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Old July 28th, 2014, 02:03 AM   #2301
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EU rules do not require a tendering for public service contracts as far as rail transport is concerend (see Art 5 subpara 6 Regulation (EC) 1370/2007).
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Old July 28th, 2014, 02:21 AM   #2302
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Why would it be illegal for BVG to win a tender set out by the Senate, if the same happens in other member countries? As an example: RATP, the operator of most public transport servers in the ╬le-de-France area, is wholly owned by the French state. Yet, RATP operaters public transport throughout the EU and worldwide. RATP was even in the race for the S-Bahn tender, but decided not to continue (as Tagesspiegel writes).

I think that BVG would have liked to participate in the tender, but that their financial position doesn't let them. As per Wikipedia, between 2003 and 2012 BVG has been unable to turn a profit which would most likely exclude them from participating in the S-Bahn tender.
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Old August 2nd, 2014, 09:01 AM   #2303
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Passanger and freight trains collided near Mannheim station, no information about casuialties yet:

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Old August 2nd, 2014, 10:22 AM   #2304
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Five people seriously injured it is now being reported. Speed was very low as it's right next to the station.

http://www.dw.de/train-accident-in-m...red/a-17827368
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Old August 2nd, 2014, 11:07 AM   #2305
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Am I the only one that thinks that it sounds a little strange to have the sub-heading starting with the words "a private freight train"?

To me sounds like DW wish to stress that the fact that a non-DB train was involved, as if that were significant in some way.
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Old August 2nd, 2014, 11:24 AM   #2306
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexNL View Post
I think that BVG would have liked to participate in the tender, but that their financial position doesn't let them. As per Wikipedia, between 2003 and 2012 BVG has been unable to turn a profit which would most likely exclude them from participating in the S-Bahn tender.
Things are a little bit different. From 1984 until 1993 BVG operated the S-Bahn in West-Berlin. During this time the SŘdring was rebuilt and thanks to this it has best tranfer solutions between U-Bahn and S-Bahn.

Nowadays BVG is legally a A÷R (very special and hard to translate), comparable to the status of a national broadcasting TV institution. It is owned by Berlin council but operates as company idendepent.

As it is common and still legal, EU cities can order public transport from a municipal company without tendering, if the company itself does not take part at any tendering in or outside the community. This is what BVG and Senat do and they have no interest to change this status.

So BVG would not take over S-Bahn by themselves again, they must be forced to do so and that is what they officially said in 2012. It is unlikely that this will happen, because financial status of BVG is bad anyway. It operates since 2013 with a small profite which is unique since decades but it still has debts of about 700 Mill. Euros. This thing said, if Senat would force BVG to take over S-Bahn, everything has to be decided new, apart from the fact, that BVG does not have enough personal to manage this.

Sorry beeing OT here for reailways, but I think it must be explained here for better understanding the S-Bahn Berlin.

BTW, HEV in Budapest is historically somewhat different from normal state-railway operation if I recall correctly. Was it ever to be considered as a "real" heavy railroad? Long time ago BVG was owner of the NME and Niederbarnimer Eisenbahn, because they wanted to extend their service on those small railway lines. But those small railways had not much in common with state-railway lines. Paris RER A/B seems to have a unique position regarding this.
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Old August 2nd, 2014, 11:36 AM   #2307
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According to the DB there were 35 injured, 4 serious.

http://www.faz.net/aktuell/gesellsch...-13077513.html

More images from the article:








The freight train was run by the Dutch company ERS Railways, but a Austrian locomotive was used on this train from Duisburg to Sopron in Hungary.


3 tracks at Mannheim are closed because of the accident, this will mean that some trains will skip the station today.
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Old August 2nd, 2014, 11:55 AM   #2308
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Is that an ICE-1?
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Old August 2nd, 2014, 12:00 PM   #2309
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Nope, it's a standard IC push-pull set.
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Old August 2nd, 2014, 12:02 PM   #2310
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No, those are traditional IC-cars. DB uses ICE 1 only for ICE services.
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Old August 2nd, 2014, 12:27 PM   #2311
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Looks like one of those trains ran a signal.
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Old August 2nd, 2014, 12:31 PM   #2312
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingNick View Post
Looks like one of those trains ran a signal.
Another demonstration of why ECTS is needed network-wide in Europe.
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Old August 2nd, 2014, 02:24 PM   #2313
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TedStriker View Post


Am I the only one that thinks that it sounds a little strange to have the sub-heading starting with the words "a private freight train"?

