daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Railways

Railways (Inter)national commuter and freight trains



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old December 21st, 2007, 09:14 PM   #521
Minato ku
Moderator
 
Minato ku's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Paris, Montrouge
Posts: 16,746

Quote:
Originally Posted by Salif View Post
That is what I read on wikipedia, can only presume the author has not seen the track plan.

I'm not sure why there is such a fragmented track numbering system but maybe it's to clarify where service type is segregated? (i.e. TGV/suburban)

So seemingly it goes like this:

2: Service platform
3-6: Eurostar platforms
7-8: Thalys platforms
9-21: TGV, Corail and TER Picard platforms
30-40: Transilien Regional & Suburban platforms
41-44: RER B and D platforms

Infact that seems to work quite well, the biggest numbering gap accounts for the space between mainline and local platforms.
Don't forget

RER E : 4 platforms
Paris metro : 6 platforms

Total : 45 platforms for Gare du Nord, Yes previous number was overestimated.
__________________
すみません !
J’aime Paris et je veux des tours !
Minato ku no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old December 21st, 2007, 09:37 PM   #522
Salif
Registered User
 
Salif's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,809
Likes (Received): 337

Quote:
Originally Posted by Minato ku View Post
Don't forget

RER E : 4 platforms
Paris metro : 6 platforms

Total : 45 platforms for Gare du Nord, Yes previous number was overestimated.
Are the RER E platforms not classed as a different station (Magenta)?

When the connecting hall is built between Nord and Est will they all be labelled as one station perhaps?

One big 75 track station (not including metro tracks).

Does the list include or exclude metro tracks?

Btw Gare du Lyon definitley has 26 tracks (22 surface, 4 RER) - not sure on Metro tracks though.
Salif no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 21st, 2007, 09:49 PM   #523
Bitxofo
¡Viva el metro!
 
Bitxofo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Alderaan BCN BKK ATH PAR LON SYD SFO CPT TYO SCL CHC BUE SCG SVQ AGP BDN
Posts: 37,520
Likes (Received): 3664

Quote:
Originally Posted by gincan View Post
Well after Sants was expanded in 82 the traffic diminished from Franca up to a point when they started to close down several tracks. I might be wrong but I think I've read that they were discussing alternative use for the building.

When Sagrera is built Renfe will probably dump Franca cause it is to large and to expensive to maintain for a relative small number of users and beside it is a sack station, all trainoperators hate them.
ADiF, the owner of França station not RENFE, is going to keep França station open because it will be necessary for other rail companies after the liberalization of railways in Europe.

And Sagrera station was expected for 2009, but there is a delay in the works...
__________________
www.urbanrail.net
Εγώ είμαι ο Νταβόρ!!
David (DavoR for my friends)
川添 Kawazoe (riverside) 海斗 Kaito (big dipper of the ocean), in Japanese.
Yo si la ciudad no tiene metro, como que no es gran ciudad y entonces ya paso de vivir allí. Norreport+12000
Bitxofo no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 21st, 2007, 10:20 PM   #524
Minato ku
Moderator
 
Minato ku's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Paris, Montrouge
Posts: 16,746

Quote:
Originally Posted by Salif View Post
Are the RER E platforms not classed as a different station (Magenta)?

When the connecting hall is built between Nord and Est will they all be labelled as one station perhaps?

One big 75 track station (not including metro tracks).

Does the list include or exclude metro tracks?

Btw Gare du Lyon definitley has 26 tracks (22 surface, 4 RER) - not sure on Metro tracks though.
These have not the same name but it is the same station, and serve as the same station. the RER E station is just not in the same place than the RER B and D station under gare du Nord.

I see a little error for Gare de Lyon
Gare de Lyon has 6 RER tracks.
4 for SNCF RER D and 2 for RATP RER A,

I am in this thread since its opening and this list include subway tracks.

