daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > World Forums > Architecture

Architecture news and discussions on all buildings types and urban spaces
» Classic Architecture | European Classic Architecture and Landscapes | Public Space | Shopping Architecture | Design & Lifestyle | Urban Renewal and Redevelopment



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old December 16th, 2008, 06:10 PM   #161
pencialcase
Registered User
 
pencialcase's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 185
Likes (Received): 2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skymino View Post
Because it would appear like a big movie-set, totally reconstructed, where everything is not original, like a reproduction of an ancient greek vase, beautiful but fake.
If i were the city authority I would never rebuild the same palace (in Italy you'll never see such a reconstruction) but a new modern one instead, maybe with the original parts left from demolition inserted in the new building.
Classical, revival buildings are aesthetically beautiful, constructed using high quality materials the buildings architectural legitimacy is not important. Many of the most beautiful buildings in the world are based around classical styles; London and Paris are cities fabricated and constructed using reproduced "revival" architecture, but would you consider these buildings and areas "fake"? If a new building was built on the site of the Berlin Stadtschloss in a modern style it would almost certainly receive the same fate as the Palace of the Republic; however the reconstructed palace is aesthetically attractive fitting into its surroundings becoming a permanent and lasting feature. Classical architecture when built and designed to a high standard is more attractive than any building built in a modern style. Beautiful buildings are beautiful regardless of whether their fake or not.
pencialcase no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old December 17th, 2008, 06:07 PM   #162
Skymino
Ambrosian User
 
Skymino's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Milan - Porta Venezia
Posts: 24,058
Likes (Received): 5475

Saying that i like good reproductions, i visited last summer Dresden and i apprecieted the good work.
But everybody who saw my pictures said that Dresden looks like a big Disneyland... where everything it's an imitation and for many people this is not good. I explained that part of these buildings reconstructed have some original parts re-placed in their original position.
These motivation where the only way to let appreciate Dresden to many people.
That's what i'm saying, i like the reconstruction, but it will never be the original one, just a "fake".
__________________
.





Urbanfile Blog - MyFlickr - MilÓn l'era inscý
Skymino no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 12th, 2009, 01:06 PM   #163
seattle92
Registered User
 
seattle92's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Lisboa
Posts: 8,404
Likes (Received): 2853

I would love to see some of the 70's and 80's contructions in Lisbon have the same fate has the "people's palace".

It breaks my heart to see historical buildings in Europe being destroied to build modern horrors (or even modern beautis, there's a place for everything).

Some buildings are simply a mistake since the beguining. But if a mistake was made, it doesn't mean that it can't be corrected.

Berlin will be definitly more beautifull with the original palace. That area of the city is really impressive and will be even more now.
seattle92 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 16th, 2009, 04:44 PM   #164
habsgul
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 15
Likes (Received): 0

Quote:
Originally Posted by seattle92 View Post
It breaks my heart to see historical buildings in Europe being destroied to build modern horrors (or even modern beautis, there's a place for everything)
Just as a reminder I'd like to point out: the palace of the republic is/was a historical building, too!

Even if the existence of the GDR was a short-lived one, it's still part of Germany's and more specifically Berlin's history. And the palace of the republic had it's place in a (even if radical) well thought through composition for the central district of Berlin.

Destroying a primary example of the architecture (and no doubt also the ideology) of a country that no longer exists is in my eyes not _one bit_ better than what the GDR did with the old palace.

Both, the GDR and now the FRG/Germany have destroyed a part of their own history because it didn't suit the current political system. They both erased history. Now the FRG is rebuilding one part by erasing another, but two wrongs don't make a right.
habsgul no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 16th, 2009, 05:14 PM   #165
Dr.Seltsam
Live in HD
 
Dr.Seltsam's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Heidelberg (HD)
Posts: 2,479
Likes (Received): 3230

Yes...but the big difference is: the Palace of the Republic was fu..ing ugly and the old palace will be very beautiful!
Dr.Seltsam no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 17th, 2009, 11:17 AM   #166
habsgul
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 15
Likes (Received): 0

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr.Seltsam View Post
Yes...but the big difference is: the Palace of the Republic was fu..ing ugly and the old palace will be very beautiful!
"Beauty" is very subjective.

