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Old April 14th, 2017, 03:51 PM   #1961
lezgotolondon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eno View Post
There's no way that Toronto can accommodate another 2.5 million people, even the GTA would have a massive problem absorbing so many new residents. We'd need to be building at least three new subway lines like right now to even ponder that kind of population growth scenario.
Well with a boom like that is not a crazy idea.

3 lines in 20 years for a 5 million metropolis with almost no ancient structures in a rich country should be the norm , in particular if the city lacks public transportation services.

For instance:
Milan has built/is building more than 2 lines in 20 years.
Milan metropolitan area is 4.5 to 6 million people.
Milan is quite old and has a big historical and croweded city centre.
Milan city proper only hosts 1.3 million people.
Milan already had 3 lines of metro, an extensive suburban rail system, many streetcar lines and buses.
Milan is rich but it's still an Italian cities where corruption and incompetence make public projects budgets to grow like crazy every freakin time.

If Milan does it, you can do it better and with less money.
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Old April 14th, 2017, 04:00 PM   #1962
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You can read about the fiasco that has been the back-and-forth on the Downtown Relief Line; I can think of few projects in North America barring the Second Avenue Subway that have been so chaotic in the planning stages.
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Old April 15th, 2017, 07:55 PM   #1963
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lezgotolondon View Post
If Milan does it, you can do it better and with less money.
Agree. Other cities manage to do it so I'm not sure why Toronto would be an exception. There are a lot of very bright people in this city and the planning department has managed this unprecedented growth intelligently. They've under-estimated the amount of demand a number of times but adjusted accordingly.

Btw, the 2.5 million over 20 years is the conservative estimate. Another study cites 3.5 million over 25 years for Greater Toronto alone.
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Old April 15th, 2017, 09:00 PM   #1964
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^ toronto's poor metro system is surprising only to those who don't understand toronto.

basically, there are three factors.

first, the city has very few financing levers. it gains all of its money from three sources: property taxes, fees/fines, transfers from higher governments. it cannot institute sales tax or issue infrastructure bonds like US cities, there's no tax increment financing, it cannot introduce an income tax on its residents. basically, this means that the city has only enough money to provide basic services.

second, since the city is reliant upon the higher levels of government (ontario and canada), it suffers those governments' priorities. ontario in particularly has historically looked at urban infrastructure as a road capacity issue. the city itself took on this attitude in the 2000s, when the provincial government added several large suburbs to toronto, so that a majority of the city is now suburban. even the rail push you see today is mostly interurban, and the "subway" plans are what would have been "interurban" when the suburbs were still independent cities, but it's now "urban" because they were appended to the "city."

finally, the cost to reward ratio is low. it's very expensive to build a subway but the disruption is high (resource allocation but also ripping up streets) and the number of perceived beneficiaries is low, compared, say, with simply keeping taxes lower.

so it's not incompetence in toronto, so much as it is that the institutional constraints and incentives run against an effective metro network.

a normal person may look at toronto and wonder why on earth they'd build a subway to some distant suburb (scarborough) to REPLACE an existing light rail line, instead of building an east/west line under, say, king/queen street, that would service one of the densest business and residential areas in CANADA. but this is because a normal person does not understand how dysfunctional toronto's governance model is for a large city.

the great shame is that canadians love rapid transit, they take to it when it's there, look at montreal and vancouver. if the government had built the system years ago, then, like vancouver and especially montreal, the city wouldn't have had to build for cars, and so would be a lot more attractive.

edit: the poor/haphazard planning also reflects a pretty deep run of rent-seeking on the parts of the various players. the provincial government is in such a precarious electoral position that it doesn't dare come down on one side in the urban v suburban divide on transport dollars.
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Old April 16th, 2017, 02:53 AM   #1965
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eno View Post
There's no way that Toronto can accommodate another 2.5 million people, even the GTA would have a massive problem absorbing so many new residents. We'd need to be building at least three new subway lines like right now to even ponder that kind of population growth scenario.
intensifying along the avenues will only add so many people; mixed use and live-work may shorten commutes so that the need for new transit will be reduced. But 2.5 million is almost doubling our population and we already have gridlock. They can only widen highways so much. And the other issue is political, that is, another anti-Toronto Conservative Mike Harris/Harper type regime with contempt for Toronto, then all the current transit plans will go in the garbage (Smart Track and Relief Line). And SmartTrack and Relief line are crucial to developing areas with greatest potential for office and residential high density development - Unilever lands, Airport Corporate Centre and Markham...and probably a number of smaller nodes along relief line and smart track stops such as Gerrard Square.

But this all will only happen if Smart Track and other transit projects start moving, the window is getting smaller as the spectre of right wing anti-urban conservatives becomes more possible.
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Old April 16th, 2017, 10:32 AM   #1966
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...and after c.2040, another 2.5m will need to be accommodated by 2060, and by 2080 etc etc.

One assumes that Toronto/southern Ontario will muddle through, but at some point some grander GTA expansion/redevelopment plans will be needed rather than overdue ad-hoc fixes.
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Old April 16th, 2017, 01:34 PM   #1967
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Dont worry folks. Global warming will add 2.5 mln people to Toronto. And still idiots invest in florida, texas, arizona
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Old April 17th, 2017, 06:52 PM   #1968
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Most Torontonians on these boards understand the issues faced by City Hall. Infrastructure is being built but it is a constant struggle to secure funds. Cities continue to grow in importance and have become the key wealth generators. The provinces/feds will have to devolve some revenue generating tools to them or at the very least agree to a large dedicated stream of funds.

