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Old November 22nd, 2017, 07:54 PM   #3361
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexNL View Post
"German style fare integration", you mean the "City mobil-ticket" which you can buy while booking a ticket?
Maybe the system, in which on a single ticket you can travel using all the means of transport in the neighborhood (not only in the city, but also in the rural areas tens or even hundreds of kilometers around), except for long-distance trains and buses.

You validate one ticket, board a train, transfer to a bus and still use the same ticket.

You buy a ticket, board a regional train, get to the city, and there you use the public transport still within a single ticket.

Because the whole ticketing system for buses, trams, subway and regional trains in a big area (with a radius of tens or hundreds of kilometers) is managed by a single body (called Verkehrsverbund).
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Old November 22nd, 2017, 10:58 PM   #3362
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Originally Posted by Jonesy55 View Post
Looks like these new S-bahn trains won't have much legroom!
Headroom looks a little cramped too.
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Old November 24th, 2017, 01:34 PM   #3363
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexNL View Post
"German style fare integration", you mean the "City mobil-ticket" which you can buy while booking a ticket?



How is this different from purchasing a "London travelcard" or "PLUSBUS" ticket while buying a ticket for National Rail services?
Only one city is called London in the UK.
Buying an long distance rail ticket with a bahncard gets you a citi ticket in both your departure city and destination city. Train journeys in regions or around urban areas, the train ticket is bought door to door or as a zonal ticket

Quote:
The NRW tariff applies for the travel connection you have chosen for the whole journey.

All tickets in the NRW tariff apply from “door-to-door”, i.e. buses, the Stadtbahn and the U-Bahn can be used at the start location and destination to the train station.
.
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Old November 25th, 2017, 11:40 AM   #3364
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Is the "City ticket" cheaper than buying just a normal city public transport ticket upon the arrival?
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Old November 25th, 2017, 12:16 PM   #3365
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Usually yes, plus its given for free to discount card (Bahn Card) holders.
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Old December 1st, 2017, 05:15 PM   #3366
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Well, who would have expected that - Stuttgart 21 will require 1 billion euro more and completion date 3 years later than expected sources here (click) and here (click).
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Old December 1st, 2017, 06:40 PM   #3367
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Is anything construction whise going smoothly at the moment in Germany?

BER airport is a disgrace
Motorways bridges are falling apart and works take forever to start and finish
Railway-projects are in the same boat.
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Old December 1st, 2017, 07:11 PM   #3368
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Quote:
Originally Posted by da_scotty View Post
Is anything construction whise going smoothly at the moment?
BER airport is a disgrace
Motorways bridges are falling apart and works take forever to start and finish
Railway-projects are in the same boat.
Well, one of Stuttgart 21 controversy was that its construction was to be managed by person which delivered Berlin Hauptbahnhof over time, over budget and in some parts under initial standard (too short roof on elevated platforms and cancelling of ceiling letting sunlight to underground platforms). So it was from beginning obvious that Stuttgart 21 will be also over time and budget, You may only guess how much and how late
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Old December 2nd, 2017, 05:30 PM   #3369
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Who would that be?
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Old December 2nd, 2017, 09:58 PM   #3370
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Quote:
Originally Posted by da_scotty View Post
Is anything construction whise going smoothly at the moment in Germany?

BER airport is a disgrace
Motorways bridges are falling apart and works take forever to start and finish
Railway-projects are in the same boat.
You seemed to fall victim to the notion that everything goes wrong in this country. As a matter of fact though, most projects go smoothly and they also get finished on time.
The station rebuilding in Halle, the upgrade of the Eisenach to Erfurt line as well as the complete rebuilding of the Berlin to Dresden line are finished right ahead of the timetable switch next weekend.
The high-speed line Erfurt to Bamberg go also in service next week, just as promised.
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Old December 3rd, 2017, 02:17 PM   #3371
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So Germans simply do so many infrastructural projects that some statistically have to go wrong, don't they?
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Old December 3rd, 2017, 02:48 PM   #3372
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Originally Posted by Kpc21 View Post
So Germans simply do so many infrastructural projects that some statistically have to go wrong, don't they?
Stuttgart 21, Berlin-Brandenburg airport and the Hamburg Philharmonie have all one in common:

They are the biggest and most expensive project in Germany currently. How likely is it that only these biggest projects suffer of bad planing while all other smaller projects don't?
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Old December 3rd, 2017, 02:58 PM   #3373
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Don't forget about the upgrade of the Karlsruhe-Basel railway, recently also a big fail.
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Old December 3rd, 2017, 03:47 PM   #3374
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Speaking of the Karlsruhe-Basel railway, is there any hope that after the August collapse of the tunnel the design will be modified so that the stretch in Rastatt will be above ground along to the A5 autobahn?
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Old December 3rd, 2017, 03:54 PM   #3375
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LtBk View Post
Who would that be?
I have read about that some time ago so unfortunately can't find it and provide link to that.