Just look at what they are planning to build near the Hauptbahnhof and Reichstag building: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpo...&postcount=238

Or this "jewel" of architecture at Alexanderplatz:


Or what they did to the Friedrichstra▀e:

The Admiralspalast (behind the first building on the left) shows the original height of buildings in this street. And the construction site on the right used to be a green area.

And now a (historical) picture of the palace of the republic:


All these buildings are/were considered "beautiful" by their architects.

And by the way ... take a look at the backside of the proposed reconstruction and say again that this is "very beautiful," or even an improvement to the palace of the republic:
habsgul no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 17th, 2009, 01:44 PM   #167
Ji-Ja-Jot
Used Register
 
Ji-Ja-Jot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Sydney / Hamburg
Posts: 9,498
Likes (Received): 27261

Buld it like it was and bring history back.
I am sad about Berlin, because exspecially here seems to be a competiotion of famous architects, who will design and complete the most ugly building.
Ji-Ja-Jot no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 19th, 2009, 04:15 AM   #168
socrates#1fan
Registered User
 
socrates#1fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Indianapolis
Posts: 2,605
Likes (Received): 1318

Fake?
What about the tower in Venice? Is that a fake?
A lot of the time these structures look fake because they are so new. Many of these historic buildings looked 'disney' when they were first completed.
If this is fake because it is the reconstruction of a style than most 15th-19th century styles are fake.
socrates#1fan no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 19th, 2009, 02:06 PM   #169
habsgul
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 15
Likes (Received): 0

Quote:
Originally Posted by socrates#1fan View Post
Fake?
What about the tower in Venice? Is that a fake?
A lot of the time these structures look fake because they are so new. Many of these historic buildings looked 'disney' when they were first completed.
If this is fake because it is the reconstruction of a style than most 15th-19th century styles are fake.
While you a right that many buildings used to be (and still are) built to look like a style from the past, I think the reason some people see the reconstruction as a "fake" is that it is - in fact - a reconstruction.

It does not simply use older art styles (like the buildings you are referring to), it's fašade is a (more or less) complete 1:1 reconstruction of a building that has been destroyed for more than 50 years.

And unlike, for example, the Frauenkirche in Dresden there are almost no remaining original pieces of the Stadtschloss fašade. Strictly speaking the new Stadtschloss won't be a reconstruction at all, it will be a replica.

Some picture from the Frauenkirche:





Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dresden_Frauenkirche



This (the "Karl-Liebknecht-Portal") consists of some of the only remaining original parts of the Stadtschloss aside from some sculptures now scattered around Berlin in and outside of other historical buildings. And as far as I know there are no plans to integrate it back into the Schloss (the building it's currently part of was just recently renovated and converted into an international school http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europea...and_Technology and is under historic preservation since 1993).

Wiki (only German): http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Staatsratsgeb%C3%A4ude
habsgul no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 23rd, 2009, 01:27 AM   #170
socrates#1fan
Registered User
 
socrates#1fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Indianapolis
Posts: 2,605
Likes (Received): 1318

They should re-use the original parts.
However, it isn't like they are just rebuilding a set of shops or homes.
It is the reconstruction of a landmark. A landmark that held a very historic place but was destroyed without care or regard for it's history. Many buildings have been rebuilt from scratch.
I would support them returning all original parts of the building and placing them in the reconstruction.
Berlin has lost most of it's beautiful architecture and I think the reconstruction of such a historical landmark would restore a lot of beauty to that part of Berlin.
I wish the Reichsteig(sp?) was restored properly and not gutted and 'upgraded'.
socrates#1fan no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 23rd, 2009, 04:47 AM   #171
Looking/Up
Registered User
 
Looking/Up's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Toronto
Posts: 4,125
Likes (Received): 643

Ooooo! Gorgeous! Any chance the German people will ship over the completed building to Toronto? Perhaps?... Probably not, eh? A shame, because it's a beautiful building.
Looking/Up no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 23rd, 2009, 05:20 PM   #172
habsgul
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 15
Likes (Received): 0

I understand most people in this thread who just want to rebuild the old palace because of it's historic importance.

