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Old June 17th, 2012, 12:09 PM   #721
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It seems that there isn't an English word for Turmbahnhof, but it means a station on a crossing of two railway lines.

Like Akihabara Station in Tokyo.

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Old June 17th, 2012, 12:35 PM   #722
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Momo1435 View Post
It seems that there isn't an English word for Turmbahnhof, but it means a station on a crossing of two railway lines.

Like Akihabara Station in Tokyo.
I would expect that the most impressive examples of about any railway station topology would be found in Japan...
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Old June 17th, 2012, 03:52 PM   #723
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Turmbahnhof = a station at a crossing of two railway lines on different levels without connection between them.
Apparently, the English don't refer to it as a special type of station, but to the different levels as "high level station" and "low level station".
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Old June 17th, 2012, 06:27 PM   #724
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Quote:
Originally Posted by K_ View Post
I would expect that the most impressive examples of about any railway station topology would be found in Japan...
The best Turmbahnhof examples are the ones with all the tracks above ground and that form a perfect cross. There aren't that many in the world that are this clear. In Berlin there are a few on the crossings of the S-Bahn with the ring line. I could also have used 2 stations in Amsterdam, Duivendrecht and especially Sloterdijk that has more platforms then Akihabara.

But if you look at the biggest Turmbahnhof examples with underground railway lines you will probably end up back in Japan. The worlds busiest station, Shinjuku station is also one, just like Shibuya station, although in both examples a train line changes into a metro line at the station.
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Old December 1st, 2012, 06:52 AM   #725
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TOP 100 Of The Busiest Railway Stations in The World.

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Old December 1st, 2012, 07:30 AM   #726
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By floor area, this baby is probably the largest:



It spans more than 500 meters with 34 platforms excluding the metro lines.

Guangzhou one 2nd among new Chinese dedicated high speed rail stations with ~470 meters span.

Guangzhou is followed by Shanghai, Harbin, Beijing and Wuhan in this order among the new stations.
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Old December 3rd, 2012, 06:57 PM   #727
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Saint-Petersburg in Russia has 5 terminals, which is end point for the most train:
Moskovsky (6 platforms, 11 tracks)
Finlyandsky (5 platforms, 10 tracks)
Vitebsky (5 platforms, 8 tracks)
Baltiysky (5 platforms, 7 tracks)
Ladozhsky station (4 platforms, 7 tracks) is the only through station.

In total 25 platforms and 43 tracks for main terminals in SPb

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Old December 3rd, 2012, 10:02 PM   #728
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Its hard to compare platforms in terminal stations with platforms in stations like the one above in Guangzhou. You need a lot more platforms in a terminal station for the same capacity.
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Old December 5th, 2012, 01:13 AM   #729
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kin74na View Post
Saint-Petersburg in Russia has 5 terminals, which is end point for the most train:
Moskovsky (6 platforms, 11 tracks)
Finlyandsky (5 platforms, 10 tracks)
Vitebsky (5 platforms, 8 tracks)
Baltiysky (5 platforms, 7 tracks)
Ladozhsky station (4 platforms, 7 tracks) is the only through station.

In total 25 platforms and 43 tracks for main terminals in SPb
Don't get me started on the London terminals...
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Old December 5th, 2012, 12:31 PM   #730
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I have seen that it's 202 platforms in London terminals. What's wrong with it?
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Old December 5th, 2012, 12:59 PM   #731
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kin74na View Post
I have seen that it's 202 platforms in London terminals. What's wrong with it?
Well, that was the point

I think somewhere in the region of 10-12 terminals, and the majority of them are huge commuter hubs.
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Old December 26th, 2014, 04:10 PM   #732
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Metro007 View Post
According to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Train_station:

Talking only about Europe:

Busiest:

- The Gare du Nord, in Paris, is Europe's busiest railway station by total passenger numbers.
- Clapham Junction, in south London, is Europe's busiest railway station by daily rail traffic (one train every 13 seconds at peak times; one train every 30 seconds at off-peak times).
- Zurich Hauptbahnhof, Switzerland, is Europe's busiest railway terminus by daily rail traffic (Clapham Junction is a through station).

Largest:

- Leipzig Hauptbahnhof in Germany is Europe's largest railway station by floor area (24 platforms and several levels of shopping facilities beneath).
- Berlin Hauptbahnhof is Europe's largest grade-separated and two-level station (6 upper and 8 lower platforms).
- The Gare du Nord, in Paris, is Europe's largest railway station by number of platforms (44 - two not in service).
Clapham? No - just no.

