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Old January 3rd, 2007, 09:18 PM   #1121
Rational Plan
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Surely once T5 and Heathrow East are both online, T4 can be mothballed, leaving a much simpler linear service for both the Piccadilly line and HEX?
The various proposed configurations of the Heathrow North all show all the terminals linked by a new inter terminal transit system. Various Heathrow transport planning documents have mentioned possible systems, even if Heathrow North did not happen. If that was the case the Picadilly service could be curtailed to just Heathrow 123 and 5.


BAA are not going to be mothballing T4.

Two of the platforms at T5 allow for westwards extension and would be ideally used for Airtrack. Though I've always thought if the Picadilly line was extended North From T5 towards the A4 it would connect to BA's waterside office complex and would be a spot for bus connections and Kiss and ride passengers wanting a quick drop off without getting snarled up in the terminal traffic.
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Old January 5th, 2007, 04:57 AM   #1122
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Will Heathrow East and North be assigned other names (T6, T7)?
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Old January 6th, 2007, 02:24 AM   #1123
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Hi

Beggars on trains are still a problem, although perhaps not as much as they once were.

Why is more not done to stop it? I have always thought that there should be posters descrediting their stories about needing money to get into a hostel for a the night and maybe pictures of the persistant offenders, such as the woman with her 'baby'. I suspect those who try and sell the Big Issue are also dodgy - or at least doing it illegally?

The other thing that the suckers who give these people money don't seem to twig is that either the beggar could afford the money for a tavelcard or else are fare-dodging!

What's the inside view tubman?

James
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Old January 6th, 2007, 06:42 PM   #1124
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Hi

Beggars on trains are still a problem, although perhaps not as much as they once were.

Why is more not done to stop it? I have always thought that there should be posters descrediting their stories about needing money to get into a hostel for a the night and maybe pictures of the persistant offenders, such as the woman with her 'baby'. I suspect those who try and sell the Big Issue are also dodgy - or at least doing it illegally?

The other thing that the suckers who give these people money don't seem to twig is that either the beggar could afford the money for a tavelcard or else are fare-dodging!

What's the inside view tubman?

James
Begging's not really a 'problem' per se... its certainly very low-level and nowhere near the magnitude of 6 or 7 years ago when hundreds of Roma Gypsies masquerading as displaced Kosovars and Bosnians flooded the network in organised gangs of women with (drugged) babies and children playing accordians. Now I occasionally see a 'homeless type' politely giving a speech asking for money before holding out his cup to travellers, but there's nothing that could be considered aggressive or threatening in the slightest.
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Old January 8th, 2007, 06:38 AM   #1125
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yo tubeman

anyways i wanted to ask you if around Earl Court Station are there places to go that is around the station?

i saw some of the pics of the station and it looks huge for a metro station
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Old January 8th, 2007, 09:29 AM   #1126
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Hello Tubeman.

1- Does London Undergrund system uses electronic ATP (Automatic train protection) or the mechanical ones? Are there differences between different lines?

2- I had heard some stations in Victoria Line has 13 patches when a train brakes into the station because of bad braking control system. Why they have so many patches? What does Victoria Line different from other lines?
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Old January 8th, 2007, 10:13 AM   #1127
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yo tubeman

anyways i wanted to ask you if around Earl Court Station are there places to go that is around the station?

i saw some of the pics of the station and it looks huge for a metro station
There are two huge exhibition / concert venues at the West end of the station (Earl's Court numbers 1 & 2), but other than that not an awful lot of note. Earl's Court used to be quite a seedy area with the once-magnificent townhouses split into bedsits popular with Australians and prostitutes (as well as becoming London's first Gay 'community' of any note), its nowhere near as downmarket as it was in the 1970's but there's still a few streetwalkers trotting about the Earl's Court Road in the wee small hours when I go out to get my dinner on Nights.
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Old January 8th, 2007, 10:23 AM   #1128
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Originally Posted by Gherkin View Post
Hello Tubeman.

1- Does London Undergrund system uses electronic ATP (Automatic train protection) or the mechanical ones? Are there differences between different lines?