I just wish more people would realize that the palace of the republic itself was a historic landmark, too (it stood there for 30 years). It always gets neglected just because it's part of the "newer" history. I don't want to justify what the GDR did, but people in, say, 20 or 40 years might think about the demolition of the palace of the republic just like most now think about the demolition of the old palace.
habsgul no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 23rd, 2009, 06:38 PM   #173
redstone
Lurker
 
redstone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Singapore
Posts: 14,056
Likes (Received): 52

I rather have a grand historic building than a bland modern building anytime.
redstone no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 18th, 2009, 09:12 PM   #174
giaocomo
Registered User
 
giaocomo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Milan
Posts: 6
Likes (Received): 0

Quote:
Originally Posted by redstone View Post
I rather have a grand historic building than a bland modern building anytime.
You are right, but modern buildings are not necessarily ugly...
__________________
www.Luxemozione.com the 1st lighting design italian blog
giaocomo no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 6th, 2009, 10:38 PM   #175
habsgul
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 15
Likes (Received): 0

Oh wow ... I have no words left for this ...








habsgul no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 7th, 2009, 07:54 AM   #176
rychlik
BANNED
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,809
Likes (Received): 6603

Quote:
Originally Posted by pencialcase View Post
Classical, revival buildings are aesthetically beautiful, constructed using high quality materials the buildings architectural legitimacy is not important. Many of the most beautiful buildings in the world are based around classical styles; London and Paris are cities fabricated and constructed using reproduced "revival" architecture, but would you consider these buildings and areas "fake"? If a new building was built on the site of the Berlin Stadtschloss in a modern style it would almost certainly receive the same fate as the Palace of the Republic; however the reconstructed palace is aesthetically attractive fitting into its surroundings becoming a permanent and lasting feature. Classical architecture when built and designed to a high standard is more attractive than any building built in a modern style. Beautiful buildings are beautiful regardless of whether their fake or not.
I never got this mentality of "fake vs real". What if someone simply has passion for classical architecture and wants to build himself a beautiful villa using a classical architectural style? They are not allowed to because we are in 2009? What would make the structure any less real?! It's ridiculous! Just an example.
rychlik no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 7th, 2009, 09:53 AM   #177
goschio
proud Kuffar
 
goschio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Ujerumani
Posts: 6,048
Likes (Received): 4206

The reconstruction of the castle is a waste of resources IMO. Especially if they are going to use tax money for it.

Its not even that beautiful. Rather bland compared to many other historical buildings. And with this modernist crap facade toward Alexanderplatz it will look completely ridiculous.

Last edited by goschio; June 7th, 2009 at 10:13 AM.
goschio no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 7th, 2009, 10:11 AM   #178
Ingenioren
Registered User
 
Ingenioren's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Oslo
Posts: 5,599
Likes (Received): 584

Very, very sad to see the old palace of republic go, much better than the not so good looking old castle.... I think Berlins image as the once divided city is much more significant than the earlier history, the wall is almost all gone, and this... What's next? Checkpoint charlie? The Tv-tower?
__________________
I want to see some construction!

Last edited by Ingenioren; June 7th, 2009 at 10:16 AM.
Ingenioren no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 7th, 2009, 12:59 PM   #179
habsgul
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 15
Likes (Received): 0

I recently discovered some very old reversal film pictures my grandfather took when the palace of the republic was built:











habsgul no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 7th, 2009, 03:13 PM   #180
Kampflamm
Endorsed by the NRA
 
Kampflamm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Occupied Europe
Posts: 23,664

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ingenioren View Post
Very, very sad to see the old palace of republic go, much better than the not so good looking old castle.... I think Berlins image as the once divided city is much more significant than the earlier history, the wall is almost all gone, and this... What's next? Checkpoint charlie? The Tv-tower?
How is it much more significant? All of Berlin's history is significant and has others have mentioned countless times, if you want to see what Socialist architecture looks like, all you have to do is walk further east towards Alexanderplatz.

Anyway, the Hohenzollerns ruled over Brandenburg/Prussia for about 540 years, while Berlin was divided for about 40. So which era is more significant again?
__________________
Free German passport

"I think it's a privilege to call yourself a Wunderbarler and it's something that you have to earn."
Kampflamm está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
berlin, castle

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 06:32 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

Hosted by Blacksun, dedicated to this site too!
Forum server management by DaiTengu