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Old December 8th, 2005, 07:24 AM   #21
luv2bebrown
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Metropolitan
Just to make us feel better, does anyone has the vacancy ratio currently in Dubai ? I expect it to be small, otherwise all those projects would be purely irrational. However, I would like to know the exact figure.

there are no vacancy ratio figures. most of the projects are under construction or just being launched. the vast majority of projects are sold out within days (sometimes hours) of being launched.

rent in Dubai is skyrocketing. there was an average 30% increase in rent from last year. take that fact however you want.
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Old December 8th, 2005, 07:33 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by luv2bebrown
Dubai city population today is 1.3 million. its metro population including sharjah is well over 2 million. projected population growth is between 6% and 12% mostly middle and upper-middle class.
According to wikipedia, the 2005 calculation of Dubai's population is 1,140,000 people for an area of 3,385 sq. km. That makes a density of 300 inhabitants per square kilometers. Hence, I really doubt there's a metropolitan area larger than the city area in Dubai.

Dubai creating the demand is an idea I could understand, but even in importing massively newly migrants, you cannot create Tokyo from scratch only in building towers in such a small city with such a small population in the country.
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Old December 8th, 2005, 07:48 AM   #23
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the population of Dubai is 1.3 million according to dubai government statistics www.statistics.ae.

there is an entire city called sharjah which borders Dubai (the city centres are a few km away from each other like the Minneapolis-St.paul metro) and its population is therefore not included in any Dubai statistics. sharjah's population right now is at least 500,000 and the city is growing rapidly. unfortunately, Dubai heavily overshadows its neighbours growth. there are times when i feel that Sharjah has more buildings under construction than Dubai. so do not forget sharjah's rapid growth. im sure the city will be over a million in 10 years time. also, with regards to the country, you are forgetting Abu Dhabi which is 200km from Dubai. Abu Dhabi controls 90% of the UAE's oil. i believe Abu Dhabis population is around 1million and is also rapidly growing. in the last couple of years, Abu Dhabi has become weary of Dubai's growth, and has steadily started investing. The city has plans to invest 500billion dollars in projects in the city and around the world. please do not disregard that the country, in terms of population, plans to increase from its current size of maybe 4.0-4.5 million, to around 11-15 million in the next 2 or 3 decades.

i fail to see how a few thousand high rises = tokyo

i think people are under the impression that these towers will be completed tomorrow. this is not true. Dubai's plans are for the future. some of its largest projects will be finished til 2015. i doubt Dubai business bay will be completed before 2015. the rest will be phased in over the years as the city grows
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Old December 8th, 2005, 08:24 AM   #24
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I like the design a lot. Dubai is just the Disneyland for skyscraper fans, a non-stop high-rise orgasm
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Old December 8th, 2005, 10:22 AM   #25
malec
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harkerb
I am very surprised that all these supertall towers, don't come with several helipads for emergency evacuations. I mean, how many people would be in one of those, should a big fire breaks out or in an event of a terror attack? How fast can people be evacuated?? Haven't these people learned anything from 9/11? People got trapped on the floors above the planes' penetrating points, with no escape. Yet, authorities allow developers to idiotically go higher and higher without taking into account the risk they may be bringing to those cities? Nice to look at, but who in their right minds would want to live on the 180th floor...and that in a part of the world that is most unstable and dangerous.
I thought most towers in Dubai do have helipads
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Old December 8th, 2005, 10:47 AM   #26
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nice to see dubai continuing to champion its belief in height over sensible urban planning, sustainable design and decent architecture. dubai is how NOT to build a city, something HoustonTexas post illustrates perfectly. there is more than sheer height you know.
malec? how could a couple of helipads evacuate 100,000 people from a tower in a couple of hours?
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Old December 8th, 2005, 10:48 AM   #27
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Enough with the bull crap about terrorists and planes flying intoo buildings
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Old December 8th, 2005, 11:01 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gothicform
nice to see dubai continuing to champion its belief in height over sensible urban planning, sustainable design and decent architecture. dubai is how NOT to build a city, something HoustonTexas post illustrates perfectly. there is more than sheer height you know.
malec? how could a couple of helipads evacuate 100,000 people from a tower in a couple of hours?
on the contrary, i believe dubai has some very sensible urban planning - Mixed use developments, as opposed to the classic zoning, which help create vibrancy. the road system in Dubai was among the world's best until only a couple of years ago, which due to the unexpected and sheer growth of the city (the city's growth outdid itself) caused gridlock. now a light rail system is being built, along with several monorail systems linking up with the light rail, and an inter-emirate (and possibly internation) freight railway system.