Around 200 trains per hour pass through there but only 100 stop there what's the point? I have no idea why Brits love to count the trains that zoom past the platforms of Clapham as though that has anything to do with the station . In that case you might as well stand at any random point beyond the station and count how many squeeze by on their way to multiples of stations in multiple directions.


Here is the definitive list of top 100 busiest stations in the world and Clapham is nowhere in it (presumably because any half decent record keeper doesn't count trains that "fly by" without stopping):
Code:
1 Shinjuku (Tokyo, Japan)

2 Shibuya (Tokyo, Japan)

3 Ikebukuro (Tokyo, Japan)

4 Umeda-Osaka (Osaka, Japan)

5 Yokohama (Kanagawa, Japan)

6 Kita-Senju (Tokyo, Japan)

7 Nagoya (Aichi, Japan)

8 Tokyo (Tokyo, Japan)

9 Shinagawa (Tokyo, Japan)

10 Takadanobaba (Tokyo, Japan)

11 Namba (Osaka, Japan)

12 Shinbashi (Tokyo, Japan)

13 Tennoji (Osaka, Japan)

14 Akihabara (Tokyo, Japan)

15 Kyoto (Kyoto, Japan)

16 Sannomiya (Kobe, Japan)

17 Omiya (Saitama, Japan)

18 Yurakucho-Hibiya (Tokyo, Japan)

19 Nishi-Funabashi (Chiba, Japan)

20 Meguro (Tokyo, Japan)

21 Daimon-Hamamatsucho (Tokyo, Japan)

22 Ueno (Tokyo, Japan)

23 Oshiage (Tokyo, Japan)

24 Paris Nord (Paris, France)

25 Taipei (Taipei, Taiwan)

26 Machida (Tokyo, Japan)

27 Gare de Chatelet-Les Halles (Paris, France)

28 Kawasaki (Kanagawa, Japan)

29 Roma Termini (Rome, Italy)

30 Tamachi-Mita (Tokyo, Japan)

31 Kyobashi (Osaka, Japan)

32 Funabashi (Chiba, Japan)

33 Ayase (Tokyo, Japan)

34 Hamburg Central (Hamburg, Germany)

35 Yoyogi-Uehara (Tokyo, Japan)

36 Kamata (Tokyo, Japan)

37 Gotanda (Tokyo, Japan)

38 Kichijoji (Tokyo, Japan)

39 Kaneyama (Aichi, Japan)

40 Musashikosugi (Kanagawa, Japan)

41 Fujisawa (Kanagawa, Japan)

42 Oimachi (Tokyo, Japan)

43 Nakano (Tokyo, Japan)

44 Tachikawa (Tokyo, Japan)

45 Iidabashi (Tokyo, Japan)

46 Kashiwa (Chiba, Japan)

47 Hakata (Fukuoka, Japan)

48 Tsuruhashi (Osaka, Japan)

49 Nishi-Nippori (Tokyo, Japan)

50 Nakameguro (Tokyo, Japan)

51 Zurich Main (Zurich, Switzerland)

52 Osaki (Tokyo, Japan)

53 Ebisu (Tokyo, Japan)

54 Frankfurt Central (Frankfurt, Germany)

55 Munich Central (Munich, Germany)

56 Otemachi (Tokyo, Japan)

57 Shin-Osaka (Osaka, Japan)

58 Mizonoguchi (Kanagawa, Japan)

59 Sapporo (Hokkaido, Japan)

60 Jimbocho (Tokyo, Japan)

61 Sengakuji (Tokyo, Japan)

62 Nippori (Tokyo, Japan)

63 Ichigaya (Tokyo, Japan)

64 Kokubunji (Tokyo, Japan)

65 Milano Centrale (Milano, Italy)

66 Yodoyabashi (Osaka, Japan)

67 Noborito (Kanagawa, Japan)

68 Wakoshi (Saitama, Japan)

69 Matsudo (Chiba, Japan)

70 Fukuoka-Tenjin (Fukuoka, Japan)

71 Shanghai (Shanghai, China)

72 Berlin Central (Berlin, Germany)

73 Totsuka (Kanagawa, Japan)

74 Kinshicho (Tokyo, Japan)

75 Cologne Central (Cologne, Germany)

76 Yotsuya (Tokyo, Japan)

77 Shin-Kiba (Tokyo, Japan)

78 Gare Saint-Lazare (Paris, France)

79 Tsudanuma (Chiba, Japan)

80 Asakadai/Kita-Asaka (Saitama, Japan)

81 Shin-Koshigaya/Minami-Koshigaya (Saitama, Japan)

82 Ebina (Kanagawa, Japan)

83 Seoul (Seoul, Korea)

84 Shimokitazawa (Tokyo, Japan)

85 Chiba (Chiba, Japan)

86 Ochanomizu (Tokyo, Japan)

87 Okachimachi (Tokyo, Japan)

88 Amsterdam Central (Amsterdam, Netherlands)

89 Dusseldorf Central (Dusseldorf, Germany)

90 Hanover Central (Hanover, Germany)

91 London Waterloo (London, England)

92 Sakae (Aichi, Japan)

93 Nihonbashi (Tokyo, Japan)

94 Kanda (Tokyo, Japan)

95 Nagatsuda (Kanagawa, Japan)

96 Hiyoshi (Kanagawa, Japan)

97 Sugamo (Tokyo, Japan)

98 Ginza (Tokyo, Japan)

99 Ogikubo (Tokyo, Japan)

100 Sendai (Miyagi, Japan)

Last edited by the Ludovico center; December 26th, 2014 at 04:41 PM.
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Old December 26th, 2014, 06:04 PM   #733
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the Ludovico center View Post
Clapham? No - just no.

Around 200 trains per hour pass through there but only 100 stop there what's the point? I have no idea why Brits love to count the trains that zoom past the platforms of Clapham as though that has anything to do with the station . In that case you might as well stand at any random point beyond the station and count how many squeeze by on their way to multiples of stations in multiple directions.


Here is the definitive list of top 100 busiest stations in the world and Clapham is nowhere in it (presumably because any half decent record keeper doesn't count trains that "fly by" without stopping):
Code:
1 Shinjuku (Tokyo, Japan)

