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Old May 4th, 2010, 02:10 AM   #601
bindubasketball
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Quote:
Originally Posted by killerk View Post
I am hoping that many more world class airlines will now fly to Houston......The combined airline will have around 65% market share at IAH.....way more than its share in Chicago making Houston the largest hub for the airline.....
However it should be noted that with the airline having Headquarters in Chicago it will lose its lobbying power here in Houston which paves the way for other airlines to gradually eat into their share of the market especially for International flights.....
As I see this, ticket prices to and from Houston are going to drop in the long run...and fares for Chicago flights are going to rise!!!

The same analogy applies to Cleveland...probably on a higher level....having 8 hubs in same country makes no sense!!! gradually it should come down!! We live in an "economy of scale"!!!
Check your facts. CO has a marketshare of 87% at Houston: http://www.transtats.bts.gov/airports.asp?pn=1
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Old May 4th, 2010, 02:55 AM   #602
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As I see this, ticket prices to and from Houston are going to drop in the long run...and fares for Chicago flights are going to rise!!!
Er. With stiff competition from AA and Southwest in Chicago, I doubt fares will be raised much at ORD. The same can't be said for IAH.
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Old May 4th, 2010, 03:38 AM   #603
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http://www.aviation-weblog.com/50226...ge_finally.php
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Old May 4th, 2010, 03:44 AM   #604
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Not fan of the livery. Instead of choosing one of the other, they could have come up with something new. Infact, I wish they had kept the Continental name instead of the logo. For become the world's largest airline, the name 'Continental' just seems more fitting IMO.
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Old May 4th, 2010, 09:41 AM   #605
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United will be nice with more than 7 hubs.
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Old May 4th, 2010, 05:42 PM   #606
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Hey guys, what do you think is next? We have two mega airlines now and the only ones left are American and US Airways. Do you think that these two might merge???

I dont think US airways has any chance now that is alone
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Old May 4th, 2010, 08:08 PM   #607
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bindubasketball View Post
Check your facts. CO has a marketshare of 87% at Houston: http://www.transtats.bts.gov/airports.asp?pn=1
I was talking about the combined airline which would have 64% of market share at IAH.....

http://www.theposselist.com/2010/05/...cument-review/

http://www.conservativerefocus.com/b...gree-to-merger
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Old May 4th, 2010, 09:21 PM   #608
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Er. With stiff competition from AA and Southwest in Chicago, I doubt fares will be raised much at ORD. The same can't be said for IAH.
Southwest has a significant presence in Houston too....We rarely compare no frills airlines with the full service carriers....besides they operate from 2 different airports in both Chicago and Houston....Hence the stats don't include Southwest's market share in both cities...

I was specifically talking about lobbying power....The new airline can and will lobby to increase market share in Chicago.....besides most reports claim that to be the reason for the Headquarters being in Chicago....We know how much lobbying power matters here in the US.....
I am sure other airlines will gradually eat into "United's" share in Houston as time comes...historically that has happened (JFK is the most common example)!! I would also not be surprised if any of the other airline company sets up a new hub in Houston over time (in the next 5+ yrs).....An airline company that uses an airport as its headquarters has significant decision making power for that airport and that can influence which airline flies and does not fly to that airport directly or indirectly...classic case of this is how Delta exited from DFW 4 years ago....
The combined airline cannot exercise that power anymore since they are not based here anymore....in other words Houston Airports System now can exercise more of its right in this matter....Of course it will take sometime....
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Old May 5th, 2010, 03:25 AM   #609
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Interesting that they are going with the United name but Continental branding and livery.

United appears to be using not only Continental's livery but also their font in spelling out "United" on their planes. Hmm, if they had gone the other way and used the name Continental, would they have to rotate the U logo onto its side to turn it into a C? I think the whole branding exercise is just a matter of what's the cheapest option? Redoing the United logo would mean that all the planes from both Continental and United would need a total rebranding. This way, Continental's plane only require a partial rebranding, while United's would get the total rebranding.
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Old May 5th, 2010, 06:35 AM   #610
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I got that pic of the continental/united jet in my email too. Is it for real, or just to show that the airlines have merged?

