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Old September 6th, 2005, 01:57 PM   #41
greg_christine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Insiders
Hi to all, I’m new to this forum but hope to contribute with some information as I believe some of the statement made by ITC and new reports tend to mislead :-

...
3. ITC director, Sukmawaty claimed that “ICMI Monorail was a proven technology which had been in use for 40 years” is very MISLEADING as ICMI do not have the experience nor monorail technology whatsoever (they do not have a prototype as claimed). How can ICMI build a prototype without the necessary technology? ICMI want US$ 20 M for a prototype. Who will want to pay for their experiment in the development of a prototype and pray that it work and what will happen if it does not work or they are unable to complete? To be patriotic for a good and proper cause is good but please do not waste unnecessary private investors’ or public money. I do not think it is in the interest of Omnico to pay proper money and later pray and hope that ICMI can deliver on their promise.
...
6. Omnico Spore presented to DKI that they will Financial Close if PT JM buy from an established rolling stock supplier (Rotem Korea) and there is no financial difficulty on their part even if the cost is more expensive. ITC presented ICMI claiming that they are much cheaper and if ICMI is selected, they are ready to Financial Close.
...

I don't understand the assumption that the Rotem approach represents lower risk:

1. The articles in the press imply that ICMI would use the design of the Seattle Monorail as a starting point. The drawings are in the public domain. The question is not whether ICMI can develop a bogie design but rather whether ICMI can accurately replicate the Seattle design. Guideway switches and other details are more likely to be a problem though Mtrans has shown that such issues are not insurmountable. The Seattle/Mtrans design is not perfect. It has been criticized due to its poor ride quality; however, it is capable of doing the job. Hitachi offers the best monorail system; however, that approach was tried and proved not to be affordable.

2. To the best of my knowledge, Rotem has never built a maglev transit line. Rotem has a short test track and a prototype car. Developmental issues are inevitable in the construction of the first transit system. I would actually be more concerned with the construction of a maglev system because very tight tolerances must be maintained in the guideway structure. The gap between the levitation magnets and the guideway rails is only about 10 mm - 12 mm.
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Old September 6th, 2005, 02:24 PM   #42
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Old September 6th, 2005, 06:28 PM   #43
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the monorail is the most beautiful transport system
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Old September 22nd, 2005, 03:17 PM   #44
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Old October 13th, 2005, 04:46 PM   #45
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How is the progress on the monorail? Have they re-started work?
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Old October 13th, 2005, 06:33 PM   #46
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Its great that Jakarta is continuing its path towards rapid transit. I think one of the problems is that the trains themselves are too short and therefore have limited capacity.
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Old October 14th, 2005, 12:46 AM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ssiguy2
Its great that Jakarta is continuing its path towards rapid transit. I think one of the problems is that the trains themselves are too short and therefore have limited capacity.
The size of the trains is just one factor in determining system capacity. The monorail has a tremendous advantage in being a grade-separated system. The length of the trains is only limited by the length of the station platforms. The frequency of the trains can be as short as 90 seconds.

Consider the numbers for an at-grade light rail system operating on city streets. The trains are limited by the length of a city block, otherwise they would block intersections while standing at stations. This generally limits the trains to three or four vehicles. A four vehicle train of about 360 feet in length can carry a maximum of about 800 passengers. If traffic signal pre-emption is provided, the frequency of the trains is limited to about six minutes. A typical light cycle time at a major intersection is about one minute. Trains operating at six minute intervals in each direction would interrupt on average every third traffic signal cycle. This is about the limit that traffic engineers are willing to accept. The result is that no more than ten trains per hour in each direction can be accommodated. The result is a limit of about 8000 passengers per hour per direction (pphpd). Trains can run more frequently if there is no traffic signal pre-emption; however, this leads to an adverse impact on operating speed.

