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Old February 24th, 2010, 10:53 PM   #101
mnmike
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The side streets are like that all over Minneapolis...from the rain/ice earlier in the winter. My street has been plowed every snow emergency, and it is like that too. Its not even possible that your street has only been plowed once in the past 3 months, sorry, it just isn't. Is it some obscure alleyway or something? Otherwise it has certainly been plowed with every snow emergency. About potholes, You really should have seen Lake of the Isles parkway last winter, if you didn't. I have never seen so many potholes so deep anywhere in the city, it was crazy.

Oh, and as far as you never saying the problems in Mpls are as large as Detroit...I quote your post:

"the worst things happening in Detroit (gang violence, drug trafficking, homes foreclosed/burning down/being torn down, et al.) is no worse than what's happening in Minneapolis."

That is what I took the above statement to mean, I think I misunderstood your point there once I reread it in context, sorry My bad on that one.

Also, comparing Minneapolis and Detroit is also apples and oranges..that was part of my point.

Anyway, sorry, that will be my last off topic post in this thread

Last edited by mnmike; February 24th, 2010 at 11:07 PM.
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Old February 25th, 2010, 12:06 AM   #102
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Minneapolis












And here is one that I took of Havana this summer (i know its not in the midwest, but...)
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Old February 25th, 2010, 12:24 AM   #103
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The side streets are like that all over Minneapolis...from the rain/ice earlier in the winter. My street has been plowed every snow emergency, and it is like that too. Its not even possible that your street has only been plowed once in the past 3 months, sorry, it just isn't. Is it some obscure alleyway or something? Otherwise it has certainly been plowed with every snow emergency. About potholes, You really should have seen Lake of the Isles parkway last winter, if you didn't. I have never seen so many potholes so deep anywhere in the city, it was crazy.

Oh, and as far as you never saying the problems in Mpls are as large as Detroit...I quote your post:

"the worst things happening in Detroit (gang violence, drug trafficking, homes foreclosed/burning down/being torn down, et al.) is no worse than what's happening in Minneapolis."

That is what I took the above statement to mean, I think I misunderstood your point there once I reread it in context, sorry My bad on that one.

Also, comparing Minneapolis and Detroit is also apples and oranges..that was part of my point.

Anyway, sorry, that will be my last off topic post in this thread
Don't know what to tell ya....but more to the point is the potholes: they *are* noticeably worse in my neighborhood than they are in wealthier neighborhoods surrounding us. It is presumably related to property taxes...

No worries on the misread. And, I see your point. However, I think it's fair to compare the problems of pretty much any American city to any other one. Suburbs to cities? Not so much...but the problems of blight and "ghetto-ization" are more or less the same (again, in severity, not extremity...if that's the appropriate wording) everywhere...

But it's a silly discussion to continue with, since I think everyoby's made their points well enough...
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Old February 25th, 2010, 12:50 AM   #104
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Those Minneapolis pics don't have garbage on the ground and the stoplight looks way too nice.
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Old February 25th, 2010, 12:59 AM   #105
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Those Minneapolis pics don't have garbage on the ground and the stoplight looks way too nice.
yeah I have seen a few yards that people just use as garbage dumps, though. full of litter and I saw a boat just left to rot once

speaking of urban prarie anybody got sum pics of it?
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Old February 25th, 2010, 12:59 AM   #106
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I'm sure there are plenty of shots from Minneapolis.
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Old February 25th, 2010, 07:57 PM   #107
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Those Minneapolis pics don't have garbage on the ground and the stoplight looks way too nice.
Lol. Touche, hudkina....touche.

Uptown, if you're interested in seeing urban prairie, you *might* find some pockets of it on Park or Portland, between Franklin and Lake Street. That's a big *might*, though...

