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Old July 7th, 2005, 08:05 PM   #341
aznichiro115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sequoias
I've never seen a New Flyer 40LF electric trolley bus before, most I've seen are diesel 40 feet and 60 feet models. Seattle has the New Flyer DE60LF (diesel electric 60 feet low floor). those are the hybrid ones. We also have the old M.A.N. 60 feet trolley bus and a few old breda 60 ft tunnel bus converted to electric only, added with new LED densination sign, LED turn signals, re-painted and rebuilt electric motor, that saves the king county metro transit buying brand new 60 feet trolley bus.
i know! i live in seattle.
arn't bredas replacing all of the old MANS?
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Old July 7th, 2005, 10:07 PM   #342
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Look out for TERRORISTS

Quote:
July 07, 2005
TransLink responds to London terrorism incidents

In light of the terrorist incidents that targeted the London transit system today, measures are being taken in the TransLink network. We are in touch with intelligence officials and, although there is no direct threat indicated in our region, additional operations and security staff are being deployed as a standard procedure. Other measures would be taken if a higher response level were needed.

As a matter of course, transit customers play an important part in the safety and well being of themselves and their fellow passengers.

We advise customers to please make yourself aware of the safety and security systems on SkyTrain cars and platforms. If you see anything that causes concern or appears to be amiss, talk to a staff member or security constable immediately.
http://www.translink.bc.ca/About_Tra...ws07070501.asp
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Old July 8th, 2005, 02:10 AM   #343
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Translink can't even stop the murders and crime going on around its SkyTrain stations, how would they protect themselves from terrorists.

If there ever was an attack in Canada it would definatly be the TTC subways.
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Old July 8th, 2005, 05:35 AM   #344
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ssiguy2
If there ever was an attack in Canada it would definatly be the TTC subways.
Unless it's timed with the 2010 Olympics.
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Old July 8th, 2005, 06:03 AM   #345
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To be honest, I'm scared for our city and with all the attention we will be getting in the years ahead before 2010. We need security with Athens proportions. The 12,000 personnel and $185 million budget won't do. We need at least 30,000 security personnels and a budget of $350-$400 million CDN.
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Old July 8th, 2005, 06:21 AM   #346
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Should have replaced and invested some of your money into LRT.
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Old July 8th, 2005, 09:17 AM   #347
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Quote:
Originally Posted by npinguy
there is just something a little bit odd that all the people speaking with authority on how much they hate RAV, how useless, expensive, and stupid it is, and how the City of Vancouver is impotent and incompetent........are not from vancouver.

We got a guy on Salt Spring Island, a guy in Portland, and a number of guys in Toronto.


How'bout doing us all a favour and STFU. The people of Vancouver support the line, support it's cost, and have confidence that the density around the line and other issues will all be resolved to our satisfaction. Why? Because we have no reason not to have confidence. Vancouver has no major city planning blunders in it's history, unlike most cities, and we are confident this will continue.
Vancouver has no major city planning blunders in it's history? LMFAO!!! If Vancouver is so great in its urban planning, then why is Translink such a hated organization? Why is your transit system viewed with such disgust?

When I was in Vancouver, all I hear is whining and complaining. The fares are too high. The system isn't comprehensive enough. The bus services are not available in certain areas. The Skytrain is riddled with crime. The people are commuting to the suburban office parks not served by transit. The traffic is horrendous. Are these the testimonials of a city with no planning blunders?

And as for fears of terrorist attacks, I'm with ssiguy2 on this one. You can't even protect the passengers of Skytrain from murderers and robbers, how can you possibly protect it from well organized terror groups who have a lot of experience and training to blow up well secured subway networks such as the London Underground? Although honestly, Vancouverites who are bored to death just love to scare themselves from other city's disasters. Its kind of like when Seattle had that little earthquake but still did some minor damage within their city and Vancouver goes crazy and pretend its their own.
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Old July 8th, 2005, 09:51 AM   #348
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mr.x
I did some research of my own and I've found out that the electrical system of our new trolleys are made in Germany by a company called Kiepe-Electrik. The bus is put together by New Flyer in Winnipeg.
Say no more! We had and still have many operational problems with their poles in San Francisco. I hope you guys don't get stuck with many lemons!
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Old July 8th, 2005, 10:13 AM   #349
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The last thing I worry about is terrorism. 2010 will be a safe games.
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Old July 8th, 2005, 10:12 PM   #350
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Turnstiles are a "Priced Option" for the RAV Line - Translink just needs to decide on whether to add them to the system or not. Here's a background section excerpt from the Feb 16th Translink Board meeting agenda when they decided to proceed with 2 other Priced Options - the 2nd Ave. Station and the Pedestrain/Bike path under the RAV Fraser River North Arm Bridge. This excerpt explains the Priced Options. Note that the provision for future stations (i.e. level section of track, etc.) are essential elements - as well as for the ability to install turnstiles in future. The Priced Options are whether to accelerate those items to be in place for opening day.