To me sounds like DW wish to stress that the fact that a non-DB train was involved, as if that were significant in some way.
They are learning from FS, then. FS is specialized in this kind of "informative diversion"...

And yes, it is something disgusting and ridiculous at the same time.
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Old August 3rd, 2014, 11:02 AM   #2314
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
Another demonstration of why ECTS is needed network-wide in Europe.
Germany does have a train protection system already, and I am sure both trains and the line were equipped with it. The presence of a TPS does not completely exclude the possibility of an accident.
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Old August 3rd, 2014, 12:03 PM   #2315
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Germany does have a train protection system already, and I am sure both trains and the line were equipped with it. The presence of a TPS does not completely exclude the possibility of an accident.
Sure enough, certain accidents could still happen, like derailment due to to faulty rail, or a chassis breaking out due to premature unobserved wear. However, most train accidents today are a result of path intrusion, a train being somewhere it shouldn't be at that time. TPS virtually eliminate this problem.
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Old August 3rd, 2014, 03:26 PM   #2316
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TPS or not, SPAD or not, there is something odd about the position of the switches seen in the pictures.
This is the place: http://goo.gl/maps/47gJK





Whether the movement had been authorized or not, that double switch was not in a safe position, because it didn't protect the main line from intrusion.

The question here is that the siding was configured for routing another train:


In fact the double switch was set in a safe position to protect the green path, but leading to a conflict on the red one.

There isn't an actual safe position for that switch, since the whole siding lacks a safe dead end before merging into the main tracks... but my opinion is that, in case of parallel movements (red and green) that double switch should be kept straight.
There still would be an accident, but probably with less serious consequences (and not involving passenger traffic).
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Last edited by Wilhem275; August 3rd, 2014 at 11:59 PM.
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Old August 4th, 2014, 01:26 AM   #2317
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilhem275 View Post
probably with less serious consequences (and not involving passenger traffic).
The green path would be set for the regular S1 commuter train following into the station about 2-3 minutes later by timetable.
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Old August 4th, 2014, 02:43 AM   #2318
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Frankly, I believed those tracks were a siding... what a weird setup that station: with 9 passenger tracks available, the NBS from south goes straight into track 2 and four other paths have to squeeze into track 1.

Also, the FAZ article says the freight train was going from Duisburg to Hungary, I guess it's the opposite...
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Old August 4th, 2014, 10:07 AM   #2319
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilhem275 View Post
There isn't an actual safe position for that switch, since the whole siding lacks a safe dead end before merging into the main tracks... but my opinion is that, in case of parallel movements (red and green) that double switch should be kept straight.
There still would be an accident, but probably with less serious consequences (and not involving passenger traffic).
If left straight as you suggest, this could have led to a head-on collision,
much worse that the accident that actually happened. As you said, it is
not possible to have a 100% safe switch position with this track plan, but
I think DB engineers made the right choice.
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Old August 4th, 2014, 10:17 AM   #2320
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
However, most train accidents today are a result of path intrusion, a train being somewhere it shouldn't be at that time. TPS virtually eliminate this problem.
Not really. A TPS would trigger emergency brakes in case of signal passed
at red, but the accident would be avoided only if there is enough space
for braking between the signal and the point to protect. In stations this
is almost never the case, and trains, specially heavy freight ones, cannot
stop abruptly. In stations, track plans are usually too crowded to
leave enough space between signals and points to come to a complete stop.
It might very well be, in this accident, that the TPS triggered the brakes, but
did not manage to stop the train before the collision occured.

The main benefit of TPS is not really that it stops trains when a red signal is
passed. It's much more the fact that the deceleration of the train is
controlled when a signal is passed at caution (yellow) to ensure it will be
able to stop at the red that follows.
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