Compare this to even a modest sized train that operates on a grade-separated line. Even a relatively small train with a capacity of 200 passengers operating at intervals of 90 seconds (40 trains per hour) can acheive 8000 pphpd. Some of the larger Japanese monorail trains are capable of carrying over 600 passengers. System capacities well in excess of 20,000 pphpd are achievable.
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Old October 14th, 2005, 01:55 AM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by luked6
How is the progress on the monorail? Have they re-started work?
The Jakarta monorail project is at a standstill because of political wranglings with no breakthrough in sight : http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showth...45#post5493645
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Old October 21st, 2005, 01:28 PM   #49
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Jakarta Post: Omnico quits monorail consortium

http://www.thejakartapost.com/detail...021.G01&irec=0

Omnico quits monorail consortium, Sutiyoso says
The Jakarta Post, Jakarta

In another blow to the country's hopes of attracting foreign investment to the infrastructure sector, Governor Sutiyoso has announced the withdrawal of Omnico Singapore Pte. Ltd. from PT Jakarta Monorail (JM), the consortium selected to construct and operate the city's monorail project.

"Omnico is no longer in the consortium. PT Jakarta Monorail has a new partner," Sutiyoso told reporters at City Hall after a meeting with JM executives on Thursday.

PT Jakarta Monorail is owned by PT Indonesia Transit Central (55 percent) and Omnico Singapore Pte. Ltd. (45 percent).

Sutiyoso did not say why Omnico had quit the consortium nor give any details of the new partner. He did hint, however, that the new partner was a foreign company.

"They (JM executives) have just informed us at today's meeting that they will sign a deal with investors by the end of this month," Sutiyoso said.

He also said that some local investors had expressed interest in taking part in the project.

"They (the executives of PT Jakarta Monorail) have promised that they will finalize the financial stuff by the end of this month and then they will proceed to fast-track the development of the project," Sutiyoso said.

PT JM president director Ruslan Diwiryo and director Sukmawaty Syukur, who were present during the meeting, declined to comment on Sutiyoso's statement.

But through her cellular phone, Sukmawaty said pm Thursday evening that JM was still in the process of increasing the company's capital.

In trying to increase the company's capital, she said, ITC has the right to dilute Omnico's shares if it fails to add shares, and replace it with another company.

"There are many other investors who are interested in the monorail project," she added.

Omnico's executive director Leon K.L. denied on Thursday that his company had quit the consortium, but refused to go into details.

"No, we have not quit the consortium. Who said so? But I cannot explain today because I'm at a meeting ... I will answer your questions tomorrow (on Friday)," Leon told The Jakarta Post by cellular phone on Thursday.

The appointment of the Indonesian Monorail Industry Consortium (ICMI), which is partly owned by Vice President Jusuf Kalla's Bukaka Group, to supply the rolling stock has sparked rifts between PT Indonesia Transit Central (ITC) and Omnico.

Omnico has rejected ITC's decision to use ICMI technology and proposed rolling stocks produced by South Korea's Rotem instead.

"Price is one thing, but safety cannot be compromised! Hundreds of thousands of people will be carried by the monorail everyday," Leon told the Post in the recent interview.

He also said that Omnico would prefer to quit PT Jakarta Monorail if ITC insisted on going ahead with its plan to use ICMI technology.

"Omnico and the rest of the shareholders are business-focused people. We are neither a charity organization nor a political grouping. If the business proposal does not make sense and is not bankable and deliverable, we will chose to discontinue," he said.

ICMI is a local consortium led by Bukaka, whose shares are partly owned by Jusuf Kalla and two state firms. The consortium is supported by state rolling stock manufacturer PT INCA and the Bandung-based, state-owned National Electronics Institute (LEN).

Leon said earlier that Omnico had invested some US$10 million in the project, but Sukmawaty denied Leon's statement.

"There is no evidence that Omnico has invested that much money," she asserted.

Sukmawaty said that the total project cost would only be $489 million if JM used ICMI technology, while with Rotem the cost would come in at $826 million.
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Old October 24th, 2005, 01:02 PM   #50
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Jakarta Post: Monorail to go on in spite of raging internal dispute

http://www.thejakartapost.com/detail...024.H08&irec=7

Monorail to go on in spite of raging internal dispute
Bambang Nurbianto and Tertiani ZB Simanjuntak, The Jakarta Post, Jakarta

Despite questions about financing, troubled joint venture firm PT Jakarta Monorail (JM) is confident it can complete the first five kilometers of the city's monorail system from Casablanca to Karet, South Jakarta, by March 2007.

During a visit to The Jakarta Post last week, JM director Sukmawaty Syukur said that the project was on schedule despite several delays due to changes in the masterplan.

"The monorail is the answer to the city's need for a mass, rapid and affordable transportation system," she said.