Exemple here
__________________
すみません !
J’aime Paris et je veux des tours !
Minato ku no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 21st, 2007, 10:41 PM   #525
Salif
Registered User
 
Salif's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,809
Likes (Received): 337

Quote:
Originally Posted by Minato ku View Post
I see a little error for Gare de Lyon
Gare de Lyon has 6 RER tracks.
4 for SNCF RER D and 2 for RATP RER A,
Are you definitley sure about that?

Sure I remember it being four the other day but I wasn't really looking properly (I know Chatelet les Halles has six RER tracks).

But if you're correct that's an extra four tracks need adding (line 1 Metro also).
Salif no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 21st, 2007, 11:56 PM   #526
Minato ku
Moderator
 
Minato ku's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Paris, Montrouge
Posts: 16,746

Yes I sure before be connected at Chatelet les Halles, the RER D station of Gare de Lyon (at this time it was not called RER D) was a suburban terminal underground station 4 tracks (build over the RER A station at the same time)

The 27 June 1988 this station had the worst train accident in France of the end of the 20th century
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gare_de...train_accident
In 1995 a tunnel between this station and Chatelet opened, it is the birth of the RER D.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Wikipedia french
La gare de Lyon est desservie par deux lignes de RER (A et D), dans une gare souterraine située sous la rue de Bercy, contre la gare principale.

La gare RER comprend deux halles superposées, le D se trouvant au-dessus du A :

Le A dessert notamment La Défense et les villes nouvelles de Marne-la-Vallée et Cergy-Pontoise ; il y a un très large quai central encadré des deux voies ;
Le D relie directement (à 2 stations) la gare du Nord ; elle dessert notamment le Stade de France au nord et les villes nouvelles d'Évry et de Sénart au sud ; la station comporte quatre voies encadrant deux quais centraux ; elle fut le site de l'accident du 27 juin 1988.
__________________
すみません !
J’aime Paris et je veux des tours !
Minato ku no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 22nd, 2007, 12:33 AM   #527
Justme
Gotta lite?
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Manchester (Forecast: Rain)
Posts: 4,951
Likes (Received): 780

Quote:
Originally Posted by gincan View Post
Well after Sants was expanded in 82 the traffic diminished from Franca up to a point when they started to close down several tracks. I might be wrong but I think I've read that they were discussing alternative use for the building.

When Sagrera is built Renfe will probably dump Franca cause it is to large and to expensive to maintain for a relative small number of users and beside it is a sack station, all trainoperators hate them.
I really hope Franca stays open as it is easily the most beautiful station in Barcelona, and one of the most beautiful in Spain. They already moved the trains out of that other beautiful old station (near the Grand Arch that looks like a small version of Atocha) and what is it now, a bus stop or something? Is the inside even open to the public?
__________________
I'm doing my bit to save bandwidth by deleting my signature
Justme no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 22nd, 2007, 05:15 AM   #528
Bitxofo
¡Viva el metro!
 
Bitxofo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Alderaan BCN BKK ATH PAR LON SYD SFO CPT TYO SCL CHC BUE SCG SVQ AGP BDN
Posts: 37,520
Likes (Received): 3664

You are talking about Barcelona Nord station, it was completely refurbished in 1993 and now it is the main bus terminal station in Barcelona.

Its interior is open to the public.
__________________
www.urbanrail.net
Εγώ είμαι ο Νταβόρ!!
David (DavoR for my friends)
川添 Kawazoe (riverside) 海斗 Kaito (big dipper of the ocean), in Japanese.
Yo si la ciudad no tiene metro, como que no es gran ciudad y entonces ya paso de vivir allí. Norreport+12000
Bitxofo no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 23rd, 2007, 03:34 PM   #529
gincan
Gincan
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 887
Likes (Received): 183

Quote:
Originally Posted by Justme View Post
I really hope Franca stays open as it is easily the most beautiful station in Barcelona, and one of the most beautiful in Spain. They already moved the trains out of that other beautiful old station (near the Grand Arch that looks like a small version of Atocha) and what is it now, a bus stop or something? Is the inside even open to the public?
the Barcelona Nord station was disused since 1972 and subject to demolition (or so I'v read) before Barcelona was awarded the 1992 Olympics, it was then decided that it was to be refurbished into a sportscenter.

