South Florida Transportation Part II

[miami1]

lets ruin one of miami's most valuable assets (its beach) by building a train on it...nice.

[brickell]

^ exactly. The beach may have plenty of space, but I doubt you'll find more than 5 people who want elevated stations there. Most of the plan I like, it just needs to be tweaked. The stations have to be bulky because of elevator shafts, escalators, platforms, gates etc. Not that it couldn't be done gracefully, but when has that ever been a part of Miami planning?

[Verticus]

Originally Posted by miami1

lets ruin one of miami's most valuable assets (its beach) by building a train on it...nice.

Miami1, the beach is big enough that a Disney-style monoral won't ruin it. If that is your concern, then we should ban the mouth-breathing, radio blasting, uncouth, littering cretins who use the beach but I think we have laws against that kind of "profiling."

[BornInTheGrove]

Originally Posted by Verticus

Miami1, the beach is big enough that a Disney-style monoral won't ruin it. If that is your concern, then we should ban the mouth-breathing, radio blasting, uncouth, littering cretins who use the beach but I think we have laws against that kind of "profiling."

I'm sorry dude... but i'll take those couple dozen people over a couple dozen bulky concrete pillars any day.

[DShoost88]

I don't mean to take sides BornInTheGrove, but I'm gonna have to agree with Verticus on this one. If you take a good look at those columns for the monorail line, they ain't that bulky; at least they're not as bulky as some of the skyscrapers you'll find up and down Collins Avenue. Afterall, it's not like Verticus is saying build the monorail through Haulover Beach Park or tear through Star Island (ha, I'd love to see that though). If you take another look at those columns along the beach, I think they would be great posts for freshwater showers, making it a dual purpose post for beachgoers to rinse off after hopping into the ocean and sand. And if several of those beachgoers are in fact residents who live out west (say Doral or Kendall) and know how big of a pain it is to drive between the two destinations, they'd probably love a monorail that takes them to all their favorite spots in Miami Beach! Think about it: Pearl, News Cafe, Lincoln Rd., the Convention Center -- all a 5-10 minute monorail ride from Downtown Miami. And if the monorail station links to Metrorail, the accesibility is pushed even further! MIA, U.Miami, Jackson Memorial, Dadeland, etc. If Miami and Miami Beach are developing high into the air to become leading meccas for the 21st century, then perhaps their transportation options should look higher into the air for accessibility. Props to Verticus; I love your idea and say you should take it to State Govt. for their opinion.

[ChuckScraperMiami#1]

Originally Posted by spellbound

^The odds of that ever being reality are about the same as Bin-Laden being elected president, but I LOVE the way you think, Verticus!

(awesome graphics, too!)

SpellBound , I second that my Friend , the same thought here,

Maybe 2020 , it might break ground, and be completed by 2025 '26 ?, '27 ?, '28 ?, '29, '30 !!!

[arch photographer]

You gotta say, the view from the monorail would be FANTASTIC, it would be a tourist attraction in and of itself. And I think it would be wild to have those whizzing by every few minutes. I remember when I was little I thought those were the coolest things on earth, especially as they would pierce the skin of the Contemporary resort Hotel and then disappear inside the building.

[dave8721]

http://www.miamitodaynews.com/news/060824/fyi.shtml

WALK THIS WAY: Coral Gables city commissioners approved a resolution Tuesday in support of Miami-Dade County Transit's plan to construct a pedestrian overpass connecting the University Metrorail Station to the northeast side of US 1. Transit officials project a November 2009 completion. "This will be the first major pedestrian overpass in Coral Gables," said Mayor Donald Slesnick at the commission meeting. The intent is to improve pedestrian safety at the perimeter of the University of Miami campus. Before passing the resolution, commissioners stipulated they have the final say in overpass aesthetics and signage.

[BornInTheGrove]

This makes a lot more sense.

Shifting Metrorail to 107th Avenue would serve FIU and Sweetwater

By Larry Lebowitz

streetwise@MiamiHerald.com

A few months ago, this column blasted Florida International University for telling Miami-Dade Transit it wasn't welcome to extend Metrorail onto the main campus in West Miami-Dade County.

Well, the worm has most definitely turned.

