st, 2013, 08:37 PM   #5180
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Dear Tube Man,

Which is your favourite London Underground line and why?

Regards,

Harrington
I should say the Jubilee Line (as I work on it)... but for me it's definitely the District Line... I grew up next to it, travelled it to school, drove on it for 2 years, and was a Duty manager on it for 6 years... Definitely 'home'
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