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Old May 6th, 2010, 05:44 AM   #621
czm3
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I am fully aware that only about 400 boeing jobs moved to Chicago, but it is their new base. Afterall, not every gm worker is based in Detroit. I think this whole discussion of population is rediculous. Afterall if that were the case, every company would move to NYC..
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Old May 6th, 2010, 06:12 AM   #622
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I am fully aware that only about 400 boeing jobs moved to Chicago, but it is their new base. Afterall, not every gm worker is based in Detroit. I think this whole discussion of population is rediculous. Afterall if that were the case, every company would move to NYC..
Population growth. Companies are moving to where people are moving (for the most part).
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Old May 6th, 2010, 06:23 AM   #623
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I think this whole discussion of population is rediculous. Afterall if that were the case, every company would move to NYC..
Precisely. The fact is that an airline organization most likely wants to be where most of its planes and employees are. Both Chicago and Houston will have approximate levels of both in Houston and Chicago for the foreseeable future.

Even when/if Houston surpasses the Chicago metro in 30-40 years and will be many decades after that the the disparity will be nearly as large as say the one between Chicago's and LA/NYC metro's of today. You don't seem any major airlines clamoring to set up HQ's in either of those major metros because of their huge popuulations.

If Houston is a metro of say 18 million and Chicago 12 million in 2070 then I am sure United will be up to reevaluate the question.
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Old May 6th, 2010, 06:27 AM   #624
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Population growth. Companies are moving to where people are moving (for the most part).
Companies are moving where they can get the best perks actually.
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Old May 6th, 2010, 06:34 AM   #625
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The reason why the HQ is in Chicago is because United wouldn't even talk to Continental if the HQ couldn't be in Chicago.
Who knows how true that is though, I tend to be skeptical. Everything is up for bargaining in a deal and I doubt that would have been a deal breaker. I think Continental likely cared less about staying in Houston or saw more logic in a Chicago' Hd''s then United management saw in setting up shop in Houston or abandoning Chicago.

What was likely of much more importance was which management would lead United into the future, the sale of the stock price, union negotiations, and other financial particulars between the two.
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Old May 6th, 2010, 07:10 AM   #626
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Who knows how true that is though, I tend to be skeptical. Everything is up for bargaining in a deal and I doubt that would have been a deal breaker. I think Continental likely cared less about staying in Houston or saw more logic in a Chicago' Hd''s then United management saw in setting up shop in Houston or abandoning Chicago.

What was likely of much more importance was which management would lead United into the future, the sale of the stock price, union negotiations, and other financial particulars between the two.
Well, it's what Smisek said when he was speaking with the ABC affiliate in Houston. They had an interview with him. Upon reading about Tilton, I believe what Smisek said. I've also read about people flying on United to IAH and they've noticed the staff/flight attendants/pilots all acted very nice towards them...almost didn't seem genuine. Guess its started.
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Old May 6th, 2010, 07:18 AM   #627
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Companies are moving where they can get the best perks actually.
Agreed, afterall, they are in the business of making money. This is not about placating city X's boosters.....
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Old May 6th, 2010, 07:57 AM   #628
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Companies are moving where they can get the best perks actually.
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Agreed, afterall, they are in the business of making money. This is not about placating city X's boosters.....
Believe what you all want. Companies nowadays are moving where people are moving. It's not like those cities don't hand out perks either.....
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Old May 6th, 2010, 09:25 AM   #629
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So why are there not a lot of Fortune 500 companies running over to Phoenix and Las Vegas?

The reason why there are a lot of corporations headquartered in Texas is because of it's more business-friendly laws, not simply because it's booming in population (although that definitely does play a factor--just not a primary one). It's also a major logistical hub as well.

