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Old February 6th, 2012, 06:01 PM   #1241
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makita09

Note to self. When Suburbanist comes into my shop offer him something extra for free. He'll decline and then buy something else. Not only that he'll opt for something with absolutely no economies of scale!
I am not telling that economies of scale wouldn't exist, just that this kind of arrangement, especially considering they are being made by two "flagship companies", should be ringing the bell of
Competition authority in Bruxelles.

It seems collusion: we DB put out an unreasonably tight scheduled tender, Siemens bids and wins (and not Alstom, Bombardier, CAF or AnsladoBreda), but we are cool that you delay the trains because you will deliver couple more units.

That is why I prefer monetary fines for this kind of delay, it avoids the smell of corruption even if there is none actual corruption
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Old February 6th, 2012, 06:06 PM   #1242
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But also, as an aside, I can't believe you're actually suggesting anyone would still place an order with ansaldoBreda, that company is in a terrible state!
lol Suburbanist is a total AnsaldoBreda troll. Whenever some negative news (i.e. facts) about AnsaldoBreda surfaces, he is the first to downplay it and say that nothing is wrong with AnsaldoBreda, and it is all the fault of the people ordering the trainsets ("they keep changing their order", etc.).

I don't know why this is. Maybe he has AnsaldoBreda stock. Maybe he works there. Maybe he has Italian roots and takes attacks on Italian companies personal?


But if you really want to laugh, read his explanations on how urban sprawl is the pinnacle of freedom and prosperity
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Old February 6th, 2012, 06:11 PM   #1243
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post

It seems collusion: we DB put out an unreasonably tight scheduled tender, Siemens bids and wins (and not Alstom, Bombardier, CAF or AnsladoBreda), but we are cool that you delay the trains because you will deliver couple more units.
lol, AnsaldoBreda bid on a reasonably scheduled tender in the Netherlands, offering to do it for such a low price that they had to win the bid.
There are also delays, but UNLIKE Siemens, they don't offer a free train, but instead offer MORE delays, costing millions upon millions for, eventually, the Dutch traveller and tax payer.

I'd rather go with the Siemens scenario. A free train that works.
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Old February 6th, 2012, 07:39 PM   #1244
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silly_Walks

lol, AnsaldoBreda bid on a reasonably scheduled tender in the Netherlands, offering to do it for such a low price that they had to win the bid.
There are also delays, but UNLIKE Siemens, they don't offer a free train, but instead offer MORE delays, costing millions upon millions for, eventually, the Dutch traveller and tax payer.

I'd rather go with the Siemens scenario. A free train that works.
Whatever, the reasoning stay: that smells collusion to "keep the money in Germany" like some SNCF practices seem to be collusion with Alstom.

In 2012 that is totally unjustifiable.
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Old February 6th, 2012, 10:05 PM   #1245
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Whatever, the reasoning stay: that smells collusion to "keep the money in Germany" like some SNCF practices seem to be collusion with Alstom.

In 2012 that is totally unjustifiable.
So you want Siemens to pay a fine, and then DB should use that money to buy one single trainset from a non-Germany manufacturer?

You were a lot less forgiving of AnsaldoBreda when they did far worse. Your double standards worry me, young Padewan.
Denmark and The Netherlands should get 10 extra trainsets from AnsaldoBreda for free for their horrible behaviour... too bad it would take till 2050 for them to arrive.
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Old February 6th, 2012, 10:09 PM   #1246
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And they still won't work best thing AB could do is to DIE!
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Old February 6th, 2012, 10:12 PM   #1247
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Forget AnsaldoBreda, I just mentioned them among other European train makers. Btw, it gave 43% discount to the Danish because of the delay on the IC4.

DB wouldn't buy one extra train initially, otherwise it would have ordered 17 and not 16 train sets first place. So it should get the fine and end of story. If it decides to order more trains, so be it: a new tender.