2 Shibuya (Tokyo, Japan)

3 Ikebukuro (Tokyo, Japan)

4 Umeda-Osaka (Osaka, Japan)

5 Yokohama (Kanagawa, Japan)

6 Kita-Senju (Tokyo, Japan)

7 Nagoya (Aichi, Japan)

8 Tokyo (Tokyo, Japan)

9 Shinagawa (Tokyo, Japan)

10 Takadanobaba (Tokyo, Japan)

11 Namba (Osaka, Japan)

12 Shinbashi (Tokyo, Japan)

13 Tennoji (Osaka, Japan)

14 Akihabara (Tokyo, Japan)

15 Kyoto (Kyoto, Japan)

16 Sannomiya (Kobe, Japan)

17 Omiya (Saitama, Japan)

18 Yurakucho-Hibiya (Tokyo, Japan)

19 Nishi-Funabashi (Chiba, Japan)

20 Meguro (Tokyo, Japan)

21 Daimon-Hamamatsucho (Tokyo, Japan)

22 Ueno (Tokyo, Japan)

23 Oshiage (Tokyo, Japan)

24 Paris Nord (Paris, France)

25 Taipei (Taipei, Taiwan)

26 Machida (Tokyo, Japan)

27 Gare de Chatelet-Les Halles (Paris, France)

28 Kawasaki (Kanagawa, Japan)

29 Roma Termini (Rome, Italy)

30 Tamachi-Mita (Tokyo, Japan)

31 Kyobashi (Osaka, Japan)

32 Funabashi (Chiba, Japan)

33 Ayase (Tokyo, Japan)

34 Hamburg Central (Hamburg, Germany)

35 Yoyogi-Uehara (Tokyo, Japan)

36 Kamata (Tokyo, Japan)

37 Gotanda (Tokyo, Japan)

38 Kichijoji (Tokyo, Japan)

39 Kaneyama (Aichi, Japan)

40 Musashikosugi (Kanagawa, Japan)

41 Fujisawa (Kanagawa, Japan)

42 Oimachi (Tokyo, Japan)

43 Nakano (Tokyo, Japan)

44 Tachikawa (Tokyo, Japan)

45 Iidabashi (Tokyo, Japan)

46 Kashiwa (Chiba, Japan)

47 Hakata (Fukuoka, Japan)

48 Tsuruhashi (Osaka, Japan)

49 Nishi-Nippori (Tokyo, Japan)

50 Nakameguro (Tokyo, Japan)

51 Zurich Main (Zurich, Switzerland)

52 Osaki (Tokyo, Japan)

53 Ebisu (Tokyo, Japan)

54 Frankfurt Central (Frankfurt, Germany)

55 Munich Central (Munich, Germany)

56 Otemachi (Tokyo, Japan)

57 Shin-Osaka (Osaka, Japan)

58 Mizonoguchi (Kanagawa, Japan)

59 Sapporo (Hokkaido, Japan)

60 Jimbocho (Tokyo, Japan)

61 Sengakuji (Tokyo, Japan)

62 Nippori (Tokyo, Japan)

63 Ichigaya (Tokyo, Japan)

64 Kokubunji (Tokyo, Japan)

65 Milano Centrale (Milano, Italy)

66 Yodoyabashi (Osaka, Japan)

67 Noborito (Kanagawa, Japan)

68 Wakoshi (Saitama, Japan)

69 Matsudo (Chiba, Japan)

70 Fukuoka-Tenjin (Fukuoka, Japan)

71 Shanghai (Shanghai, China)

72 Berlin Central (Berlin, Germany)

73 Totsuka (Kanagawa, Japan)

74 Kinshicho (Tokyo, Japan)

75 Cologne Central (Cologne, Germany)

76 Yotsuya (Tokyo, Japan)

77 Shin-Kiba (Tokyo, Japan)

78 Gare Saint-Lazare (Paris, France)

79 Tsudanuma (Chiba, Japan)

80 Asakadai/Kita-Asaka (Saitama, Japan)

81 Shin-Koshigaya/Minami-Koshigaya (Saitama, Japan)

82 Ebina (Kanagawa, Japan)

83 Seoul (Seoul, Korea)

84 Shimokitazawa (Tokyo, Japan)

85 Chiba (Chiba, Japan)

86 Ochanomizu (Tokyo, Japan)

87 Okachimachi (Tokyo, Japan)

88 Amsterdam Central (Amsterdam, Netherlands)

89 Dusseldorf Central (Dusseldorf, Germany)

90 Hanover Central (Hanover, Germany)

91 London Waterloo (London, England)

92 Sakae (Aichi, Japan)

93 Nihonbashi (Tokyo, Japan)

94 Kanda (Tokyo, Japan)

95 Nagatsuda (Kanagawa, Japan)

96 Hiyoshi (Kanagawa, Japan)

97 Sugamo (Tokyo, Japan)

98 Ginza (Tokyo, Japan)

99 Ogikubo (Tokyo, Japan)

100 Sendai (Miyagi, Japan)