2- I had heard some stations in Victoria Line has 13 patches when a train brakes into the station because of bad braking control system. Why they have so many patches? What does Victoria Line different from other lines?
1) Both. All lines use conventional Westinghouse mechanical ATP (Tripcock and Trainstop) except the Victoria and Central Lines, which use electronic ATP (i.e. ATO). As the technology of the latter two is separated by well over 20 years, the two ATO systems are pretty dissimilar, but the basic principles are the same. I'm not a great ATO expert, never having worked on either of the two ATO lines, but I could bore you senseless with the conventional mechanical system!

2) Following on from the above, the Victoria Line ATO system used today is the same one installed when it was first opened in 1968 (and the actual technology dated back several years before this to trials on the District and Central Lines). To be blunt, its old. The trains are old (also 1968 vintage, developed in 1967), and the ATO is getting old. Trains simply don't stop as precisely 'on the mark' as they are supposed to anymore, you will often experience the consequence of this on the Victoria Line when the train suddenly brakes hard accompanied by a 'farting' noise just as its coming to a halt: this is the driver having to override the ATO by applying the Emergency Brake as the train is deciding to sail past the stopping mark. Fortunately new trains are in the pipeline (I posted photos of the prototypes being built at Derby earlier in the thread), which should solve these problems.
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Old January 8th, 2007, 11:22 AM   #1129
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1) Both. All lines use conventional Westinghouse mechanical ATP (Tripcock and Trainstop) except the Victoria and Central Lines, which use electronic ATP (i.e. ATO).
Strange. Are there any reason behind this? Because of frequent traffic of these lines?

Quote:
2) Trains simply don't stop as precisely 'on the mark' as they are supposed to anymore, you will often experience the consequence of this on the Victoria Line when the train suddenly brakes hard accompanied by a 'farting' noise just as its coming to a halt: this is the driver having to override the ATO by applying the Emergency Brake as the train is deciding to sail past the stopping mark.
Trains which stop at such low precision are quite rare now. It is amusing now to see such incidents to happen so frequently in London Underground.

Though seriously that cause much more fatigue (the sharp braking) to the wheels, so that the wheels need to be reprofiled more than usual.
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Old January 10th, 2007, 07:35 AM   #1130
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Hi, Tubeman. I just would like to ask you a question as i am going to have a presentation regarding to UK Received Pronunciation Accent tomorrow. Are those London Underground Train Announcement sort of UK RP accent?Btw, can anyone tell me why lesser people speak in the RP way in London?

Last edited by ryantey; January 10th, 2007 at 10:01 AM.
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Old January 10th, 2007, 02:20 PM   #1131
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By "lesser people", do you mean the lower stratum of society, or did you mean fewer people?
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Old January 10th, 2007, 02:39 PM   #1132
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By "lesser people", do you mean the lower stratum of society, or did you mean fewer people?
Sorry. I mean fewer.
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Old January 13th, 2007, 04:21 AM   #1133
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Hi, Tubeman. I just would like to ask you a question as i am going to have a presentation regarding to UK Received Pronunciation Accent tomorrow. Are those London Underground Train Announcement sort of UK RP accent?Btw, can anyone tell me why lesser people speak in the RP way in London?
Hi, sorry for the delay... I'm on holiday in Australia at the moment!

Yes, the announcements are RP, which per capita is a pretty rare accent anywhere in the UK these days. You'll hear it amongst the Upper Middle Classes in the more affluent areas, and the Upper Middle / Upper Middle Classes pretty much anywhere else in the country. A bit too late, though!
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Old January 13th, 2007, 03:07 PM   #1134
Jean Luc
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G'day Tubeman, and welcome! I hope you're enjoying your stay.

Have you been using any trains or other public transport while you're here? If so how does it compare to that in London or the U.K.?