********************

BACKGROUND

The Contributing Agencies’ Essential Elements for the Richmond-Airport Vancouver
Rapid Transit Project (the “RAV Project”) included that the infrastructure should be
designed to accommodate the following:
• Future station at 57th Avenue and Cambie Street;
• Future station at 2nd Avenue and Cambie Street;
• Future station at 33rd Avenue and Cambie Street;
• Future station at Capstan Way; and,
• Controlled access at all stations.

Furthermore, the Best and Final Offer (BAFO) Invitation requested that the Proponents
include the following as Priced Options in their BAFO Proposals for consideration by the
GVTA Board:
• 57th Avenue Station;
• 2nd Avenue Station;
• Controlled Access Stations; and
• Fraser River Bicycle and Pedestrian Lane.

These Priced Options are not Essential Elements of the RAV Project, and are therefore
outside of the RAV Project scope of work. The determination of whether or not to
proceed with any or all of the Priced Options is entirely the decision of the GVTA, and
establishing the funding sources for any associated construction and operations costs
would be the responsibility of the GVTA.


Staff evaluated each of the Priced Options requested in the BAFO Invitation, and in
December 2004 brought forward to the Board descriptions of the estimated impacts for
each Priced Option and recommendations on each of the Priced Options, taking the
following factors into consideration:
• GVTA Three Year Plan/Ten Year Outlook;
• GVTA policy decisions and commitments; and
• Value for money.

On December 1st, 2004, the Board provided approval that the GVTA:

A. Maintain future provision for 57th Avenue Station, but does not proceed with
construction until significant net transportation benefits can be realized; and

B. Advance 2nd Avenue Station Priced Option to the Preferred Proponent stage to:
1. Confirm the capital and operating cost impacts;
2. Confirm the value of the City of Vancouver funding commitment;
3. Assess potential for GVTA funding; and,
4. Report back with final recommendation prior to Commercial Close; and

C. Advance the Bicycle and Pedestrian Lane Priced Option to the Preferred
Proponent stage to:
1. Assess the feasibility of the Preferred Proponent’s bike lane design;
2. Assess safety and security issues;
3. Confirm cost estimates; and,
4. Report back with final recommendation prior to Commercial Close; and

D. Advance the Controlled Access Stations Priced Option to the Preferred Proponent
stage to:
1. Confirm cost estimates;
2. Secure option pricing to Financial Close; and,
3. Report back prior to Financial Close with controlled access
recommendations for the RAV Line, including implications for existing
systems.

Two of the Priced Options have a material impact on critical path design elements of the
RAV Project, the Fraser bridge crossing and the 2nd Avenue tunnel boring machine
launch site. These two Priced Options are presented here for final consideration of the
Board to include or exclude them as part of the RAV Project prior to Commercial Close.
In order to meet the Project schedule, these decisions are required in accordance with the
following schedule:
• February 16, 2005: GVTA Board decisions
• March 31, 2005: Completion of Concession Agreement
If these Priced Options are not included in the RAV Project, the RAV Line must still be
designed to accommodate a future decision to construct the 2nd Avenue Station in
accordance with the Essential Elements, but no accommodation will be made for a future
decision to add a Fraser River Bicycle and Pedestrian Lane.

Staff will report back to the Board prior to September 30, 2005 with Controlled Access
recommendations for the RAV Line


***********************

So expect a decision on turnstiles in October - McCallum is just getting the ball rolling politically for the vote....
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Last edited by officedweller; July 8th, 2005 at 10:19 PM.
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Old July 8th, 2005, 10:27 PM   #351
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The existing trolleys often have their poles go off line at intersections and corners. Hopefully it won;t be worse than that.
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Old July 9th, 2005, 03:51 AM   #352
en
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wally
When I was in Vancouver, all I hear is whining and complaining. The fares are too high. The system isn't comprehensive enough. The bus services are not available in certain areas. The Skytrain is riddled with crime. The people are commuting to the suburban office parks not served by transit. The traffic is horrendous. Are these the testimonials of a city with no planning blunders?

And as for fears of terrorist attacks, I'm with ssiguy2 on this one. You can't even protect the passengers of Skytrain from murderers and robbers, how can you possibly protect it from well organized terror groups who have a lot of experience and training to blow up well secured subway networks such as the London Underground?
This is all true, the SkyTrain "police" is useless, I usually see them talking among themselves or trying checking tickets and writing the crazy $173 fine for fares. Its pretty sad that they need to hire "police" to check tickets.
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Old July 9th, 2005, 04:23 AM   #353
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I think we should put things in perspective. Winnipeg envies vancouver's situation of growing transit ridership. In Winnipeg ridership has been declining since the 1960s. I heard that Vancouver has the highest percentage public transit ridership in Canada. Yes Vancouver has problems with its transit but at least its growing, not dying.
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Old July 9th, 2005, 07:29 AM   #354
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wally
You can't even protect the passengers of Skytrain from murderers and robbers, how can you possibly protect it from well organized terror groups who have a lot of experience and training to blow up well secured subway networks such as the London Underground?
I'd say the Underground is a more dangerous design than Skytrain. Elevated stations have much higher visibility, especially the M-line's glassy, well-lit stations. Also, Skytrain generally runs more frequently, so you're not stuck standing on the platform for as long. I can't say I noticed very many security personnel in London either.
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Old July 9th, 2005, 08:51 AM   #355
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"Preparations for the Vancouver 2010 Olympics are progressing so well, it's boring. We'd like there to be some challenges, so we [the IOC] could shout at them." - IOC (Sept. 2007)