We need a new way forward. We had this same conversation 10 years ago though. Here is one of many videos in this same vein. The blond lady with glasses is Toronto's chief planner, Jennifer Keesmaat:

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Last edited by isaidso; April 17th, 2017 at 07:24 PM.
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Old April 17th, 2017, 11:34 PM   #1969
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Bay Adelaide North | Financial District

Project facts
  • Address: 40 Temperance Street
  • Status: Proposed
  • Developer: Brookfield
  • Architect: KPMB
  • Office: 843,000 s.f. (78,317 sqm)
  • Height: 120m (394ft)
  • Floors: 31


Renderings (shortest of the three):





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Old April 19th, 2017, 11:43 PM   #1970
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1 Yorkville Avenue | Yorkville

Official website: http://bazis.ca/1-yorkville

Project facts
  • Address: 1 Yorkville Avenue
  • Status: Under construction
  • Developer: Bazis
  • Architect: Rosario Varacalli
  • Residential: 577 units
  • Height: 183m (600ft)
  • Floors: 58


April 15:


(@Benito)


Rendering:

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Old April 23rd, 2017, 06:35 AM   #1971
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319-323 Jarvis Street | Downtown

Official website:

Project facts
  • Address: 319-323 Jarvis Street
  • Status: Proposal
  • Developer: Centre Court
  • Architect: Page + Steele / IBI
  • Residential: 506 units
  • Height: 165m
  • Floors: 50



Courtesy of UT
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Last edited by isaidso; April 23rd, 2017 at 06:51 AM.
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Old May 8th, 2017, 01:33 PM   #1972
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E | Yonge & Eglinton

Official website: http://bazis.ca/econdos/home.php

Project facts
  • Address: 8 Eglinton Avenue E
  • Status: Under construction
  • Developer: Bazis
  • Architect: Rosario Varacalli
  • Residential: 854 units
  • Height: 196m, 123m (643ft, 403ft)
  • Floors: 58, 38


May 1:


(@Edward Skira)


Rendering:

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Old May 18th, 2017, 04:00 AM   #1973
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663 King Street West | Fashion District

Project facts
  • Address: 663 King Street W
  • Status: Proposed
  • Developer: Main and Main
  • Architect: Diamond Schmitt
  • Residential: 247 units
  • Height: 67m (220ft)
  • Floors: 19


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Old May 18th, 2017, 10:50 PM   #1974
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14 Duncan Street | Entertainment District

Project facts
  • Address: 14 Duncan Street
  • Status: Proposed
  • Developer: Greenwin
  • Architect: Quadrangle
  • Residential: 369 units
  • Office: 67,005 s.f. (6,225 sqm)
  • Retail: 6,620 s.f. (615 sqm)
  • Height: 157m (515ft)
  • Floors: 48


Rendering:

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Old May 19th, 2017, 02:25 AM   #1975
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88 Scott Street | St Lawrence

Official website: http://88scott.com

Project facts
  • Address: 88 Scott Street
  • Status: Topped out
  • Developer: Concert
  • Architect: Page + Steele/IBI
  • Residential: 525 units
  • Height: 204m (669ft)
  • Floors: 58


May 12:


(@G.L. 17)
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Old May 19th, 2017, 05:13 PM   #1976
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YC | Lower Yonge Street

Official website: http://yccondos.com

Project facts
  • Address: 460 Yonge Street
  • Status: Under construction
  • Developer: Canderel
  • Architect: Graziani + Corazza
  • Residential: 600 units
  • Height: 198m (650ft)
  • Floors: 66


May 15:


(@Benito)


Rendering:

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Old May 20th, 2017, 07:06 AM   #1977
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Casa III | Yorkville

Official website: http://casacondominium.com

Project facts
  • Address: 50 Charles Street E
  • Status: Under construction
  • Developer: Cresford
  • Architect: architectsAlliance
  • Residential: 622 units
  • Height: 180m (591ft)
  • Floors: 55


May 14:


Casa III Toronto by steveve photostream, on Flickr
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Old May 20th, 2017, 08:04 PM   #1978
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Bay Park Centre | South Core

Official website: http://www.bayparkcentre.com

Project facts
  • Address: 81-141 Bay Street
  • Status: Proposed
  • Developer: Ivanhoe Cambridge/Hines
  • Architect: Wilkinson Eyre
  • Office: 2,900,000 s.f. (269,419 sqm)
  • Height: 265m, 238m (869ft, 780ft)
  • Floors: 54, 49


Renderings:





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Old May 20th, 2017, 11:02 PM   #1979
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PJ | Entertainment District

Official website: http://www.thepjcondo.ca

Project facts
  • Address: 283 Adelaide Street W
  • Status: Under construction
  • Developer: Pinnacle
  • Architect: Hariri Pontarini
  • Residential: 372 units
  • Height: 156m (512ft)
  • Floors: 48


May 14:


(@Edward Skira)


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Old May 21st, 2017, 07:10 PM   #1980
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EY Tower | Financial District

Official website: http://www.100asw.com

Project facts
  • Address: 100 Adelaide Street W
  • Status: Complete
  • Developer: Oxford
  • Architect: Kohn Pedersen Fox
  • Office: 900,000 s.f. (83,613 sqm)
  • Height: 188m (617ft)
  • Floors: 40


May 12:


(@G.L.17)
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