sustainable design = mainly the switch from unit or central cooling to DISTRICT cooling, and the use of advanced technologies and materials to make buildings environmentally friendly. oh yeah and building TOWERS to utilize district cooling benefits.

and i happen to love dubai's archictecture.

in case you didnt know, fire in skyscrapers are a major problem simply because ladders only go up to 11 stories i think. so whether you are in a 50 storey tower or 160 storey tower is irrelevant. whats more important than helipads are fire proof elevators, elevator shafts and fire stairwells. if a fire is bad enough to prevent people from escaping, helicopters cannot approach.

where did u get this figure of 100,000 people in a tower? thats an insane amount. both WTC in NYC had 50,000 office workers during peak times. a tapered residential/office tower will have much less.
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Old December 8th, 2005, 11:10 AM   #29
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Interesting news. I'm not sure how I feel about the design yet, but congratulations to Dubai nonetheless.
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Old December 8th, 2005, 11:16 AM   #30
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"unexpected and sheer growth of the city"
"dubai has some very sensible urban planning"

such good planning they couldnt even plan a transport system for only a few years ahead. haha.
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Old December 8th, 2005, 11:30 AM   #31
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We live in a place were other rules applies. You can't understand until experience it firsthand, therefore your opinion is not valid.
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Old December 8th, 2005, 11:39 AM   #32
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*blinks*
o....k. i guess human beings and development in dubai are governed by completely different rules to the rest of the planet - i call this the titanic syndrome. meanwhile, i know nothing, youre 100% right about everything, youre a massive oracle of wisdom. this is why i never post in the world forums.
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Old December 8th, 2005, 02:30 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by luv2bebrown
the population of Dubai is 1.3 million according to dubai government statistics www.statistics.ae.

please do not disregard that the country, in terms of population, plans to increase from its current size of maybe 4.0-4.5 million, to around 11-15 million in the next 2 or 3 decades.



I have a question regarding the population growth though:

obviuosly it isn't natural growth, the growth comes mainly from the outside. my question: who would want to move to dubai? I mean we're speaking about millions of people. only because you (from europe or america) buy a house on the palm, it doesn't mean you live there, right? is it possible, that hundreds of thousands of units, that have been bought by foreigners, are just being used sporadicaly - you can't hardly count these people as residents.
now, back to my question: who would want to move to dubai permanently? how can dubai bring millions from around the world to move there?
bringing several millions of people to a city within a few decades would mean dubai must create sources of income. what are the goals of dubai? is it plannend to be a big manufacturing center? or a banking hub? or a giant tourism center? or to become a major business city like new york or tokyo? or is it just always going to built to keep the people emloyed. all companies, that wanted to be in dubai, are already in dubai.

I don't want to disregard dubai, I just want to understand.

personally, I dont think dubai will ever be a business city like new york, tokyo, london, paris, frankfurt, zurich or milan. it could become one of the biggest centers for tourism though - like las vegas. or it could become a giant port.

I would love to visit dubai, more than once. but living there? hm, dunno. I get sunshine elsewhere too. just because of impressive buildings? no really, I want to understand, what would bring millions of people to move to dubai...
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Old December 8th, 2005, 03:47 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kai Tak
Gentlemen gentlemen... how can we forget PICTURES!!!



Great new!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It could be the first tower in the world to break the mark of 1 kiometre high

Go Dubai!!
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Old December 8th, 2005, 06:43 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Basshead
Depends on the newspaper, but please let me believe!

Show me some renders, official plans or just something else to prove it...
Click here: http://www.dubaiwaterfront.ae/

The Developers (http://www.nakheel.ae/) are the same people that are doing also these:

http://www.thepalm.ae/
http://www.theworld.ae/
http://www.jumeirahislands.ae/

and have done this: http://www.ibnbattutamall.com/

Afterall, Donald Trump might have stupid hair but he's not an real estate idiot to make a partnership with them.
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Old December 8th, 2005, 06:56 PM   #36
malec
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I don't get why this thread already has 127 posts. This is old news since this tower has been known about for a year and everyone knew it was going to be a challenge to burj dubai.