I'm sure there are other places, but I don't know where. Maybe in some of the poorer areas of SE....maybe where 94 and 280 meet and there's a lot of light industry (?).
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Old March 1st, 2010, 02:54 AM   #108
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Man its unbelievable there's such desperation in the US
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Old March 1st, 2010, 03:31 AM   #109
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I can't believe there is debate on who lives in the bigger ghetto. Here let me answer for you. I was born and raised in Detroit. I now live in Harper Woods (4 blocks from Detroit) I have a lot of family in Minneapolis. I visit Minneapolis at least once a year, usually 2-3 times. In terms of abandonment, Detroit wins. Detroit is also a lot larger. It's land area is also 2.5 times larger than Minneapolis. Detroit was made for 2 million people. It has gone from 1.8 million to 900k. Of course there will be wide spread abandonment. Minneapolis on the other hand has went from a peak of about 550k to 380k. Not nearly the decline.
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Old March 5th, 2010, 10:56 PM   #110
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Hey people. Somehow I stumbled upon this thread after looking at pictures of projects, and been going over the last few pages and reading the arguments and enjoying the pictures. Im also fascinated by these pictures because for me these capture the repressed part of the world, the reality, we are fed bullshit about going to our 9-5s having big and important jobs and having a beautiful wife and healthy kids but lifes nothing like that, people struggle everyday, evil men get away with shit because theres no perfect world, a lawyer can have all the respect from his 'peers' but step into the hood and hes NO-ONE. Thats the importance of these ghettos and seperations, because really every person is an imitation to an extent of their surroundings and influences and their status often changes determined by where they go.

I got quite a few slum pictures on my home computer, but the thing is they aint american, so I dont know if they're allowed here, but basically as a kid I grew up in Bosnia, a proper ****ed up country that experienced alot of problems in the 80s and 90s. I grew up in a town that was actually a warzone through my youth, so gunfire at night and bulletholes, grenaded buildings and etc like you see in the bronx picture was common, but at the same time this isn't a country as developed as american so I guess you can't really compare.

I moved to London when I was 5. This is something americans are generally 'naive' about, sorry to seem like im insulting. You lot think cos you got NY, London is just a posh little fairy place like you see in the movies. I grew up in the north point of greater london, because like NY london is broken up into many different boroughs and smaller areas. This area I grew up in shares many qualities like it does with your ghettos, except the mentality is kind of different.

We've got run-down houses and flats, council estates (our version of projects) that are just as run-down as yours, street longs of closed shops and boarded up homes, my house is next to a field of abandonned factories on one side, a park with an abandonned SCHOOL where drugs are now dealt and massive projects. Most people are grew up with are criminals, some deal drugs, some are part of organized crime groups, others just go around robbing people everyday, its normal life to them. There's shooting and stabbings reguarly, people don't generally walk out at night ever, and kids aren't generally let out to play. However, I guess it can't really compare always with the crime rates, but in general deprivedness and war-zone appearance it can, but we also have our extremes, and ive got some good pictures ima share with you guys just as it might be interesting to see how shit is on the other side of the ocean, mind you this is how it still is now, areas like london and manchester (especially manchester) were almost as bad as those bronx pics in the 80s. It's shocking to think really how ****ed up places can be and people still live happily.

Just like how hip-hop evolved from the most ****ed up areas because people could get together and jam in parks and spit rhymes...
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Old March 6th, 2010, 07:20 AM   #111
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The difference between the U.K. and the U.S. is that in the U.S. the system is set up to make it very easy for these conditions to persist. There's little or no accountability. Rather than attempt to make an area more liveable, the powers-that-be just build a new neighborhood on the fringe for the people who can buy their way out of such conditions.
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Old March 6th, 2010, 07:06 PM   #112
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Yeah theres no real urban prarie in Minneapolis. We have scattered abandoned lots and many abandoned/foreclosed houses but the city does not do widespread demolition without plans to redevelop the land i think
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Old March 30th, 2010, 02:52 PM   #113
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Hello folks, London calling....

Great shots, so evocative, so of thier time too.

As my Bosnian mate says We've got areas of "urban prairie" (great word BTW) in London too, in point of fact the site that the main 2012 Olympic games venues are being built on is just such a former prairie/tundra/wasteland.

Take it easy.

CF

PS - Nice to see that a couple of days later, Illmatic and I's contributions as people obviously not from the US and taking an interest have been signally ignored, cheers folks.
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Old March 30th, 2010, 10:12 PM   #114
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Quote:
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I just can't see Minneapolis having the same problems as Detroit if even over a smaller area. In fact, I think having such conditions over such a small area of the city hinders the isolation and desperation that one would find in the heart of Detroit's inner-city. At least Minneapolis still has a viable city government and stable tax base. My guess is that the schools aren't as bad. I'm willing to bet that the city does a decent job maintaining the parks and public spaces. I wouldn't doubt the police response time even in the worst neighborhoods of Minneapolis is only a few minutes.
I moved to Minneapolis from Detroit. When I arrived here...the "bad" part of town looked like a really nice community. I am African American so I was interested in living in an African American community here. Thus, I looked into these really nice looking Apartments on Plymouth street in North Minneapolis. Come to find out....it was a housing project and there was a waiting list and I did not qualify anyway because of my income....lol.