With FIU's assistance, Transit is taking another look at a slightly different alignment for the east-west extension that would run down 107th Avenue along the eastern edge of the FIU campus. The original plan would have wedged the train between Southwest 117th Avenue and Florida's Turnpike.

Taking the train down 107th Avenue creates a lot of interesting possibilities. It could bolster ridership along the entire corridor, while making the train a lot more accessible for FIU students and staff members and the blue-collar denizens of Sweetwater as well.

Two stops would be built in this scenario. The first would be near FIU's engineering school in the northeast quadrant of Southwest 107th Avenue and Flagler Street.

From there, the train would run south, cut across to the west side of the avenue, and come to a stop near the east entrance to the campus, around Southwest 12th Street.

This stop would much better serve FIU because the bulk of the student activity centers are located on the eastern side of the campus.

If Transit winds up using the 117th Avenue alignment, ending the line near the National Hurricane Center or farther south in Tamiami Park, FIU would have to dramatically expand its shuttle-bus service to get riders from the Metrorail stations.

The 107th Avenue alternative is far from a done deal. The city of Sweetwater isn't on board yet.

MAYOR'S PREFERENCE

Should Metrorail run straight through his city of 15,000, Mayor Manny Maroño would prefer a smaller-scale, more aesthetically pleasing train -- something akin to light rail or a trolley at or near street level instead of the bulky, elevated Metrorail.

Give Maroño his due. The mayor could easily take the ''No train, no way, never'' position and pander to the anti-everything factions. But he isn't.

Maroño understands that many of his working-class constituents will ultimately benefit from easy access to mass transit.

With FIU adding a law school and a medical school and suburban sprawl continuing south and west, Maroño realizes that the Sweetwater of today isn't going to look much like Sweetwater could -- and should -- if Metrorail arrives around 2015.

Cluttered with strip malls, the area is ripe for higher-density, quality redevelopment. An aesthetically pleasing train would only enhance the opportunities.

If Transit ultimately persuades the County Commission and the Metropolitan Planning Organization to adopt 107th Avenue as the locally preferred alternative, it would be interesting to see where the planners ultimately place the end-of-line station.

Assume that the last stop is at Southwest 107th Avenue and 12th Street, near FIU's east-side entrance. Would planners then try to swing the line west along the property line between the campus and the county-owned Tamiami Park, terminating just north of Coral Way and east of the turnpike?

One of the future plans -- and we're talking generations from now -- would extend Metrorail farther south, parallel to the turnpike, until it reaches North Kendall Drive and then east along Kendall until it ''closes the loop'' at one of the Dadeland stations.

In the end, the 107th Avenue alternative may not prove feasible.

Some commissioners -- especially Chairman Joe Martinez and former Sweetwater Mayor Jose ''Pepe'' Diaz -- believe the train would better serve the whole county if it were more accessible to people who live west of the turnpike.

EXPRESS YOUR VIEWS

Voice your own opinion at the upcoming east-west workshops on Sept. 19 at the Sheraton Miami Mart, 711 NW 72nd Ave.; Sept. 20 at FIU's Graham Conference Center, 11200 SW Eighth St.; and Sept. 21 at the St. Dominic Church Parish Hall, 5849 NW Seventh St.

All of the two-hour workshops are set to start at 6:30 p.m. Be there. Aloha.

If you're particularly interested in the 107th Avenue issue, plan to attend the FIU session on Sept. 20.

If history is any indication, the Sept. 21 workshop at St. Dominic will be another bloodletting. The people of Flagami have spoken loud and clear -- in Spanish and English -- that they don't want the east-west running on Northwest Seventh Street through their neighborhood. And the politicians who rely on those people have taken heed as well.

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/15489053.htm

I for one will be going to the meeting at the GC.

[qbanaso86]

Sounds good to me, I really hope it happens but if there is a conflict with the City of Sweetwater then maybe we should look at an option of making the east-west link till NW 107 Ave Station. Then make a BRT or LRT down 107 Ave. Instead of the Kendall link having a Metrorail line go down 117 Ave., I think we should make a BRT or LRT which could be done with local funds and in a short amount of time. We maybe able to have a BRT or LRT line going down Kendall and another going down 107 Ave. before the feds even accept the east-west corridor. Then again, having FIU at the end of a metro rail line is more or less what the feds are looking for. I will be attending the meeting also.

[Meph]

I have a class at 8:00 PM that day so hopefully I can make it.

[qbanaso86]

Here's an update on the situation of the new 107 Ave. option for the East-West Metrorail Corridor. The meeting, which was held on Wednesday the twentieth of September, had a good showing. There was such a good showing that the meeting was moved from the average sized FIU Ballroom to Graham Centers auditorium. The crowd was about evenly split, it was comical to see how split the crowd was. One side of the room was the vocal FIU crowd included Student Union reps, Teacher Union reps, Alumni and regular students from the FIU community. On the other side was the more aged crowd with Sweetwater residents, business men and 5 Sweetwater representatives including the mayor and vice mayor.

The meeting started with the HNTB project manager explaining the project . It got interesting when it came up to the part of the N.W. 107 Ave. alignment. The alignment will consist of moving the NW 107 Ave. station to the current location of the Bill Sidel's Nissan dealership. The track will then curve towards the south down the median of NW 107 Ave. till the FIU Engineering campus, btw the entire segment is elevated. Once the line reaches the Engineering campus the line will shift to the east of NW 107 Ave. onto FIU property in which a station will be made. Now is where the alignment gets tricky, the line will then move down NW 107 Ave. and cross over the NW 107 Ave. and Flagler intersection to the west side of SW 107 Ave. The line will run down the west side of SW 107 Ave, making columns on some parking spaces of businesses located in the vicinity. The tricky part is once it gets closer to SW 8th St. in which the county may have to buy some pieces of land or maybe entire parcels in order to accommodate the columns. Once it reaches SW 8th St. the line will move across the intersection and onto the median of SW 107 Ave. It will move down till SW 16th St. (JOSE CANSECO ST.) where the line will cross onto FIU property and make a station at the Miami-Dade Transit bus station area. With the addition of the 107 Ave. option a new rail yard for the metro rail is being proposed for the open area between NW 12th St. and NW 14th ST on the west side of NW 107 Ave.

After the explanation of the new option, the meeting was open for discussion. The FIU side was giving good arguments about how the area can grow to become a nice walk able urban community. Sweetwater's argument was that the Metrorail will split the small city in half and will cause too much noise and bring things into the city they don't want. Sweetwater has an idea of sticking to the Status Quo. Mean while FIU wants to be able to stop having to run a bus from the FIU main campus to the Engineering campus and not have to add another bus to connect their students to the station on 117 Ave. if that option is selected. It only makes sense to make Metrorail stations in places where people can access them in various ways, rather it be by walking, biking, riding the bus or driving by car. If the NW 117 Ave. option is accepted I would not want so see how NW 117th Ave. will look like once the station is built. A station in which people can only access by car or bus.

There will be more workshops dedicated towards the new 107 Ave. option. The meeting was just to address the public and get some feedback.

[Bobdreamz]

"Sweetwater's argument was that the Metrorail will split the small city in half and will cause too much noise and bring things into the city they don't want. "

what will it bring into the city? people? or are they arguing that mass transit users are undesireables? because I've heard that arguement before and it's totally baseless.

[qbanaso86]

I'm telling you their argument was that they want a small city setting. That’s contradictory to the annexation they were trying to pass to make there city stretch till NW 25th Street which got turned down by voters for like the 3rd time. Plus, the city is already split by 107 Ave. and Flagler which both split the city more than any Metrorail will ever split it.

[spellbound]

Originally Posted by Bobdreamz

"Sweetwater's argument was that the Metrorail will split the small city in half and will cause too much noise and bring things into the city they don't want. "

what will it bring into the city? people? or are they arguing that mass transit users are undesireables? because I've heard that arguement before and it's totally baseless.

I'm not even sure what the people of Sweetwater consider "undesirables" but perhaps they should take a deep breath and come to grips with the fact that we're not exactly talking about Bel Air or East Hampton here. Sweetwater is denuded streets, ugly strips of garishly lit commerce, and cars.

This is a "city" founded by stranded Russian circus clowns (you may look it up for verification) and is STILL run by clowns who---in some bizarre alternative universe---actually think anybody on God's Green Earth gives a crap about "anti-Castro" resolutions in lieu of having an intelligent, working government.

Give those in the pathway a Golden Parachute to move somewhere better and let Metrorail go where it NEEDS to go to actually be a working system.

