daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > World Development News Forums > Supertalls

Supertalls Discussions of projects under construction between 300-599m/1,000-1,999ft tall.
Proposed Supertalls



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old November 24th, 2010, 05:13 AM   #3081
ghost101
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: London
Posts: 304
Likes (Received): 0

Quote:
Originally Posted by borza View Post
Where do the poor people live in Edmonton?

I guess I answered your question, dumbass
Russia have a social security system offering paid for housing for poor people?

If not where do these poor people live, or are there none in Moscow? I appreciate that there are unemployment benefits and other schemes, but they aren't going to be anywhere near as generous as in Edmonton.

Someone above said, it is professionals and the middle class living in large apartment blocks. What about the people working in jobs which pay poorly?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlekseyVT View Post
Moscow (like other Russian cities) haven't and has never had ghettos (unlike from USA with Harlem, New York or Brownsville, Brooklyn). If you have shitty districts in USA with big level of crime that it's don't mean that Russia have it.
Wow, Moscow must be amazing. A city of 10m people with no significant proportion of poor people. Only exception in the world it seems. Even in London you get concentration of the less well off with one of the most generous welfare systems in the world.

In reality, there are I suspect a lot of social housing with a concentration of poor people. That is simply how the world works. Wealth concentrates leaving other places worse off.
__________________
flickr

Last edited by ghost101; November 24th, 2010 at 05:21 AM.
ghost101 no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old November 24th, 2010, 05:20 AM   #3082
nguoisaigon
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 9
Likes (Received): 0

New clip
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shqXsq23lKc
nguoisaigon no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2010, 06:07 AM   #3083
coth
pride leader
 
coth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Moscow
Posts: 21,630
Likes (Received): 6818

Quote:
Originally Posted by ghost101 View Post
Russia have a social security system offering paid for housing for poor people?

If not where do these poor people live, or are there none in Moscow? I appreciate that there are unemployment benefits and other schemes, but they aren't going to be anywhere near as generous as in Edmonton.

Someone above said, it is professionals and the middle class living in large apartment blocks. What about the people working in jobs which pay poorly?
There is no unemployment in Moscow. There is overemployment. A lot more jobs than population. Hence why 5mln of illegals from all around the word in Moscow region.

There is no any housing market in Russia at the moment, so people lives in homes they got in Soviet time. Poor and middle class lives in same buildings, because housing was free in Soviet Union.
__________________
coth no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2010, 07:02 AM   #3084
hellrazor650
Registered User
 
hellrazor650's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Palo Alto
Posts: 320
Likes (Received): 10

Quote:
Originally Posted by nguoisaigon View Post
gtfo
hellrazor650 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2010, 07:33 AM   #3085
soloveich
Збагойный Ватнег
 
soloveich's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: California Republic
Posts: 5,935
Likes (Received): 7345

@botswana
here is Butovo neighborhood for you. A lot of jokes are made about it. So, check out for your self where poor people live.
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=287854
soloveich no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2010, 07:42 AM   #3086
Siberian
.
 
Siberian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Barnaul
Posts: 27,215
Likes (Received): 10145

Why some foreigners are so envy and anger?
Btw where are the mods, someone should stop this flood.
Siberian no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2010, 07:51 AM   #3087
Ulyssis
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 9,306
Likes (Received): 7378

Quote:
Originally Posted by ghost101 View Post
Russia have a social security system offering paid for housing for poor people?

If not where do these poor people live, or are there none in Moscow? I appreciate that there are unemployment benefits and other schemes, but they aren't going to be anywhere near as generous as in Edmonton.

Someone above said, it is professionals and the middle class living in large apartment blocks. What about the people working in jobs which pay poorly?



Wow, Moscow must be amazing. A city of 10m people with no significant proportion of poor people. Only exception in the world it seems. Even in London you get concentration of the less well off with one of the most generous welfare systems in the world.

In reality, there are I suspect a lot of social housing with a concentration of poor people. That is simply how the world works. Wealth concentrates leaving other places worse off.
Well it's time for you to expand your horizons

There are poor people in Moscow, of course.

However, you have to keep ijn mind that just 20 years ago the social landscape was quite flat. And after the communism collapsed everyone essntially get their apartments in full ownership. That's quite a capital, without any obligations, and even no real estate tax.