But on other hand we must bear in mind that costs can be predicted with high accuracy after you leave ground and foundations and as Stuttgart 21 is fully underground its final price can't be fully predicted. Although costs are still within worst case scenario estimates but posting them before works started would most certainly block the project. So the way of plunging into investment with fictive budget and its increase in later stage when it will be too late for halting works was chosen, affecting many other smaller projects. Stuttgart 21 simply shouldn’t progress into implementation as it is too pricy for achieved effects. Comparable project of Zürich Durchmesserlinie was priced at slightly over 2 billion Swiss Franc which is 1,7 billion Euro with today exchange rate compare to 7,5 billion presently estimated for Stuttgart 21.


Quote:
Originally Posted by touya
Speaking of the Karlsruhe-Basel railway, is there any hope that after the August collapse of the tunnel the design will be modified so that the stretch in Rastatt will be above ground along to the A5 autobahn
Most certainly not because tunnel was forced by local protests over noise concerns (not first such case in Germany).
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Old December 3rd, 2017, 07:52 PM   #3376
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Most certainly not because tunnel was forced by local protests over noise concerns (not first such case in Germany).
Are sure about this? Maybe you're misremembering and are confusing the protests with the ones that residents of Ötigheim, Bietigheim Durmersheim organized and that resulted in moving the northern approach of the line close to the B36?

Because east of Rastatt, along the A5, I can only see an industrial/third sector area. And the hamlet of Rauental could be protected with noise protection barriers.

Maybe the alignment in Rastatt was decided before the northern approach was moved out to the B36 alignment and it just stayed that way even if now it would make more sense to proceed along the A5?
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Old December 3rd, 2017, 08:39 PM   #3377
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Quote:
Originally Posted by touya View Post
Are sure about this? Maybe you're misremembering and are confusing the protests with the ones that residents of Ötigheim, Bietigheim Durmersheim organized and that resulted in moving the northern approach of the line close to the B36?
Because east of Rastatt, along the A5, I can only see an industrial/third sector area. And the hamlet of Rauental could be protected with noise protection barriers.
Maybe the alignment in Rastatt was decided before the northern approach was moved out to the B36 alignment and it just stayed that way even if now it would make more sense to proceed along the A5?
According to German Wikipedia DB decided to tunnel under Rastatt as a precautious measure after residents of Ötigheim, Bietigheim and Durmersheim successfully challenged expansion of corridor in their premises. Due to that above ground version of Rastatt wasn’t on design boards and at present it is impossible to revert that decision. There is only the question how to proceed with tunnelling to avoid further damages.
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Old December 3rd, 2017, 10:39 PM   #3378
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Going along A5 wouldn't be that easy.

The NBS would have to pass over the Rheintalbahn and A5 itself, and then cross several roads, rivers and railways at different levels.
At Rastatt Nord the A5 passes under some roads, and them climbs over the Rheintalbahn.
That route is straight and easy just on the map.

Beside that, the difficult part with the tunnel was just the Rheintalbahn dive-under, and they already fvcked that up, so...
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Old December 4th, 2017, 11:13 AM   #3379
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ValterPravnik View Post
Stuttgart 21, Berlin-Brandenburg airport and the Hamburg Philharmonie have all one in common:

They are the biggest and most expensive project in Germany currently. How likely is it that only these biggest projects suffer of bad planing while all other smaller projects don't?


That's actually pretty simple to explain, because it happens al around the world and it's called politics: The project scope you actually want is initially deemed too expensive to receive funding. Next the project scope is reduced to absolutely bare bone to reduce the budget. This plan gets approved. Then, as the project progresses, a point of no return is reached and more and more it is realised that the removed elements weren't nice to have but actually necesary for a good result and get readded as additional work at a higher cost. In the mean time, because of long lead times, legislation may have changed as well, leading to even more cost overruns.

This results in the original scope being built at addtional cost. The bigger the project the higher the change of this happening.
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Old December 5th, 2017, 12:49 PM   #3380
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Originally Posted by flierfy View Post
You seemed to fall victim to the notion that everything goes wrong in this country. As a matter of fact though, most projects go smoothly and they also get finished on time.
The station rebuilding in Halle, the upgrade of the Eisenach to Erfurt line as well as the complete rebuilding of the Berlin to Dresden line are finished right ahead of the timetable switch next weekend.
The high-speed line Erfurt to Bamberg go also in service next week, just as promised.
Was that the promised date? They started building on it back in the days that we were dancing the Macarena, Diana was still alive and the Belgiums still had capital punishment. And we paid with Guilders, Francs, Marks...

That's really an excessive long time, even to Dutch standards, even with the construction halt in between for 4 years.
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