Yeah, those "undesirables" just can't wait to exit a Metrorail train....walk down the steps...and steal a bunch of ham croquetas under a heat lamp.

WE MUST STOP METRORAIL IN SWEETWATER! IT IS A CASTRO PLOT!

[Meph]

^You sound rather bitter just because they say no to a train.

[Verticus]

Originally Posted by spellbound

I'm not even sure what the people of Sweetwater consider "undesirables" but perhaps they should take a deep breath and come to grips with the fact that we're not exactly talking about Bel Air or East Hampton here. Sweetwater is denuded streets, ugly strips of garishly lit commerce, and cars.

This is a "city" founded by stranded Russian circus clowns (you may look it up for verification) and is STILL run by clowns who---in some bizarre alternative universe---actually think anybody on God's Green Earth gives a crap about "anti-Castro" resolutions in lieu of having an intelligent, working government.

Give those in the pathway a Golden Parachute to move somewhere better and let Metrorail go where it NEEDS to go to actually be a working system.

Yeah, those "undesirables" just can't wait to exit a Metrorail train....walk down the steps...and steal a bunch of ham croquetas under a heat lamp.

WE MUST STOP METRORAIL IN SWEETWATER! IT IS A CASTRO PLOT!

Spellbound, thanks for a great posting. I enjoyed reading it and had a good laugh. Regarding Sweetwater, you're right about it being one of the ugliest cities around and about the Russian circus clowns (and a few midgets). I think the climate has a lot to do with attracting a wider variety of people-- from Russian circus clowns and midgets trying to keep warm during the winter and exiles of every stripe who, despite living in the greatest country on the planet, still can't wait to get back home. Regarding the latter, perhaps if they-- us-- remembered how insignificant we all are in the scheme of things, maybe we would be happier and more tolerant of other people and their ideas. In that regard, here's a picture of Earth from Saturn. Looking at it kind of puts everything in perspective. In the great words of Rodney King, "Why can't we all learn to get along."

[dave8721]

Just some population stats to add the debate that "Miami isn't dense as those northern cities and cant support a working public transit system":

Here are the densities of the largest Urbanized Areas in the US (basically metro populations minus the sparse far flung suburbs):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Largest..._United_States

Here are the top 10 largest UA's ranked by density:
1. Los Angeles: 7068.3
2. New York: 5309.3
3. Miami: 4407.4
4. Chicago: 3913.6
5. Washington: 3400.8
6. Detroit: 3094.4
7. Houston: 2951.1
8. Dallas: 2946.4
9. Philadelphia: 2861.4
10. Boston: 2322.6

Miami & LA do not have the lower density suburbs seen in most other US cities. Of course as West Kendall & Fontainebleau show, density does not always equal walkability.

[BornInTheGrove]

I always interpreted undesireables as bums and homeless using the 'shelter' of the column and overhead tracks to sleep under... also the potential for these areas to be used by drug dealers and users, because of the resulting darkness created from said overhead tracks and columns.

These are some of these arguements used to do away with the I-395 elevated expressway between the MacArthur and I-95 and replace it with a depressed expressway. (The main arguement for the depression is that I-395 acts as a seperater of Downtown and "Midtown", not to mention it looks unsightful looking north on Biscayne)

I'm not agreeing with the folks from Sweetwater, I just understand their arguement, even though its a weak one.

The Police exist for a reason.

[Verticus]

Originally Posted by BornInTheGrove

I always interpreted undesireables as bums and homeless using the 'shelter' of the column and overhead tracks to sleep under... also the potential for these areas to be used by drug dealers and users, because of the resulting darkness created from said overhead tracks and columns.

These are some of these arguements used to do away with the I-395 elevated expressway between the MacArthur and I-95 and replace it with a depressed expressway. (The main arguement for the depression is that I-395 acts as a seperater of Downtown and "Midtown", not to mention it looks unsightful looking north on Biscayne)

I'm not agreeing with the folks from Sweetwater, I just understand their arguement, even though its a weak one.

The Police exist for a reason.

Now, BIG, why would an "undersireable"-- they call them "untouchables" in India-- want to use the "shelter" of the overhead MetroRail tracks when they can crash at the new Camillus House where they'll get 3-square meals a day and live in air-conditioned comfort?