Most people who have no property in Moscow are newcomers, who tend to rely on their skills, not on social safety net. The isue will have to be addressed eventually, especially if there is a prolonged period of economic stagnation. So far, however, Moscow is booming and overflowed with money.
Ulyssis está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2010, 09:28 AM   #3088
AlekseyVT
BANNED
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Moscow City
Posts: 8,283
Likes (Received): 7059

Quote:
Originally Posted by ghost101 View Post
Wow, Moscow must be amazing. A city of 10m people with no significant proportion of poor people. Only exception in the world it seems. Even in London you get concentration of the less well off with one of the most generous welfare systems in the world.

In reality, there are I suspect a lot of social housing with a concentration of poor people. That is simply how the world works. Wealth concentrates leaving other places worse off.
I'm not saying that there is no poor people in Moscow. Moscow, like any global megapolis, has a lot of poor people.

But when a Western man sees a "bedroom areas" with commieblocks and calls it a "ghetto" or "slum", it causes confusion for me. I don't understand why the Brits or Americans like to operate such categories as "beautiful" / "ugly". The world is not white and black. It's just a ordinary buildings, where they can live quite wealthy people.

It's possible to see that all houses in the London outskirts look like Parlament building, all buildings in the Barcelona outskirts were designed by Antonio Gaudi or there are many historical buildings in the Rome outskirts.
AlekseyVT no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2010, 09:34 AM   #3089
AlekseyVT
BANNED
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Moscow City
Posts: 8,283
Likes (Received): 7059

Quote:
Originally Posted by Botswana View Post
So where do the POOR people live? Or do you Russians have a stick so far up your ass that you can't accept that there is poverty within your own nation?
Poor people live in houses (together with middle class), but not in the slums. Majority of these poor families were given an apartment in the Soviet era and privatized it in the 1990s. But this "poverty" can't be compared with the poverty somewhere in India, Brazil or Africa.

Moreover, if we talk about the center of Moscow - on the one floor of good Stalinist house can live the poor old man from a family of scientists (who got an apartment in the Soviet years) together with rich oligarch (who bought an neighboring apartment in the 1990s).

Last edited by AlekseyVT; November 24th, 2010 at 09:45 AM.
AlekseyVT no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2010, 01:32 PM   #3090
WFInsider
BANNED
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 4,158
Likes (Received): 4434

Quote:
Originally Posted by Botswana View Post
So where do the POOR people live? Or do you Russians have a stick so far up your ass that you can't accept that there is poverty within your own nation?
"Poverty" not only in Russia but in all over the world is a result of worldwide anti-human economic system which is working on country-parasite USA.
After collapse of USSR, "democrats-liberals" signed all Bretton-Woods documents and entered IMF. The main parameter of IMF is that country can have own currency ONLY in amount of dollar reserves of this country. So you can't invest in your own economic if you don't have huge amount of dollars. (In 1975, Germany, France, Japan and Switzerland was included in the list with USA - and now see how these countries are living "rich", because other world need to have its currencies to print own) THAT is what blocked any economic development of Russia. Second parameter is artificially created huge "credit percent" number which blocked any small business development.

+ I don't even say that because USSR received the main attack from Nazis and then defeated them, and in result half of country was bombed and 27 millions of heroes died, and then it should rebuilt everything which was destroyed, + 50 years of "cold war" special services operations to destabilise USSR; the "west" is living "good" now.

During 1990s, approximately 4 trillions $ were just came out of Russian economic. 1998 default was made by Larry Summers and other american "advisors".

And after that you wonder why Russia is living not so great as countries-parasites, which is stealing resources all over the world by direct occupations and indirect dollar financial pyramid?

Of course Russia and 5 billions of people (3 billions under poverty) are living bad. Because that is what global structure the planet has. With country-parasite and victims of its direct and indirect criminal actions.
WFInsider no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2010, 01:39 PM   #3091
crapzoid
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Adelaide
Posts: 176
Likes (Received): 10

Quote:
Originally Posted by Botswana View Post
I'm assuming since you're from Belarus, the last dictatorship in Europe, your government forces you to post such tripe, or else they arrest you.