Last edited by Xusein; May 6th, 2010 at 09:33 AM.
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Old May 6th, 2010, 05:29 PM   #630
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So why are there not a lot of Fortune 500 companies running over to Phoenix and Las Vegas?
Because those two cities only grew because they were cheap. Houston, Dallas, Austin, San Antonio, Atlanta, Charlotte, and Raleigh are the fast growing Sun-Belt cities gaining companies. Phoenix and Las Vegas are the exceptions, not the rule. Besides, growth in those two cities have slowed down considerably, while the Texas metros (especially Houston and Dallas), as well as Raleigh have increased their growth.

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The reason why there are a lot of corporations headquartered in Texas is because of it's more business-friendly laws, not simply because it's booming in population (although that definitely does play a factor--just not a primary one). It's also a major logistical hub as well.
Business-friendly laws and growing population. I didn't say it was a primary factor, but it is definitely one of the main factors.
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Old May 6th, 2010, 08:09 PM   #631
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Because those two cities only grew because they were cheap. Houston, Dallas, Austin, San Antonio, Atlanta, Charlotte, and Raleigh are the fast growing Sun-Belt cities gaining companies. Phoenix and Las Vegas are the exceptions, not the rule. Besides, growth in those two cities have slowed down considerably, while the Texas metros (especially Houston and Dallas), as well as Raleigh have increased their growth.



Business-friendly laws and growing population. I didn't say it was a primary factor, but it is definitely one of the main factors.
Do not forget the makeup of the work force. Boston and its metro area, a high cost of living and high taxes for business, has one of the smartest and most educated workforces in the country. Hence why its top 5 for high tech, bio tech, education, health care and finance.

An educated workforce is a big asset for a city and its metro area to have.
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Old May 6th, 2010, 08:11 PM   #632
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Do not forget the makeup of the work force. Boston and its metro area, a high cost of living and high taxes for business, has one of the smartest and most educated workforces in the country. Hence why its top 5 for high tech, bio tech, education, health care and finance.

An educated workforce is a big asset for a city and its metro area to have.
This is also true. Boston is lucky to have all of those colleges/universities up there. Helps the economy because education does not shrink during a recession, and it helps with the industries you listed.
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Old May 6th, 2010, 08:31 PM   #633
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This is also true. Boston is lucky to have all of those colleges/universities up there. Helps the economy because education does not shrink during a recession, and it helps with the industries you listed.
In addition to having the best collection of colleges and universities in North America, if not the world, Boston also is home to world class hospitals (MGH, Brigham and Women and Dana Farber) which also help too. Health care is a constant growth industry.

Having a good amount of local colleges is great for employers. Take Las Vegas for example, it's entire economy is related to tourism. Most, I would say 8 out of 10 jobs, do not require any advanced (associate, bachelors or graduate) degree. Look at Houston on the other end, take out oil, which may or may not be the largest sector, and there is still health care which produces a large number of jobs for example.
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Old May 18th, 2010, 04:35 PM   #634
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http://www.chicagotribune.com/busine...,2131636.story

United deal could face turbulence
Merger with Continental faces questions over prices, competition in some markets

By Julie Johnsson, Tribune reporter

9:12 p.m. CDT, May 17, 2010

Before the merger of United and Continental airlines can take wing, executives first must convince antitrust regulators that their new behemoth won't harm consumers by hiking prices or squelching competition.

The carriers' first public showdown with critics likely will come at a June 16 hearing of the aviation subcommittee of the House Transportation Committee. Meanwhile, state and federal officials also are preparing to take a close look at the proposed deal to create the world's largest airline and the ripples it would send through the travel industry.

Rep. James Oberstar, D-Minn., the committee's chairman and a longtime airline critic, has asked Justice Department officials to block the proposed tie-up. He claimed in a May 5 letter the deal would pressure other large U.S. carriers to merge, ultimately leaving consumers with less service and higher fares.

Executives for United and Continental portray the transaction as one that will foster growth. They expect their $3 billion deal to gain approval from Justice and Transportation department officials over the next seven months, allowing them to close the transaction by year's end.

"We know what the process is, we know what the law is, we know how the markets are defined," Continental Chief Executive Jeff Smisek told analysts and reporters as he unveiled the merger May 3. "There are no two carriers that you could put together in a more complementary way than United and Continental airlines."