During the Olympics the tabletennis matches were played there, the facility includes various playfields for handball, basket, rollerhockey, badminton and tabletennis. There are also a gym, relax and physical therapy. The superstructure is still the same as when it was used as a trainstation but the interiors are completely changed. The part that is used for the busstation preserved some elements of the old station interiors.

Last edited by gincan; December 23rd, 2007 at 07:01 PM.
gincan no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 23rd, 2007, 03:56 PM   #530
gincan
Gincan
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 887
Likes (Received): 183

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bitxofo View Post
ADiF, the owner of França station not RENFE, is going to keep França station open because it will be necessary for other rail companies after the liberalization of railways in Europe.

And Sagrera station was expected for 2009, but there is a delay in the works...
I hope so but the fact remains that the station is large and expensive to maintain, when the Sants opened after the expansion it took away most of the passengers from Franca and When Sagrera opens it will take the rest. I can't see a reason to keep the station, it lacks connection with the commuter network (line 10 only serves the airport) and also the subwaystation lacks a connection forcing you out of the station, the location also means you can't turn it into a transport hub.

The Sagrera on the other hand will serve and be the prefered Station by basically everyone in Northern Barcelona as it will have excellent connection with all the surrounding neighborhoods, even the ones living in Sant Martí district close to Franca will probably choose Sagrera. So passenger figures will be so low at Franca that it won't justify keeping it open, as it happened to Estacio de Nord in the 1960s. My bet is that trains won't run into Franca 5-10 years after Sagrera is finnished. The building will of cause be preserved but used for some other purpose.

Last edited by gincan; December 23rd, 2007 at 06:58 PM.
gincan no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 27th, 2007, 12:12 PM   #531
Lake
Registered User
 
Lake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Zurich
Posts: 1,521
Likes (Received): 49

Some information about Zurich.

If you count the tracks of the stations which are served by intercitytrains (which "Passenger Rail Terminals" is referncing to) the statistics are wrong becaus the Stations Altstetten (? passengers/day), Oerlikon (110'000 passengers/day) and Enge (? passengers/day), , which are all served by intercitytrains are not counted in the total of tracks

This would be corrected
26 (Hauptbahnhof / Mainstation) + 2 (Enge) + 6 (Oerlikon) + 5 (Altstetten) = 39

and in the near future (according to expansionplans) it will be 43 tracks
Lake no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 27th, 2007, 05:20 PM   #532
glickel
Da T
 
glickel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Boston
Posts: 19
Likes (Received): 1

What about Boston??

Great thread. I love the Paris terminals. And I think the Magenta shouldn't count for Gare du Nord. The RER E are former suburban trains that terminated at the Gare de l'Est trains, so on that principle I think it shouldn't count and it is a different name.

This may have already been brought up, but Boston has two terminal stations, is it an oversight that it has not been included on the list?

South Station: 13 tracks (will expand whenever the main post office next door moves) + 2 subway tracks + 2 bus underground tramway "tracks" (this doesn't really count, but some day it might be light rail tracks)

North Station: 10-12 tracks (not sure if all 12 are open now that the Big Dig is finished) + 4 subway tracks

So by my count that is at least 23 tracks + 6 subway tracks for Boston

Fun fact: In my research, I found an article on South Station in Boston being busier that Grand Central...in 1913

http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive...CF&oref=slogin
__________________
World Champion Boston Red Sox
glickel no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old March 2nd, 2008, 07:27 PM   #533
Yardmaster
Registered Melbourne
 
Yardmaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 4,152
Likes (Received): 198

thanks for the last posting ...

we agreed not to include stations with less than 10 "platforms". Perhaps there are difficulties here, since in various parts of the world what constitutes a "platform" varies.