This list does not seem very correct. Its telling me that train stations in China, i.e. Beijing, which most certainly has trains originating there, does not possess more traffic than the 70th busiest train station of Japan? And somehow only Shanghai station, which is one of 3(?) in Shanghai, has a place on that list, out of all the Chinese stations. Seems to me this list is either misleading or severely outdated.
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Old December 26th, 2014, 08:47 PM   #734
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^ Not outdated at all (2013).

The Chinese stations are in the middle of big expansions so obviously they will be ranked higher in the future versions of the list when they become more utilized to their maximum capacity. That list only takes into account the facts on the ground as they are now - not what the estimated potential is or whatever
.

Last edited by the Ludovico center; December 26th, 2014 at 08:56 PM.
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Old December 27th, 2014, 12:50 AM   #735
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That list is misleading and not even complete.

Simply because there should be a distinction between subway/commuter station and an intercity train station. Even when you make a list for subway/commuter trains, one expects to see India in the list. The list shows Tokyo area commuter rails are carrying more people than inter-city trains which is really apples and oranges.
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Old December 27th, 2014, 03:12 AM   #736
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^ What you're attempting to pull has got a name: a distinction without a difference.

Thread titled "busiest passenger terminal", not "busiest commuter but not intercity" or "busiest intercity without commuter train" or "busiest with chipmunks and other pets" or whatever other narrow criteria anyone can come up with
.

Last edited by the Ludovico center; December 27th, 2014 at 03:48 AM.
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Old December 27th, 2014, 06:26 AM   #737
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Sure sure...

Then, where is Penn Station in your list? Where is Howrah Station of Kolkata?

rocketnews24... very reliable source. use some common sense man.



126 million passenger per year for Shinjuku (1st) and 8 million for Sendai (I assume, I don't know Japanese -last) in the list.

There are so many stations (especially if you include subway station like you are doing) which handle more than 8 million/year, that your list is not even funny.

"definitive list"... yeah right.

By the way if you are not bothered with the definitions, then there are like 100 airports with higher passenger numbers than 8 million per year.

The list makes zero sense.
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Old December 27th, 2014, 10:14 AM   #738
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That list is trying its best to be objective, though still should be taken with a grain of salt. Many countries (especially India, and even many in Europe) do not have good statistics of ridership of each stations. The list excludes stations without reliable and searchable numbers.