Legal experts are less confident of a speedy review for a deal that could test the Chicago loyalties of President Barack Obama and Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood. The new carrier, to be called United, would be based in United's hometown of Chicago.

The Obama administration has vowed to take a more critical look at megamergers that leave markets controlled by a handful of giant players than was done under former President George W. Bush.

U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder told Congress last week that Justice Department officials will conduct a fair and thorough review of the proposed deal.

"I can assure you that political considerations will not be a part of that process," Holder said, according to a report by Reuters.

Ohio Attorney General Richard Cordray also is leading 15 states in an investigation of the merger's effects on consumers. Illinois is not participating in the probe.

"But as with any major transaction, we will monitor the progress of this review and get involved if necessary," said Robin Ziegler, press secretary for state Attorney General Lisa Madigan.

Antitrust regulators are expected to focus on how United and Continental's networks overlap, paying attention to routes where the merged entity could squash competitors. Analysts say the deal likely will draw more scrutiny than the last big airline merger: Delta's 2008 takeover of Northwest.

United and Continental have little redundancy at their eight major hubs, which stretch from Newark, N.J., to Los Angeles. But they would overlap on at least 13 nonstop routes, 11 of which would be reduced to monopoly or duopoly status, said analyst Jamie Baker of investment bank JPMorgan. By contrast, Delta-Northwest overlapped on a dozen nonstop routes, seven of which emerged as "highly concentrated," Baker said.

Delta and Northwest successfully argued that low-cost competitors such as Southwest Airlines and JetBlue Airways would ensure that airfares remained competitive in cities where they dominated.

"That argument succeeded with the last administration," said Mark Popofsky, co-head of the antitrust practice at law firm Ropes & Gray LLP. "The government is probably going to take a harder look this time around."

Justice officials were skeptical of a 2009 joint venture involving United and Continental and unsuccessfully fought a Transportation Department decision to grant the carriers and two Star Alliance partners antitrust immunity to set prices and share revenue on flights across the North Atlantic.

They could prolong the regulatory review of the United-Continental merger by also examining its potential effects on one-stop flights and the degree to which Continental, as the No. 4 airline, competitively battled United, the third-largest carrier, Popofsky said.

If they find routes where competition could be harmed, antitrust regulators typically attempt to stoke competition by requiring the merger partners to surrender gates or landing slots to other airlines, observers said.

But the involvement of so many states in the merger probe could make it difficult for antitrust regulators to coordinate investigations or to reach consensus on the appropriate remedies within the seven-month time frame the airlines seek, said Popofsky, a former Justice antitrust official.

"There's a herding-cats aspect to having the states involved," he said.

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Old May 18th, 2010, 10:07 PM   #635
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where will it reduce competition
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Old May 19th, 2010, 02:11 AM   #636
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Well it might on the few routes now where there is only Continental/United service which is only a handful of flights.


In a more bizzare twist to the story, I am sketpical this will have any legs.....................


Quote:
http://www.usatoday.com/travel/fligh...&csp=obnetwork

Is United seeking 3-way deal with US Airways, Continental?
Updated 4/19/2010

By Dan Reed, USA TODAY
United Airlines ' (UAUA) talks with US Airways (LCC) and Continental Airlines (CAL) could result in more than just a simple merger of two big airlines.
Some analysts suspect that United is trying to put together a complex three-way deal that, in effect, would create a global aviation leader almost 50% larger than current No. 1 Delta.

To pull that off, United — which is already a Star alliance partner with both airlines — would have to convince antitrust regulators and Congress that such a large and unprecedented combination of carriers wouldn't reduce flight options and lead to higher fares. They'll also have to win the support of labor unions.

"United's 'Plan A' all along has been to do a merger with US Airways and keep Continental as their alliance partner with antitrust immunity," says independent analyst Hubert Horan. An executive at Northwest Airlines in the 1990s, Horan helped build the first international airline alliance, with KLM.