I don't think Moscow has slums. It's way too cold in Russia for that. Don't most of the city's poorest residents just live in commie blocks? You don't see slums like those of Mumbai in a city like Moscow, the winter would just destroy them.
Wow, just wow. That's about as ignorant as one can get.
crapzoid no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2010, 02:01 PM   #3092
Turbosnail
Registered User
 
Turbosnail's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,993
Likes (Received): 266

Quote:
Originally Posted by WFInsider View Post
"Poverty" not only in Russia but in all over the world is a result of worldwide anti-human economic system which is working on country-parasite USA.
After collapse of USSR, "democrats-liberals" signed all Bretton-Woods documents and entered IMF. The main parameter of IMF is that country can have own currency ONLY in amount of dollar reserves of this country. So you can't invest in your own economic if you don't have huge amount of dollars. (In 1975, Germany, France, Japan and Switzerland was included in the list with USA - and now see how these countries are living "rich", because other world need to have its currencies to print own) THAT is what blocked any economic development of Russia. Second parameter is artificially created huge "credit percent" number which blocked any small business development.

+ I don't even say that because USSR received the main attack from Nazis and then defeated them, and in result half of country was bombed and 27 millions of heroes died, and then it should rebuilt everything which was destroyed, + 50 years of "cold war" special services operations to destabilise USSR; the "west" is living "good" now.

During 1990s, approximately 4 trillions $ were just came out of Russian economic. 1998 default was made by Larry Summers and other american "advisors".

And after that you wonder why Russia is living not so great as countries-parasites, which is stealing resources all over the world by direct occupations and indirect dollar financial pyramid?

Of course Russia and 5 billions of people (3 billions under poverty) are living bad. Because that is what global structure the planet has. With country-parasite and victims of its direct and indirect criminal actions.
That's a very warped view on the distribution of wealth in Russia. Don't forget Russia is not a true free market economy, for example oligarchs in Russia that will not allow the privatisation of companies and open up the market for industries such as oil because they do not want foreign hands having a say on the distribution of natural resources.

In theory Russia should be able to embrace globalisation and generate wealth for itself. Unfortunately it is shackled by corruption and greed.
Turbosnail no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2010, 03:01 PM   #3093
WFInsider
BANNED
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 4,158
Likes (Received): 4434

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turbosnail View Post
That's a very warped view on the distribution of wealth in Russia. Don't forget Russia is not a true free market economy, for example oligarchs in Russia that will not allow the privatisation of companies and open up the market for industries such as oil because they do not want foreign hands having a say on the distribution of natural resources.

In theory Russia should be able to embrace globalisation and generate wealth for itself. Unfortunately it is shackled by corruption and greed.
"Free market" economy. What are you talking about? This is a fairytale to hide actions of big corporations, which are spreading its interests by WTO and destroying local producers.

Those oligarchs is a result of 1990s chaos, artificially created for Russia.

Corruption is a result of laws-free 1990s.

Until Russia and many other countries will be in this economic cabal of western bankers and private central banks, which don't allow them to use own currency in interests of own country, there will be a parasite-victims structure of the world. And citizens of parasite country will teach victims how to live with "free market" to "become a good economy". Though, to become a good economy, you need to gain control on central bank and stop doing IMF and Bretton-Woods requirements, which are blocking development.
WFInsider no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2010, 03:42 PM   #3094
No1
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,364
Likes (Received): 1205

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turbosnail View Post
That's a very warped view on the distribution of wealth in Russia. Don't forget Russia is not a true free market economy, for example oligarchs in Russia that will not allow the privatisation of companies and open up the market for industries such as oil because they do not want foreign hands having a say on the distribution of natural resources.