Saying Governor Sutiyoso supported the project and highlighting the environmentally friendly nature of the monorail, Sukmawaty said talks with several investors were underway.

"It's not that we have to get investors to cover the whole expenses of the project at one time ... we move on every step of the projects," Sukmawaty added.

However, the City Council said it needed to see more proof of financial security before it would give its approval for the partially city-backed project to continue.

In its agreement with the city administration, the consortium has to prove it could provide financing for the project by the end of October at the latest.

City Council Commission D member for development affairs Arkeno said that the commission would summon JM by the end of this month to update the commission on its progress.

Arkeno said the council supported the development of monorail projects but said JM should be able to convince other investors to take part.

"If the company has no ability to find investors and the financing cannot be completed in October, we may recommend that the city administration find other partners for the project," he added.

An ongoing dispute between JM shareholders: PT Indonesia Transit Central (ITC) that holds 55 percent of shares and Omnico Singapore Pte. Ltd. that holds the remaining 45 percent.

"If the dispute between the two cannot be resolved, there will be no financial institution interested in the project," Arkeno told the Post on Saturday.

Last week, Sutiyoso in a surprise move announced the withdrawal of Omnico from the project and said ITC already had new partner.

However, Omnico executive director Leon K.L. denied the company had left the consortium.

The appointment of the Indonesian Consortium for Monorail Industries (ICMI) to supply the rolling stock has sparked a rift between PT Indonesia Transit Central (ITC) and Omnico.

ICMI is a local consortium chaired by Bukaka, whose shares are partly owned by Vice President Jusuf Kalla.

Omnico had rejected ITC's decision to use ICMI technology and proposed rolling stocks produced by South Korea's Rotem instead.

Sukmawaty, who is from ITC, said that the total project cost would only amount to $489 million if JM used ICMI technology, while Rotem's would cost $826 million.

"The project will be supervised by German's Siemens who has decades of experience (building) fast tracks. With all of the preparations we've made, there is no reason to stop this project," she said.
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Old October 24th, 2005, 07:51 PM   #51
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I know the diffence between monorail and SkyTrain but the ideas are the same.
Is there a difference in the price and are the trains relativly the same price?
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Old October 25th, 2005, 12:42 AM   #52
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wow, looks cool!
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Old November 24th, 2005, 05:55 AM   #53
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here's the Jakarta monorail thread

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showth...8&page=1&pp=20
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Old January 25th, 2006, 04:13 AM   #54
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Japan to Fund Jakarta Subway Construction

Japan to fund subway in traffic-clogged Indonesian capital: report

JAKARTA, Jan 23, 2006 (AFP) - Japan is to provide a 741 million dollar-loan towards a subway project in the traffic-clogged Indonesian capital, which currently has no mass-transit system, a report said Monday.

Japan's ambassador to Jakarta told the Jakarta Post that the subway, among several infrastructure projects that would be funded this year, would be built using Japanese technology.

The 85 billion yen (741 million dollar) project would run from Lebak Bulus in South Jakarta to Kota in Central Jakarta, the paper said.

The 1.5 percent loan, up from 1.3 percent previously charged due to Indonesia's improving growth rate per capita, will have a 40-year repayment period with a 10-year grace period.

Japan reportedly plans to finance projects worth some billion dollars this year in Indonesia and has pledged to speed up the disbursement of 420 million dollars from previous unused loan commitments.

A separate monorail is currently under construction in sprawling Jakarta, but it has been bedevilled by delays and disputes over the type of technology it will use. An elevated train system is also on the drawing board.
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Old January 25th, 2006, 04:30 AM   #55
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Japan feigning philanthropy and getting positive PR for it again? I can't blame them - it's been a moneymaker for them before.
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Old January 25th, 2006, 11:07 PM   #56
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That's good. Jakarta needs one. Isn't it the biggest city (or is it Lagos) without subway?
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Old January 26th, 2006, 12:14 AM   #57
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I'm surprise they dont have a subway yet.
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Old January 26th, 2006, 06:37 AM   #58
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The plan was scrapped because of Asia economic crisis back in the 90s.
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Old January 26th, 2006, 07:15 AM   #59
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and back to continue with Busway, Monorail, MRT and Subway for 2004 - 2012
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Old January 26th, 2006, 07:38 AM   #60
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Jakarta is one of the few megalopolis that doesn't have a metro system. It would be good for the city though!
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