If this one turns out higher it'll be a real pity since burj dubai is the perfect WTB for me. It's an elegant, graceful and soaring supertall. Al Burj is none of those things and reminds me more of a super-structure designed to house the remains of humanity after some nuclear war or something (like in The Island). It also reminds me of the citadel in halflife 2. Totally overpowering:



There's too much tension in the design of al burj I think.

For a tower like this loads of exposed concrete is definitely not the way to go. More glass needed and also it must get narrower as it goes up to lose this overpowering element.
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Old December 8th, 2005, 08:19 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by *UofT*
The Mughals in 1600's had more revenue generated in a single year relative to the Royal Treasury of Queen Victoria in the 1800's.

It must hurt that wealth has again shifted away from your Island, but booms and busts come and go in every region.

Wait for your turn, you folks made a good run time for Asia now.
Oh really and where is your source for this comment. Ah yes the 1800's, a time when our tiny island was at its greatest, before it became polluted.

Wealth has not shifted away from our island. We work hard for our money, you suck it out of the ground. I don't dislike you as a people. I mean, i don't think its Arab nature to be democratic. You haven't quite reached that level of civilization yet. Your way of life has not really changed for 1000's of years, not that thats a bad thing perhaps. Innovation is not your strong point. Its just that all the UAE has given the world is a nasty black liquid that pollutes everything. So remember that when you sit in your nice shiney buildings that europeans designed and built. Sorry, i'll be moaning about the americans tomorrow.
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Old December 8th, 2005, 08:29 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gothicform
"unexpected and sheer growth of the city"
"dubai has some very sensible urban planning"

such good planning they couldnt even plan a transport system for only a few years ahead. haha.
we barely even had a freeway 12 years ago.


in 12 years we built up a massive road network which was extremely good. it was only hurt because the city grew by 200,000-300,000 in a period of 3 years.

it takes 4 years in america for a single bridge to be built (on the I-494 south of st. paul)
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Old December 8th, 2005, 08:34 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arch
Oh really and where is your source for this comment. Ah yes the 1800's, a time when our tiny island was at its greatest, before it became polluted.

Wealth has not shifted away from our island. We work hard for our money, you suck it out of the ground. I don't dislike you as a people. I mean, i don't think its Arab nature to be democratic. You haven't quite reached that level of civilization yet. Your way of life has not really changed for 1000's of years, not that thats a bad thing perhaps. Innovation is not your strong point. Its just that all the UAE has given the world is a nasty black liquid that pollutes everything. So remember that when you sit in your nice shiney buildings that europeans designed and built. Sorry, i'll be moaning about the americans tomorrow.

the UAE builds up its capital selling oil.

the UK built up its capital through its Empire and slavery.
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Old December 8th, 2005, 08:43 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eastender
I have a question regarding the population growth though:

obviuosly it isn't natural growth, the growth comes mainly from the outside. my question: who would want to move to dubai? I mean we're speaking about millions of people. only because you (from europe or america) buy a house on the palm, it doesn't mean you live there, right? is it possible, that hundreds of thousands of units, that have been bought by foreigners, are just being used sporadicaly - you can't hardly count these people as residents.
now, back to my question: who would want to move to dubai permanently? how can dubai bring millions from around the world to move there?
bringing several millions of people to a city within a few decades would mean dubai must create sources of income. what are the goals of dubai? is it plannend to be a big manufacturing center? or a banking hub? or a giant tourism center? or to become a major business city like new york or tokyo? or is it just always going to built to keep the people emloyed. all companies, that wanted to be in dubai, are already in dubai.
all the things you said are exactly right, and exactly the reasoning behind Dubai's growth. tax-free environment, stable, business friendly, prime global location, excellent infrastructure, very high standards of living, diverse + multicultural, relatively liberal, safe - basically its a good place to make money and raise your kids. since the oil boom in the 60s, immigrants have been moving to the UAE. in 1990, Dubai's population i think was around 400,000 or so.

Dubai is turning itself into a services/knowledge based economy.
Banking and Finance
Business
tourism and leisure
trade
transportation

are the biggies. it plans to become the largest and most important financial centre between frankfurt and singapore
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