Minneapolis is a REALLY nice place. The streets are kept clean....not many abandoned and bordered up or burnt up dwellings....there is NO comparison to Detroit, because there just has not been the level of abandonment here as in Detroit.

Now....I moved here during the time when a lot other Detroit folks were coming here....to sell drugs. People here called them the "Detroit Boys" and they literally ran the Phillips community in South Minneapolis where the fellow you are debating with lives. The Detroiters, according to the Police chief then, were responsible for a spike in homicides as he said they were the most violent element in the city.

You are right Hudinka in regards to the myths about what violent drug infested communities look like. I personally do not like the term “ghetto”. I think the term was a label for where ethnic minorities or immigrants congregated or were segregated to and not all such areas are “Slums”.
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Old April 2nd, 2010, 08:56 AM   #115
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Quote:
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Here's a few from Detroit's Brush Park:

Before:

www.detroityes.com

After:
image hosted on flickr

© DecoJim

Before:
image hosted on flickr

© whitewall buick

After:
image hosted on flickr

© Eridony
You can't do a better job at restoring homes like these two, especially the second one with the roof and top section of the house completely gone and burned. Brush Park's looking good!
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Old April 3rd, 2010, 06:14 AM   #116
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Hey Jaybird--

Beautiful Brush Park pics; thanks for including them. What would you say is the level of infill occurring in that neighborhood as it revives? Are most of the vacant lots turning into new housing, or are the existing homeowners claiming them as a larger side yard? It will be interesting to see how, as the neighborhood continues to repopulate, if it will hold even a fraction of the population density that it enjoyed in its heyday.
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Old April 3rd, 2010, 06:57 AM   #117
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It will be interesting to see how, as the neighborhood continues to repopulate, if it will hold even a fraction of the population density that it enjoyed in its heyday.
Actually, it's quite the opposite. Brush Park was developed as a mansion district, originally. Now, the where mansions once stood the empty lots are being replaced with townhomes and apartment/condo buildings, and almost all of the giant mansions are being subdivided into apartments and condos. At the end of the day, the population density will be far greater than it ever was meant to be.
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Old June 28th, 2010, 05:25 AM   #118
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Hey Jaybird--

Beautiful Brush Park pics; thanks for including them. What would you say is the level of infill occurring in that neighborhood as it revives? Are most of the vacant lots turning into new housing, or are the existing homeowners claiming them as a larger side yard? It will be interesting to see how, as the neighborhood continues to repopulate, if it will hold even a fraction of the population density that it enjoyed in its heyday.
Well that's a very good question. As for Brush Park, a lot of the area is being renovated and rebuilt, this is however uncommon for a few areas in Detroit because of slumlord developers and such, actually there's something like that going on with Martha Reeves in the city right now. So it's not like New York (yet?) but there is a lot of development and a huge contrast from the 70-90's, in a good way.
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Old June 29th, 2010, 06:38 AM   #119
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S. Bronx is the worst I've seen in a while...probably worse than Camden, NJ but that was back in the early days.
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Old June 29th, 2010, 10:28 PM   #120
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Well that's a very good question. As for Brush Park, a lot of the area is being renovated and rebuilt, this is however uncommon for a few areas in Detroit because of slumlord developers and such, actually there's something like that going on with Martha Reeves in the city right now. So it's not like New York (yet?) but there is a lot of development and a huge contrast from the 70-90's, in a good way.
Your statement about Brush Park was true until about 2008. I have not seen any signs of improvement in Brush Park since then. Only a few mansions have been restored and no new condos have been built since the first few sets on Woodward Ave and on Winder street several years ago. A few more of the original structures have been demolished. Crosswinds Development, the company that built the condos was supposed to restore the remaining empty mansions but the signs announcing the restoration are themselves falling over or disappearing. If you go a few blocks east of Woodward, you see large empty spaces:
image hosted on flickr

Photo credit: me
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