Elsewhere on this site I have noted Beijing, Shanghai and Teinstin erecting huge stations which deserve mention here. Obviously we'd like to see them actually in operation before they're included!
Yardmaster no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old March 3rd, 2008, 09:21 AM   #534
earthJoker
Ölm
 
earthJoker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Zürich
Posts: 2,806
Likes (Received): 1988

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lake View Post
and in the near future (according to expansionplans) it will be 43 tracks
Where are this 4 tracks going to be?
__________________
Is that you, John Wayne? Is this me?

See you in the Swiss Forum on skyscrapercity.com
earthJoker no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old March 4th, 2008, 01:21 PM   #535
Küsel
Resurrected
 
Küsel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Zurich
Posts: 14,794
Likes (Received): 163

Maybe he means Löwenstrasse and after the Durchmesserlinie. But that's not quite fair to include Oerlikon, Altstetten or Stadelhofen to HB. You also don't count all Paris stations as one.
__________________
Yes, I am!
Küsel no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old March 5th, 2008, 10:54 AM   #536
sotavento
Registered user
 
sotavento's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 7,419
Likes (Received): 322

Portuguese main railway stations:

Porto Campanha = 17 platforms (9 thru , 6 termini , 2 metro , +1/2 tru lines w/o platforms)
Porto São bento = 10 (8 termini platforms , 2 underground metro)
Porto Contumil = 4 platforms + works
- Porto has a total of 27 passenger platforms + hundred or so metro platforms

Lisboa Oriente = 10 (8 thru , 2 underground metro) <<< main station but all trains thru
Lisboa Cais do Sodré = 8 (6 termini , 2 underground metro , +1 w/o platform)
Lisboa Santa Apolonia = 8 (6 termini , 2 underground metro , +1 w/o platform)
Lisboa Entrecampos = 8 (6 thru , 2 metro , +) <<< the REAL central station of lisboa ...
Lisboa Rossio = 7 (5 termini , 2 underground metro)
Lisboa Campolide = 6 (6 thru , actualy only 5 are "serviceable" , +depot w/ some 20 tracks)
- lisboa has a total of 17 terminal platforms (39 platforms total in stations with Lond distance train departures) but most MAIN stations have thru only (Entrecampos and Oriente) wether or not trains start/Stop from there.

Other large stations include:

Cascais = 5 (5 termini < +1 sinding w/o track , +1 track w/o platform)

Entroncamento = 11 (7 thru , 4 termini , + 7 (5+2) w/o platform + freight area + works, its a huge complex 500m x 2500m)

Coimbra = 9 (7 thru , 2 termini , +1 termini +1 thru w/o platform)

Pampilhosa = 9 (6 thru , 3 termini , + 5 w/o platform)

Figueira da Foz = 6 termini , +2 w/o platform + works

Aveiro = 7 (5 thru "broad gauge" , 2 "termini "narrow gauge")

Braga = 6 termini

+ a couple of 4 track stations all over the country ... too many to count.
__________________
"O País perdeu a inteligência e a consciência moral. Ninguém se respeita nem crê na honestidade dos homens públicos. O povo está na miséria. Os serviços públicos vão abandonados. A mocidade arrasta-se das mesas das secretarias para as mesas dos cafés. A ruína económica cresce o comércio definha, a indústria enfraquece. O salário diminui. O Estado é considerado um ladrão e tratado como um inimigo.
Neste salve-se quem puder a burguesia proprietária de casas explora o aluguel. A agiotagem explora o juro…"”
— Eça

Last edited by sotavento; March 6th, 2008 at 12:12 AM.
sotavento no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old March 6th, 2008, 06:58 AM   #537
Yardmaster
Registered Melbourne
 
Yardmaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 4,152
Likes (Received): 198

thanks!
Yardmaster no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old March 6th, 2008, 04:39 PM   #538
earthJoker
Ölm
 
earthJoker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Zürich
Posts: 2,806
Likes (Received): 1988

Quote:
Originally Posted by Küsel View Post
Maybe he means Löwenstrasse and after the Durchmesserlinie. But that's not quite fair to include Oerlikon, Altstetten or Stadelhofen to HB. You also don't count all Paris stations as one.
But after the completition of the Löwenstrasse Station the Sihlpost Station will be dismantled so the number of tracks stays the same. The capacy will go up because dead end tracks are replaced by go throughts.
__________________
Is that you, John Wayne? Is this me?