"In medieval Europe if you didn't like somebody's argument and couldn't think of a real response you called them a witch and demanded they be burned at the stake. In the US you call them unpatriotic, and in Canada you call them racist."
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Old July 9th, 2005, 09:57 AM   #356
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Haber
I think we should put things in perspective. Winnipeg envies vancouver's situation of growing transit ridership. In Winnipeg ridership has been declining since the 1960s. I heard that Vancouver has the highest percentage public transit ridership in Canada. Yes Vancouver has problems with its transit but at least its growing, not dying.
Where did you hear Vancouver has the highest percentage of public transit ridership in Canada? I thought its only like 12 percent or so of GVRD residents ride transit. I would think Calgary would have a higher percentage given that for a population of less than a million, their LRT system alone carries 200k passengers a day. That doesn't count bus lines. And of course, there is Toronto whom I would think given its much more extensive network, would have a higher percentage than car loving Vancouver.

Vancouver should be the last city in which Winnipeg should use as an example. Its transit expansion have been driven solely by politics, not by sound urban planning. The GVRD LRSP is a really excellent model so if you hear of things like "sound urban planning from Vancouver", then that must be what you would be thinking off. But as far as implementing it, well, that is another story....
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Old July 9th, 2005, 10:13 AM   #357
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rise_against
Should have replaced and invested some of your money into LRT.
Ah no. Trolley buses are good at what they do: quickly move people relatively small distances at a low cost, while operating on a street with mixed traffic.
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Old July 9th, 2005, 10:26 AM   #358
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I may post too much, but anways. Forgive me for my lack of knowledge on the SkyTrain, but I wanted to know if it runs over any city medians in the downtown area - like in Chicago or Jamaica Ave. in New York? Secondly, if there are sections of the SkyTrain running underground, why don't they just call it a subway. It would be somewhat less confusing then, you know - SKYtrain and all. lol

Sorry, half of you have probably seen me post this already-->
Revenue from Ridership:
Vancouver - %40 (maybe it's all the people sneaking on, I didn't find out about the honour system they used until I found this thread)
Toronto - %90 (No comment)

Just be happy your getting a new rapid transit line being built in Vancouver. I wish to God the TTC would be able to build a new line. The Sheppard line is like only FOUR stations, and the Spadina line doesn't even go near the airport.
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Old July 9th, 2005, 10:48 AM   #359
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SkyTrain is mostly elevated, hence the name. But it's basically all underground downtown, not above medians.

And are those revenue numbers for the city's whole transit systems? I haven't heard about it in awhile, but last I heard, the SkyTrain system itself doesn't really run much of an operating loss, if any.
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Old July 9th, 2005, 10:59 AM   #360
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^ Talk about denial! Look what I found while googling.

Money-losing Millennium Line falls far short of targeted ridership
Numbers up over 2003 but goal still 'years' away: McCallum

Frank Luba Sound Off
The Province

May 16, 2005

Ridership on SkyTrain's Millennium Line this year is up 34 per cent over 2003 but is still well below its target and TransLink chairman Doug McCallum says it will be "years" before it gets there.

Weekday boardings in February were 48,100, compared to 35,900 in February 2003.

Add in weekday boardings from Columbia station and the total jumps to 59,100, according to a report going Friday to TransLink's board.

But the target predicted by B.C.'s Rapid Transit Project Office, which oversaw construction of the Millennium Line, was to have 75,000 boardings per day by 2006.

"We won't be hitting those [targets] for a couple of years," McCallum said yesterday.

"I think it will reach its targets once we build light rail out to the northeast sector." The extension will link Coquitlam Town Centre with the Millennium Line.

McCallum also said a number of commercial and residential projects planned for the Millennium Line will also boost ridership.

But they are still in the works and the light-rail connection isn't likely to be completed until "early in 2009."

The older Expo SkyTrain Line, which is crammed like a sardine can at peak hours, covers its operating expenses.

The Millennium Line lost $27 million in 2003 but McCallum isn't sure of current losses.

In 2003, the Millennium Line dropped about $17 million more than it collected in fares and also incurred extra expenses such as borrowing costs, a new works yard, computer changes, bus loops and paying for a portion of a waterfront park in New Westminster.

None of that includes the cost of paying for the $1.172-billion project, which was picked up by the province.

The problems with the Millennium Line ridership do not sway McCallum's support of the $1.72- billion Richmond-Airport-Vancouver rapid transit project, which is expected to have riders going to Richmond at the same time as travellers head into Vancouver.

"The ridership is there and will be even greater when it's finished," said McCallum.

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