Quote:
126 million passenger per year for Shinjuku (1st) and 8 million for Sendai (I assume, I don't know Japanese -last) in the list.
Nope, the unit used here is ten million (千万), so Sendai station handles 80 million passengers per year.

Quote:
Then, where is Penn Station in your list?
OK, I researched for you. The charge is free!

Amtrak + LIRR + NJ Transit: 148,732,000
Subway 123: 27,730,331
Subway ACE: 25,726,374
Total: 202,188,705

So this is 20 ten-million, possibly above Paris Nord, ranking No.24 in the list. (But then again, Paris Nord may go up when you count Metro.)

Quote:
Where is Howrah Station of Kolkata?
It is much more difficult to examine the ridership of Indian railway stations. I googled but could not find much data. (You can contribute if you know.)

But for a very rough image, I calculated the number for the Central station of Mumbai, another major Indian city.
The total annual ridership of commuter/metro railway network in Tokyo: 14.6 billion
Shinjuku station: 1.26 billion
So the major station has 12% ridership share among the entire network.

The total annual ridership of Mumbai Suburban Railway: 2.64 billion
2.64 x 12% = 228 million, would be "23" ten-million in the list.

I guess Howrah Station would have similar number.


So yeah, the list indeed lacks many stations. But then again, I doubt the real figures list would be extremely different. I mean, even the busiest stations in US or India are around 20 ten-million, whereas Shinjuku is 126.

Still, if you think the list "makes zero sense", you can always make better list by yourself. I would be pleased to see one.


Quote:
By the way if you are not bothered with the definitions, then there are like 100 airports with higher passenger numbers than 8 million per year.
That's 80 million.

Well the thing is, the distinction between railway and airplane is clear to everyone, whereas the distinction between "railway" and "metro" is much more arbitrary and cultural. In some cultures those two are completely different entities, while in some others (such as Japan), they are very much blended and virtually impossible or meaningless to distinguish. I mean, do you think Yamanote Line is metro, or railway?

Anyway, it is not very much persuading to accuse Japanese inability to distinguish these two, when the thread title is just "Largest and Busiest Passenger Terminals".
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Old December 27th, 2014, 11:11 AM   #739
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FML View Post
That list is trying its best to be objective, though still should be taken with a grain of salt. Many countries (especially India, and even many in Europe) do not have good statistics of ridership of each stations. The list excludes stations without reliable and searchable numbers.



Nope, the unit used here is ten million (千万), so Sendai station handles 80 million passengers per year.



OK, I researched for you. The charge is free!

Amtrak + LIRR + NJ Transit: 148,732,000
Subway 123: 27,730,331
Subway ACE: 25,726,374
Total: 202,188,705

So this is 20 ten-million, possibly above Paris Nord, ranking No.24 in the list. (But then again, Paris Nord may go up when you count Metro.)



It is much more difficult to examine the ridership of Indian railway stations. I googled but could not find much data. (You can contribute if you know.)

But for a very rough image, I calculated the number for the Central station of Mumbai, another major Indian city.
The total annual ridership of commuter/metro railway network in Tokyo: 14.6 billion
Shinjuku station: 1.26 billion
So the major station has 12% ridership share among the entire network.

The total annual ridership of Mumbai Suburban Railway: 2.64 billion
2.64 x 12% = 228 million, would be "23" ten-million in the list.

I guess Howrah Station would have similar number.


So yeah, the list indeed lacks many stations. But then again, I doubt the real figures list would be extremely different. I mean, even the busiest stations in US or India are around 20 ten-million, whereas Shinjuku is 126.

Still, if you think the list "makes zero sense", you can always make better list by yourself. I would be pleased to see one.




That's 80 million.

Well the thing is, the distinction between railway and airplane is clear to everyone, whereas the distinction between "railway" and "metro" is much more arbitrary and cultural. In some cultures those two are completely different entities, while in some others (such as Japan), they are very much blended and virtually impossible or meaningless to distinguish. I mean, do you think Yamanote Line is metro, or railway?

Anyway, it is not very much persuading to accuse Japanese inability to distinguish these two, when the thread title is just "Largest and Busiest Passenger Terminals".
There ye go.

Thanks for setting the record straight.

And by the way it's not only in Japan that trains and metros blend - Europe is full of it (what is RER if not a commuter train AND a metro AT THE SAME TIME (specifically designed to integrate formerly suburban commuter lines with city center underground stations)
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Old December 27th, 2014, 11:26 AM   #740
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Don't worry about it, he gets upset when China isn't #1 for everything.
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