Unless, of course, DB were privatized and stopped getting public money. Then it should be free to take its own decisions.
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Old February 6th, 2012, 11:31 PM   #1248
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In case of an accident it's more useful an extra train than 30 millions in abank account. DB discovered that when an ICE3MF was damaged beyond repair after an accident, requiring replacement by a French TGV. Cisalpino discovered that when it had to rent trains to replace the ETR 470 and late delivered ETR 610. And there are certainly many more examples where a single train (that isn't worth ordering alone via a tender) is well worth. By the way, the EU accept that. And even AnsaldoBreda, when it delivered two extra Sirio tramways to Goteborg. Or Iveco, as it gave some free buses to Milan because of problems with its products.
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Old February 7th, 2012, 01:28 AM   #1249
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
DB wouldn't buy one extra train initially, otherwise it would have ordered 17 and not 16 train sets first place. So it should get the fine and end of story. If it decides to order more trains, so be it: a new tender.
Delivering an additional train-set is the cheapest way for Siemens as it is the most beneficial compensation Deutsche Bahn (and its costumers) could get. Remember DB is rather short on rolling stock. So, one more train-set doesn't harm. It is a good deal for both companies. Nothing fishy, really.
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Old February 7th, 2012, 08:05 AM   #1250
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Quote:
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Unless, of course, DB were privatized and stopped getting public money. Then it should be free to take its own decisions.
DB doesn't get public money for its long distance network.
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Old February 17th, 2012, 10:34 PM   #1251
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A full length train ride on the S1 Line of the Rhine-Main S-Bahn.



(Was placed Wrongly by me in the Rhine-Ruhr transport thread)

By the way, when I watched this last night, I could only last a few minutes before having to turn the volume down, as the 'motor hum' (at least I think that's what was causing it) was too distracting for me. Is there any Heath and Safety regulation that would prevent train drivers from Not being allowed ear plugs of some kind?

When the train was at it's highest speed, the rush of wind going past would alleviate any noise, so it would be alright then.
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Old February 18th, 2012, 04:37 AM   #1252
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In the USA, some railroads issue/allow their drivers to use noise-canceling headsets that are plugged into their radios.

Mike
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Old February 18th, 2012, 02:58 PM   #1253
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IanCleverly View Post
By the way, when I watched this last night, I could only last a few minutes before having to turn the volume down, as the 'motor hum' (at least I think that's what was causing it) was too distracting for me.
I think you're actually referring to the air conditioning. It doesn't sound that loud, and remember the audio has been dynamic-range compressed, so don't infer too much from it.
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Old February 18th, 2012, 05:08 PM   #1254
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I agree. Most of the noise in a modern train's cab (especially EMUs) is due to the air conditioning "wind", and to aerodynamic noise at high speeds.
Two types of noise which typically cameras tend to amplify.

Older machines where very noisy inside, while in modern trains much has been done to reduce this problem
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Old March 25th, 2012, 08:16 PM   #1255
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Munich

S Bahn S3 Railroad Monachium-Augsburg




Muncih Pasing (obecnie modernizowana)



Station Munich Moosach (S Bahn 1 / U Bahn 3)


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Old March 25th, 2012, 10:56 PM   #1256
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very dangerous situation at the last video. DB should install some PSDs there. Not overnight, but on a long-term plan to make stations safer and platforms more physically isolated from the tracks.
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Old March 25th, 2012, 11:23 PM   #1257
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Why waste money for saving lifes of people who can't understand the simplest rules of railway - no standing on the edge, no walking on the track? It better spend that money for satisfying actual paying customers?
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Old March 25th, 2012, 11:29 PM   #1258
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Quote:
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very dangerous situation at the last video. DB should install some PSDs there. Not overnight, but on a long-term plan to make stations safer and platforms more physically isolated from the tracks.
I swear to god, you are worse than a woman. Everywhere in railway section I see your replies about "fences, railroads not safe, not secure, and etc..." I think if railroads will have 10 foot fences, you still will find to complain about. Be REAL....
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Old March 26th, 2012, 05:10 AM   #1259
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Why waste money for saving lifes of people who can't understand the simplest rules of railway - no standing on the edge, no walking on the track? It better spend that money for satisfying actual paying customers?
Saving life is always important. You can not count money = life.

Anyway thousands more people die walking on the stretts killed by drivers than walking on the edge of the platforms, nobody died on this video.
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Old March 26th, 2012, 07:58 AM   #1260
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I swear to god, you are worse than a woman. Everywhere in railway section I see your replies about "fences, railroads not safe, not secure, and etc..." I think if railroads will have 10 foot fences, you still will find to complain about. Be REAL....
I just want them to be more isolated and segregated, in line with my philosophy that each type of vehicle must have its own ROW and be physically protected. Just that.
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