See you in the Swiss Forum on skyscrapercity.com
earthJoker no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 16th, 2008, 05:18 AM   #539
sotavento
Registered user
 
sotavento's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 7,419
Likes (Received): 322

Quote:
Originally Posted by sotavento View Post
Portuguese main railway stations:

Porto Campanha = 17 platforms (9 thru , 6 termini , 2 metro , +1/2 tru lines w/o platforms)
Porto São bento = 10 (8 termini platforms , 2 underground metro)
Porto Contumil = 4 platforms + works
- Porto has a total of 27 passenger platforms + hundred or so metro platforms

Lisboa Oriente = 10 (8 thru , 2 underground metro) <<< main station but all trains thru
Lisboa Cais do Sodré = 8 (6 termini , 2 underground metro , +1 w/o platform)
Lisboa Santa Apolonia = 8 (6 termini , 2 underground metro , +1 w/o platform)
Lisboa Entrecampos = 8 (6 thru , 2 metro , +) <<< the REAL central station of lisboa ...
Lisboa Rossio = 7 (5 termini , 2 underground metro)
Lisboa Campolide = 6 (6 thru , actualy only 5 are "serviceable" , +depot w/ some 20 tracks)
- lisboa has a total of 17 terminal platforms (39 platforms total in stations with Lond distance train departures) but most MAIN stations have thru only (Entrecampos and Oriente) wether or not trains start/Stop from there.

Other large stations include:

Cascais = 5 (5 termini < +1 sinding w/o track , +1 track w/o platform)

Entroncamento = 11 (7 thru , 4 termini , + 7 (5+2) w/o platform + freight area + works, its a huge complex 500m x 2500m)

Coimbra = 9 (7 thru , 2 termini , +1 termini +1 thru w/o platform)

Pampilhosa = 9 (6 thru , 3 termini , + 5 w/o platform)

Figueira da Foz = 6 termini , +2 w/o platform + works

Aveiro = 7 (5 thru "broad gauge" , 2 "termini "narrow gauge")

Braga = 6 termini

+ a couple of 4 track stations all over the country ... too many to count.
Oriente station will be enlarged in the near future to acomodate the High speed Trains of Lisboa-Porto and Lisboa-Madrid routes.

And by the way ... Lisboa Oriente only has some 75 million passengers anually ....
__________________
"O País perdeu a inteligência e a consciência moral. Ninguém se respeita nem crê na honestidade dos homens públicos. O povo está na miséria. Os serviços públicos vão abandonados. A mocidade arrasta-se das mesas das secretarias para as mesas dos cafés. A ruína económica cresce o comércio definha, a indústria enfraquece. O salário diminui. O Estado é considerado um ladrão e tratado como um inimigo.
Neste salve-se quem puder a burguesia proprietária de casas explora o aluguel. A agiotagem explora o juro…"”
— Eça
sotavento no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 16th, 2008, 11:19 AM   #540
Wuppeltje
Registered User
 
Wuppeltje's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Amsterdam
Posts: 5,839
Likes (Received): 966

Amsterdam Central Station is bigger than listed in the number of platforms, because almost all platforms are used on daily base are serving multiple trains at the same time. On Utrecht Central Station there is a simular situation. These are by far the biggest stations and busiest in the Netherlands, larger than Rotterdam and The Hague Central Station.

1
2a / 2b
4a / 4b
5a / 5b
7a / 7b
8a / 8b
10a / 10b
11a / 11b
13a / 13b
14a / 14b
15a / 15b

There are no platforms for 3, 6, 9 and 12 to serve the other platforms and for goods.
__________________
Volg de Noord/Zuidlijn op Twitter, Youtube, Facebook, Instagram en Flickr
Wuppeltje no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 10:00 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium