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Old December 30th, 2012, 03:40 PM   #4561
madferret
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Originally Posted by Motortownman View Post
Salford Crescent to Preston £10.10 or on the same train Manchester Piccadilly to Preston £6. So just get on at Salford onto the same train.
You're not comparing like with like. The £6 fare has conditions attached, which include boarding and alighting at the specified stations and using a particular train. The dearer fare (I think it's £10.60) lets you take any train that day. If you were making a return trip the same day the standard fare is £10.70. Your Piccadilly tickets would cost you £12 for two. Apples and oranges.

You might get away with it once or twice but if your ticket is checked and you're getting off early or starting late you can be prosecuted for intent to avoid payment of the fare, which can give you a criminal record. It's not worth it in my view.
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Old December 30th, 2012, 04:42 PM   #4562
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It's bureaucratic crap. It's designed to extract as much money as possible from people who are already paying ludicrous fares.

It's the equivalent of getting a mobile phone on contract then being told you have to pay the full £200 cost of the phone because you didn't use all the features. It might be stipulated in the terms and conditions but it is pathetic, goes against common sense and ought to be illegal for them to even threaten you in this way. The same goes for other aspects of tickets - like if you get an advance ticket but miss your train you cannot, for example, pay the difference and swap for an open ticket, or if you buy a single, but then decide you need a return you cannot pay the difference and get the return.

These policies are all stupid, and if any other company selling something else had similar policies they would be out of business very quickly. The railways only get away with it because they have a monopoly, and the government should be stepping in to change the situation.
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Old December 30th, 2012, 05:05 PM   #4563
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Except the railway network stretches beyond London and the M25, so you can bet your sweet ass that government don't give two turds
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Old December 30th, 2012, 06:43 PM   #4564
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As long as the tickets dont specify specific services you dont have to get off and reboard if you have two tickets that cover the entire route.
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Old December 30th, 2012, 08:32 PM   #4565
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gerbil View Post
It's bureaucratic crap. It's designed to extract as much money as possible from people who are already paying ludicrous fares.

It's the equivalent of getting a mobile phone on contract then being told you have to pay the full £200 cost of the phone because you didn't use all the features. It might be stipulated in the terms and conditions but it is pathetic, goes against common sense and ought to be illegal for them to even threaten you in this way. The same goes for other aspects of tickets - like if you get an advance ticket but miss your train you cannot, for example, pay the difference and swap for an open ticket, or if you buy a single, but then decide you need a return you cannot pay the difference and get the return.

These policies are all stupid, and if any other company selling something else had similar policies they would be out of business very quickly. The railways only get away with it because they have a monopoly, and the government should be stepping in to change the situation.
You do realise the situation is partly the Government fault? They have no interest in sorting it out as it means more for them.
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Old December 30th, 2012, 09:01 PM   #4566
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They might make a little bit of money out of this (what fraction of passengers does this apply to?), but how much would fares rise by if they made the system a little fairer? Given that one of the main disadvantages of travelling by train is lack of flexibility, perhaps passenger numbers would increase if the rules were a little more sensible.
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Old December 30th, 2012, 10:16 PM   #4567
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They might make a little bit of money out of this (what fraction of passengers does this apply to?), but how much would fares rise by if they made the system a little fairer? Given that one of the main disadvantages of travelling by train is lack of flexibility, perhaps passenger numbers would increase if the rules were a little more sensible.
While I generally agree with your comment, I'd say that part of the point is to stop passenger increases in the highest peak so big expensive projects can be put off. When you say lack of flexibility, how do you mean?

I'd suggest having the DfT stopping forcing costs onto the railway it doesn't need is just as great as sorting out the fares. However fares issues is a hell of a lot more complex.

Also one sticking point if you want to make the system fairer then that should mean any subsidies need to be removed to make it more even. Otherwise you'll always have issues like some fares being cheaper than others for same distance.
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Old January 1st, 2013, 12:58 PM   #4568
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BBC Inside Out on overcrowded Northern trains
Just in case you missed this - another chance to view
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=twach...ature=youtu.be
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Old January 1st, 2013, 05:32 PM   #4569
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A question about the Northern Hub:

I at first warmed to the idea of more train traffic using the Stalybridge to Man Vic via Ashton line under the Northern Hub Proposals. I assumed that there would be much more trains stopping in Ashton. At the moment we get 2tph (off peak). However, having more trains stopping in Ashton could present delays to long distance TPE trains. Perhaps some of the TPEs could stop off at Ashton. Even alternate TPEs could stop at Staly and Ashton.

Would the Northern Hub proposals result in more trains stopping at Ashton-under-Lyne?
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Old January 1st, 2013, 08:10 PM   #4570
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Ashtonian, you may wanna pop down to your local station.

Ashton (since the beginning of December) now has three trains trains per hour in each direction, Monday to Friday. The extra one being an extension from Southport and the return through to Kirkby
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Old January 1st, 2013, 09:47 PM   #4571
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashtonian View Post
A question about the Northern Hub:

I at first warmed to the idea of more train traffic using the Stalybridge to Man Vic via Ashton line under the Northern Hub Proposals. I assumed that there would be much more trains stopping in Ashton. At the moment we get 2tph (off peak). However, having more trains stopping in Ashton could present delays to long distance TPE trains. Perhaps some of the TPEs could stop off at Ashton. Even alternate TPEs could stop at Staly and Ashton.

Would the Northern Hub proposals result in more trains stopping at Ashton-under-Lyne?

On the same line as you at the other end, I think Eccles is a wasted opportunity. There is a platform unused at the side of the Manchesterbound platform and the rails are in place. The 3 tracks are being electrified and it seems strange to me that they aren't being moved so that stopping trains could call at Eccles using this platform to let fast trains through,or even use it as a bay platform and extend the Huddersfield stopping service to Eccles freeing up platform space at Victoria.
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Old January 1st, 2013, 09:48 PM   #4572
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Train services from the south of Manchester on the Crewe & Styal line now terminate at Oxford Road rather than Piccadilly. Picc is now the penultimate stop.

Possibly requested by passengers who work in western half of the city centre. Also NR can also check tickets on the thorough platforms. Someone alluded a while back on here than NR might be losing fares due to the lack of ticket purchasing facilities & ticket checks..
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Old January 1st, 2013, 09:49 PM   #4573
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Ashtonian, you may wanna pop down to your local station.

Ashton (since the beginning of December) now has three trains trains per hour in each direction, Monday to Friday. The extra one being an extension from Southport and the return through to Kirkby
Is this permanently Tony_H1? I used the line 2 weeks ago and saw a poster showing this but didn't have time to read it properly, but it was saying something like "Extra trains for Christmas shoppers" at the top and something like "till january the something?

Sorry for all the somethings....lol
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Old January 1st, 2013, 10:06 PM   #4574
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Details of Stagecoach in Wigan fares, which will take effect from Sunday, now on the website:

Stagecoach's Dayrider tickets (adult, child, group, Dayrider plus One), weekly Megarider and EasyRider tickets will be valid for use and purchase. Monthly Megarider tickets valid for purchase at later date once Stagecoach ticket machines are fully installed (same also to Stagecoach Smartcard tickets).

Wigan Megarider ticket (£9) introudced offering unlimited travel for 7 days in Wigan area. Valid on the whole route of services 593, 598, 600, 601, 610, 621, 625, 626, 628, 631, 632 and 658. Also valid on service 32 between Wigan and Mosley Common, service 33 between Wigan and Astley, service X34 between Lowton and Astley (Stagecoach journeys only), service 113 between Wigan and Shevington Moor, service 540 between Wigan and Hindley Green and 695 (says 685 on website) between Wigan and Orrell (this would presumably mean the Wigan Megarider is valid on Nightbuses). Not valid on school bus services funded by Lancashire CC.

FirstDay/FirstWeek and Dayrider/Weekly Megarider tickets will be valid on all journeys on the X34. Monthly tickets only valid on own operator services. All First tickets no longer valid on all other ex-First services.

Single fares will be reduced with maximum fare reduced from £4.50 to £3.80

http://www.stagecoachbus.com/Wiganfares.aspx
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Old January 1st, 2013, 11:14 PM   #4575
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motortownman View Post
Is this permanently Tony_H1? I used the line 2 weeks ago and saw a poster showing this but didn't have time to read it properly, but it was saying something like "Extra trains for Christmas shoppers" at the top and something like "till january the something?

Sorry for all the somethings....lol
Ashton stop do have three trains a hour now as looking at Ashton timetable it show that three trains to Manchester, one is Huddersfield to Victoria, one is Stalybridge to Liverpool and new one is Stalybridge to Kirkby, for going to Ashton from Manchester is Victoria to Huddersfield, again from Liverpool to Stalybridge and new one is Southport to Stalybridge which I don't get why have train just come from Southport but not going to Southport and have one going to Kirkby but not coming back to Stalybridge?

http://www.northernrail.org/pdfs/tim...0121203/25.pdf
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Old January 2nd, 2013, 12:25 AM   #4576
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It was a change that didnt require any extra rolling stock, the trains on those two routes were sitting empty in Victoria taking up a through platform for more than the time taken to traverse the stations thats why its the two different routes joined unidirectionally.
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Old January 2nd, 2013, 12:50 AM   #4577
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Originally Posted by js1000 View Post
Train services from the south of Manchester on the Crewe & Styal line now terminate at Oxford Road rather than Piccadilly. Picc is now the penultimate stop.

Possibly requested by passengers who work in western half of the city centre. Also NR can also check tickets on the thorough platforms. Someone alluded a while back on here than NR might be losing fares due to the lack of ticket purchasing facilities & ticket checks..
AFAIK a few Crewe via Airport to Manchester trains have run to Oxford Road for at least a year, probably two. With the new timetable, it only seems to be odd trains in the peak hour or evenings; think this has also the case for a while.

http://www.northernrail.org/pdfs/tim...amended/18.pdf

At one stage it was Macclesfield line trains that went to Oxford Rd and then went into the headshunt at Old Trafford to reverse. Think this stopped when they extended the trains to Stoke, also 2? years ago.

Ticket checks and a ticket purchase opportunity by Northern for pax going to Platforms 13 and 14 have been going on also for some years. Was originally on the bridge over Platform 13 /14, but moved in 2012 to be more effective and prevent overcrowding. Checks now at the entrance to Platforms 10/11/12 from the main concourse and on the cross bridge prior to the Platform 10 steps.

Cheers
CW
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Old January 2nd, 2013, 01:04 AM   #4578
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Motortown, we were running some extra shuttles on the Saturday and Sundays, as at Present its back to two per hour Sat and only one on Sunday

Watcher its not worked out that great in regards to trains sat doing nothing at Vic. All that happens now is that the XX:09 from arrival Southport now goes to Stalybridge as you know. The XX:04 arrival from Wigan that previously went straight back to Kirkby at XX:10 now shunts to Newton Heath and back before forming the XX:46 back to Southport, so infact a train is now sitting/running around empty for even longer than before!!
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Old January 2nd, 2013, 01:59 AM   #4579
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Originally Posted by CHAPS2034 View Post
AFAIK a few Crewe via Airport to Manchester trains have run to Oxford Road for at least a year, probably two. With the new timetable, it only seems to be odd trains in the peak hour or evenings; think this has also the case for a while.

http://www.northernrail.org/pdfs/tim...amended/18.pdf

At one stage it was Macclesfield line trains that went to Oxford Rd and then went into the headshunt at Old Trafford to reverse. Think this stopped when they extended the trains to Stoke, also 2? years ago.

Ticket checks and a ticket purchase opportunity by Northern for pax going to Platforms 13 and 14 have been going on also for some years. Was originally on the bridge over Platform 13 /14, but moved in 2012 to be more effective and prevent overcrowding. Checks now at the entrance to Platforms 10/11/12 from the main concourse and on the cross bridge prior to the Platform 10 steps.

Cheers
CW
Its the route I often get. I can assure you for the last year NR services have always terminated at Manchester Piccadilly. Checking future timetables it appears the service will terminate at Oxford Road.
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Old January 2nd, 2013, 11:10 AM   #4580
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Originally Posted by Tony_H1
Ashtonian, you may wanna pop down to your local station.

Ashton (since the beginning of December) now has three trains trains per hour in each direction, Monday to Friday. The extra one being an extension from Southport and the return through to Kirkby
You can tell im out of touch. hope the 3tph are well spaced. cheers Tony.
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