The merger makes sense in many ways. I hope the continental side can improve UA's customer service just like Delta improved NWA's....
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Old May 5th, 2010, 09:50 AM   #611
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What does the population of a metro area have to do with anything? Chicago is a more prominent city than Houston and it is the base for UA. It makes perfect sense to have it based there. Besides, you point to estimated projections and we all know how off those can be. Saying in 35 years Houston may, and it's a big may, be bigger that Chicago is justification for Houston getting the HQ is ridiculous.

I like this merger personally and it makes sense. With CO moving over to Star Alliance it really helped pave the way for this thing to happen.

As I and others have said, Cleveland is done as a hub and will probably see its operation cut down to a focus city at best. Being right in between ORD, EWR and IAD does not help.
You really don't think population plays a part? Fine, that's you...
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Old May 5th, 2010, 04:50 PM   #612
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You really don't think population plays a part? Fine, that's you...
hahahaha, if it did matter, please explain why Atlanta has the world's busiest airport. Denver isnt exactly a world city either. Besides, Houston's numbers are skewed because of all the Katrina people...

My guess is that Chicago will offer better tax benefits, its the same tactic they used to lure Boeing away from Seattle.
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Old May 5th, 2010, 08:24 PM   #613
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gil View Post
United appears to be using not only Continental's livery but also their font in spelling out "United" on their planes. Hmm, if they had gone the other way and used the name Continental, would they have to rotate the U logo onto its side to turn it into a C? I think the whole branding exercise is just a matter of what's the cheapest option? Redoing the United logo would mean that all the planes from both Continental and United would need a total rebranding. This way, Continental's plane only require a partial rebranding, while United's would get the total rebranding.
I think you're right.

Anyways you guys are just used to the United logo, I don't think the new livery is bad, you just have to get used to it
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Old May 5th, 2010, 08:25 PM   #614
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Originally Posted by czm3 View Post
hahahaha, if it did matter, please explain why Atlanta has the world's busiest airport. Denver isnt exactly a world city either. Besides, Houston's numbers are skewed because of all the Katrina people...

My guess is that Chicago will offer better tax benefits, its the same tactic they used to lure Boeing away from Seattle.
Houston is one of the fastest growing cities in the US..The metropolitan area has consistently ranked in the top 5 fastest growing in North America. The Katrina numbers were added the year it happened and 2 years later then US census themselves dropped the numbers back to a few thousand...so the whole metro now has 5.699 instead of 5.7 million people!! not much of a difference!! We will know the exact numbers when the 2010 Census is out....

Yes, I also think the tax benefits for United in Chicago are more than what they would get in Houston....!!! Houston has taken the low cost of living for granted and felt no need for any tax incentives to attract corporations!!
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Old May 5th, 2010, 08:31 PM   #615
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You really don't think population plays a part? Fine, that's you...
No, I don't think it does. Besides currently, the city of Chicago and the metro area are bigger than Houston. Pointing out that Houston may surpass Chicago in 30-40 years is pointless and useless.
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Old May 5th, 2010, 08:38 PM   #616
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The world's biggest airline with only 7 South American destinations? that's awful

Btw, about the livery: I think It's ok It's going to be that simple because, remember that they are more than 700 aircrafts to paint, and to change it again years later will be a mess. So the solution was to get a serior, regular livery, a little boring but that it wont be ugly in the future, like for example, the one that AA, IB or AZ has... (My opinion)
Some how I have a feeling that we will be seeing the number (7) jump quite a bit.

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Originally Posted by Kngkyle View Post
Er. With stiff competition from AA and Southwest in Chicago, I doubt fares will be raised much at ORD. The same can't be said for IAH.
3 airlines have hubs in Chicago, UA, AA and WN. You are right in saying that fares will not be going up that much, if at all.


There is no way Houston is going to bite the hand that feeds, CO/UA.
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Old May 5th, 2010, 08:57 PM   #617
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Quote:
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You really don't think population plays a part? Fine, that's you...
Trae.....The answer to your question depends on the kind of business model the airline company follows....

A strong hub spoke airline does not depend on local population.....Emirates airlines, one of the largest international carriers in the world operates from Dubai where the population is less than 1.7 million people...(The whole UAE's population is somewhere around the population of Houston metro area and they have Etihad based in Abu Dhabi that carries another 9 million passengers and Air Arabia in Sharjah that has pioneered low cost travel in Middle East)....

Many times it is cheaper to travel an airline that is not based there....Airlines tend to charge higher fares (premium) on one-stop flights originating from their hubs/head quarters......

Population is however important for no frills airlines that follow a point to point travel model and it is important that both places have significant population base to ensure maximum passenger loads on return flights....
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Old May 5th, 2010, 09:29 PM   #618
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Quote:
Originally Posted by czm3 View Post
hahahaha, if it did matter, please explain why Atlanta has the world's busiest airport. Denver isnt exactly a world city either. Besides, Houston's numbers are skewed because of all the Katrina people...

My guess is that Chicago will offer better tax benefits, its the same tactic they used to lure Boeing away from Seattle.
Because Delta routes a lot of their flights through Atlanta and uses it as a MAJOR connecting hub. And Houston's numbers are skewed because of Katrina people? That shows how much you know.

Houston: http://recenter.tamu.edu/data/popm00/pcbsa26420.html

You see how there was a big spike in 2006 and then a dropoff the next year (for domestic migration)? It's because the majority of people went back to Louisiana. Chicago's for fun: http://recenter.tamu.edu/data/popm00/pcbsa16980.html

And the reason why I said population matters is because many people (a lot from Chicago), said United will stay in Chicago, sense there is a larger market to pull from and ORD is the larger airport. And I don't know that Chicago can offer better tax incentives than Houston, which is much cheaper to live in and do business (you pay your employees less and make more money). The reason why the HQ is in Chicago is because United wouldn't even talk to Continental if the HQ couldn't be in Chicago.
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Old May 5th, 2010, 09:37 PM   #619
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No, I don't think it does. Besides currently, the city of Chicago and the metro area are bigger than Houston. Pointing out that Houston may surpass Chicago in 30-40 years is pointless and useless.
I don't think it's pointless when your largest hub (Houston) is growing at a fast clip. It's only going to get larger and larger as time goes on. IAH has room to expand and already was one of the fastest growing airports.

Quote:
Originally Posted by massp88 View Post
Some how I have a feeling that we will be seeing the number (7) jump quite a bit.

3 airlines have hubs in Chicago, UA, AA and WN. You are right in saying that fares will not be going up that much, if at all.

There is no way Houston is going to bite the hand that feeds, CO/UA.
Southwest Airlines just got a lot more business, according to the Houston Chronicle comments section. I don't think the city will screw over CO/UA at gates in the airport, though. But, Continental was already failing with giving Houston more direct flights to Europe. Other airlines came into IAH and scooped that up. The new CO/UA needs to at least get a direct flight to Nigeria from Houston, too (like Delta does with Atlanta). It's a cash cow waiting to happen.
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Old May 6th, 2010, 05:13 AM   #620
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Originally Posted by czm3 View Post
hahahaha, if it did matter, please explain why Atlanta has the world's busiest airport. Denver isnt exactly a world city either. Besides, Houston's numbers are skewed because of all the Katrina people...

My guess is that Chicago will offer better tax benefits, its the same tactic they used to lure Boeing away from Seattle.
One misunderstanding by many...only Boeing's HQ moved. The manufacturing jobs remain in the Seattle area. However, unless there are more union concessions, some of this manufacturing is at risk of moving. Not to Chicago, but to the southeast.
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