In theory Russia should be able to embrace globalisation and generate wealth for itself. Unfortunately it is shackled by corruption and greed.
Best represent of "free market" economy in US is Wall Street
US also have oligarchs, only you do not call them oligarchs.
But when Warren Buffett want money from US goverment he get. And invest in GS and GS get money from US goverment and Citi and BoA...Even GM, but US goverment first destroy foreign competitors like Toyota and than US goverment rule over GM and create succesfull company
What free market?
When Spykers try to buy Saab(owned GM-controled by US goverment) GM stop that until russian stake owners move from Spyker.
When russain try to buy stakes in Deutsche Telekom, German goverment stop that.
When Canadian comapany try to get stakes in Opel, GM-US goverment stop that, reason is russian bank.
What free market?
But you love russian oil. Like african natural resource. So people in Africa dies in poverty but you have very cheap gas, electronics etc.
No1 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2010, 04:09 PM   #3095
hahahakojuv
BANNED
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 20
Likes (Received): 1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turbosnail View Post
That's a very warped view on the distribution of wealth in Russia. Don't forget Russia is not a true free market economy, for example oligarchs in Russia that will not allow the privatisation of companies and open up the market for industries such as oil because they do not want foreign hands having a say on the distribution of natural resources.

In theory Russia should be able to embrace globalisation and generate wealth for itself. Unfortunately it is shackled by corruption and greed.
I don't agree with you. Every country (in the EU, China etc.) has some industries which are essential for the country and which can't be sold. For Russia this is oil and gas, and even the state owned Rosneft will be sold by 2015 (it is in the new privatisation programm)

Another thing about the Oligarchs. Which companies are property of the oligarchs? Putin took them and made them state owned.

Gazprom and Rosneft are state owned companies and obnly Lukoil is private. So expand you horisons before you enter a discussion!
hahahakojuv no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2010, 04:14 PM   #3096
hahahakojuv
BANNED
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 20
Likes (Received): 1

Quote:
Originally Posted by ghost101 View Post
Russia have a social security system offering paid for housing for poor people?

If not where do these poor people live, or are there none in Moscow? I appreciate that there are unemployment benefits and other schemes, but they aren't going to be anywhere near as generous as in Edmonton.

Someone above said, it is professionals and the middle class living in large apartment blocks. What about the people working in jobs which pay poorly?



Wow, Moscow must be amazing. A city of 10m people with no significant proportion of poor people. Only exception in the world it seems. Even in London you get concentration of the less well off with one of the most generous welfare systems in the world.

In reality, there are I suspect a lot of social housing with a concentration of poor people. That is simply how the world works. Wealth concentrates leaving other places worse off.
I totally agree with you, of course there are poor people in Russia, more than in GB...

But, Moscow has a huge overemployment. I think that Moscow could use 1 or 2 million new people rightaway. Also the payments in Moscow are much higher that in the most regions in Russia and are pretty good. Medial income is higher than 1000 euro in Moscow anyway. So it has the highest income in Eastern Europe.

If your hands aren't growing out of your ass and you can do something you can earn money in Moscow. The unemployment there is 1%.

And Moscow doesn't really have really poor districts. The most are middleclass... or poor/middleclass. However, there are really rich districts. And the ugly commiblocks, you know in the Soviet Union all buildings were commiblocks so after 10 year economical growth you can't build enough normal houses to replace the commiblocks.
hahahakojuv no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2010, 06:31 PM   #3097
Assemblage23
▄bereinstimmend
 
Assemblage23's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: GDL
Posts: 4,902
Likes (Received): 8066

Is this thread really about FederationTower?
__________________


Wichtige ─nderungen beginnen immer mit ganz neuen Perspektiven.

-
Assemblage23 está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2010, 09:50 PM   #3098
SeregaRUS
Registered User
 
SeregaRUS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Russia, Saratov
Posts: 127
Likes (Received): 9



SeregaRUS no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 24th, 2010, 11:36 PM   #3099
roballan
Me want food
 
roballan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Mexico City / Puerto Montt
Posts: 4,158
Likes (Received): 6052

Awesome tower!!
__________________
CHILEXICO


roballan no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 25th, 2010, 12:02 AM   #3100
webeagle12
Registered User
 
webeagle12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Albany
Posts: 1,737
Likes (Received): 414

Quote:
Originally Posted by Assemblage23 View Post
Is this thread really about FederationTower?
used to be, now it's just a pure 100% trolling with no mods in sight..

PEOPLE this is construction forum..... :/
webeagle12 no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
mibc, moscow, spire

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 11:23 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

Hosted by Blacksun, dedicated to this site too!
Forum server management by DaiTengu