BTW, you're not one of the "Barmy Army" by any chance, are you? If so, commiserations...
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Old January 18th, 2007, 04:07 AM   #1135
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yo tubeman

nice at least your taking a vacation from the hard work i guess anyways i want to know about the Healthrow express and Gatwick Express are all london Airports are connected by Rail

i know that the Docklands Light Railway is Connected to London City Airport but the others like Gatwick and i heard about Gatwick express its not going to end is it or not? i don't want it to end it means alot to people traveling to the Airport of Gatwick post pictures if you want

anyways i wanted to say as well is that umm hmm oh yeah what do you think of the Thameslink programme is it good or bad well do you use the Thameslink (First capital connect nowadays)

also ummm hmmm about Bank station as well sorry its too many questions is Bank station really big because it has a couple of lines including the DLR and Waterloo and City Line and so forth anyways put pics if you want sorry about the many questions tubeman but its cool you know
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Old January 27th, 2007, 11:44 PM   #1136
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Tubeman

I dont know if this has been asked previously, but why is it that whenever im goin northbound on the picadilly line I have to get off at wood green, or if not there then arnos grove? As they decide that the train will now terminate there instead of cockfosters and i have to wait for the for a next train if i wan get to southgate

why doesnt it just carry on?
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Old January 28th, 2007, 03:22 AM   #1137
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Songoten2554 View Post
yo tubeman

nice at least your taking a vacation from the hard work i guess anyways i want to know about the Healthrow express and Gatwick Express are all london Airports are connected by Rail

i know that the Docklands Light Railway is Connected to London City Airport but the others like Gatwick and i heard about Gatwick express its not going to end is it or not? i don't want it to end it means alot to people traveling to the Airport of Gatwick post pictures if you want

anyways i wanted to say as well is that umm hmm oh yeah what do you think of the Thameslink programme is it good or bad well do you use the Thameslink (First capital connect nowadays)

also ummm hmmm about Bank station as well sorry its too many questions is Bank station really big because it has a couple of lines including the DLR and Waterloo and City Line and so forth anyways put pics if you want sorry about the many questions tubeman but its cool you know
Since he's not here I'll try and answer it.

There are five airports in London:

London Heathrow Airport: Connected by the Piccadilly Line and the Heathrow Express (to Paddington). In the future, this will be connected to the city by Crossrail as well.

London Gatwick Airport: Served by mainline trains, Thameslink (to London Bridge and King's Cross among others) and Gatwick Express (to Victoria).
Since the Gatwick Express operates on a very busy mainline, they are thinking of letting it make additional stops on its route to London to serve more commuters, since the line isn't actually used that much.

London Luton is also served by Thameslink (and is connected with Gatwick that way), but you do have to use a shuttle bus to get from the station to the airport.

London City Airport is served by the DLR, which takes you to Bank station. Crossrail (1) might also get a station here (in Silvertown) in the future.

London Stansted is served by the Stansted Express from Liverpool Street, and might also be served by Crossrail 2, which would mean that all airports would be served by RER-like commuter rails, and one could travel to all of them directly from King's Cross (and thus with one change from airport to airport).


Bank is indeed a busy station, with the DLR, Central Line, W&C, Northern Line and District and Circle platforms. Since the District and Circle line are actually at a separate station called Monument - which is connected to Bank - it can be quite a long walk from one line to another.

There you can see how complex the station is.
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Old January 30th, 2007, 02:13 AM   #1138
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Tubeman

I dont know if this has been asked previously, but why is it that whenever im goin northbound on the picadilly line I have to get off at wood green, or if not there then arnos grove? As they decide that the train will now terminate there instead of cockfosters and i have to wait for the for a next train if i wan get to southgate

why doesnt it just carry on?
Apologies for the delay, I just returned from Australia via Dubai last night and now have the pleasure of coming stright back to Night shift at Earl's Court!

Trains 'short-tripping' is a very common occurence on London underground: it happens because trains are running late and so turn short of their timetabled destination such that they run on time on the return trip (e.g. if a train is 20 minutes late and runs through to Cockfosters it will likely return south 20 minutes late, but if it terminates at Arnos Grove it can run on time on the southbound trip). This of course inconveniences passengers wishing to travel to the extremities of lines, but in the long run its better than having the whole line running late (I made quite a long post explaining more about the implications of late-running earlier in this thread, I'll try to dig it out).
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Old February 6th, 2007, 08:32 AM   #1139
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hey whatsup everybody its about time to rivive this thread so here we go tubeman is back and well hmm where is tubeman yo tubeman?????
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Old February 7th, 2007, 11:31 AM   #1140
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Errr... hello!

Still alive
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