The current alliance between United and Continental allows them to divvy up international routes to fly and jointly set fares on those routes.

United's alliance with US Airways, because it does not have antitrust immunity, is mainly promotional.

The size of the combined airlines and significant overlap among the markets they serve could make it hard to get any deal approved by antitrust regulators.

United/US Airways would dominate the Washington, D.C., market. And the three airlines together would have unmatched strength in the Northeast — with hubs in New York, Philadelphia, Washington and Charlotte. Over time, the airlines might squeeze out competition and drive up average fares in the region and to and from Europe.

Rivals, including Delta and American, would likely fight such a mega-combination.

But Horan argues that by using "the same legal language and concepts already used to justify all the other (airline) alliances that have been given antitrust immunity, you could justify allowing Continental to continue to have antitrust immunity with a larger, merged United."

A merged United and US Airways would rank as the second-largest U.S. airline, behind Delta, in passenger miles flown. Delta reported 163.7 billion passenger miles flown in 2009 by itself, and 188.9 billion including its regional airline partners.

United and US Airways combined flew 158.4 billion passenger miles last year. And if the miles flown on their regional partners are included, they combined to fly 209.2 billion passenger miles, 20 billion more than Delta and its regional partners.

Meanwhile, Continental flew 79.8 billion passenger miles last year, 89.1 billion counting those flown on its regional partners.

The carriers also would have to persuade unions to accept a deal that some don't appear to favor. Wendy Morse, head of the Air Line Pilots Association at United, said last week that her pilots prefer merging with Continental. Other unions at United also are leery of a US Airways merger.

Analyst Vaughn Cordle at AirlineForecasts.com, says labor's support for a merger can be "bought" by using a combination of big pay raises in the 10% range and shares in the merged airline.

Convincing United's and Continental's shareholders and employees that a United-US Airways merger is the better approach won't be easy. A merger with Continental creates more value, Cordle says.

Horan sees it differently.

"In 2008, Continental decided it was better to get 85% of the benefits of merger by joining in a partnership with United ... (than to) deal with all the labor issues and fleet issues and integration issues that would have come with" a full merger, he says. "Nothing's changed."
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Old May 19th, 2010, 02:20 AM   #637
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I don't see that surviving antitrust. They should have kept the United font, it would have looked a little better.
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Old May 19th, 2010, 11:17 PM   #638
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I think in the long run what they are looking for is a merger between United and Continental and an Alliance with US Airways (mostly probably through Star Alliance or if the Regulators sit dumb, a bigger stand alone alliance with US Airways)...
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Old May 26th, 2010, 01:54 AM   #639
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http://www.chicagobreakingbusiness.c...g-flights.html

American begins Chicago-Beijing flights
Published on May 25, 2010 1:31 PM
By Mary Ellen Podmolik

With a landing rights dispute settled, American Airlines launched service between Chicago and Beijing Tuesday, as part of a schedule that will offer a daily flight four times a week.

The Texas-based carrier had planned to initiate the service almost a month ago, but the first flight was canceled only hours before departure because of a dispute with the Chinese government over landing rights.
Citing congestion, the government originally slotted American's flights to arrive in Beijing at 2:20 a.m. and depart at 4:20 a.m. The Obama administration lobbied aviation authorities in China for American to secure landing slots in the middle of the day.

But American did not secure such prime slots. Under the schedule announced Tuesday, flights will arrive at Beijing Capital International Airport at 11 or 11:50 p.m., depending on the day, and leave there for Chicago, at 6:59 or 7:59 a.m.

The new Beijing route is important to American, whose northern Pacific market share trails that of Chicago-based United Airlines and Delta. American has touted the new route in broadcast ads and on billboards around Chicago. It also hired Sam Choy, a celebrity chef from Hawaii, to create Asian-fusion menu items for the flight.
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Old May 27th, 2010, 03:21 AM   #640
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Why did Chicago ended its AA flights non-stop to Buenos Aires? They said they had a great ocupation, but most of the travellers where family tourists... WTF?
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