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Old November 20th, 2006, 09:21 PM   #301
Justme
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SYDNEYAHOLIC View Post
Note;

the Sydney Commuter Rail system is usually referred to as a "Hybrid System" - that is, a mix between commuter rail and Metro
This is basically true, although in general, due to the lengths of the City Rail lines, they are far more closely related to suburban than metro.

The hybrid systems around the world are known by many different names, in Paris, the RER, in Germany the S-bahn etc. But in all of these cases, the hybrid system works together with a metro system as well. In other words, not just the hybrid system.

In fact, Paris and most German cities also have a 3rd or 4th layer of urban rail above the first two (metro and hybrid) which can be longer suburban services and longer distance trains. Effectively, the City Rail network would be closer to a combination S-bahn and R-bahn in Germany, considering that it crosses the Blue Mountains, and reaches into Newcastle and Wollongong. You can see what I mean by these maps here.

The first shows Frankfurt's main metro core where you can see the U-bahn (metro), S-bahn (Suburban Hybrid) and R-bahn (Grey lines) which are the longer distance commuter trains, and like City Rail in Sydney, they also travel to other close by cities.


This one shows the wider metropolitan area (and a tad more) and you can see more of the R-bahn lines (which are coloured here like the S-bahn, but with just numbers such as "66" instead of "S6"), and how extensive they are. The U-bahns are not shown on this map to preserve legibility.


Below all these heavy rail lines, the Frankfurt Metro area (Rhein Main) has three seperate Tram networks, the largest in Frankfurt itself, which are not shown on these maps, but on the local area transport maps.
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Old November 29th, 2006, 03:55 AM   #302
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Fantasy map for Hamilton, Ontario. The system would be elevated guideways running streetcars in their own ROW. The uptown/downtown line acts only as a geographical boundary, and there are no fare zones. There is an interchange with GO service at Hunter Station.

Chances are we will never see anything close to that here (as there isn't really a huge amount of demand for it), but I'd sure love an alternative to the HSR buses.
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Old November 30th, 2006, 11:01 AM   #303
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I'm currently creating a fantasy map for the entire city of Calgary but for the mean time here's one of a Northern Cross, enjoy!

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Old December 2nd, 2006, 05:53 PM   #304
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World Metro Map

Hello, like alot of you on here I've been doodling fantasy subway maps since I was a kid!

This is a map of all the Metros, Subways, Undergrounds and metro-like rail systems in the world, placed loosely in the right place to make a diagram of how they might all link together in the style of the classic London Underground diagram!

It was conceived by myself a few years ago and executed by a wonderful chap called Alan Foale whose design studio are responsible for officially updating the London Tube Map. It was very kindly given official sanction by London Underground (a rare honour). It was produced for the book "Metro Maps Of The World" in 2003 (as mentioned on this forum by Mike) which had the official maps of every subway system, plus a handful of fantasy maps but a future edition will include more of these dream maps. It was also turned into a poster sold by Londons Transport Museum and there were some postcards and leaflet made of it too.

(only for myspace users - another more public link coming soon!)

It can be also be seen animated and curved round the globe here:
http://www.metromapsoftheworld.com/

And here it is on the first edition front cover in more detail:

...and revised for the second edition here:


:-)
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Old December 2nd, 2006, 06:04 PM   #305
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Wow, I wasn't aware the second edition mimicks the tube map in such a close fashion. Did you revise the entire overview for inclusion the inside title as you did for the first edition?
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Old December 2nd, 2006, 06:39 PM   #306
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Updates and Dutch

Yes Robert, pretty much everything that could be update was (calculated almost 300 new maps and images in darker blue UK edition) - and we have since produced a DUTCH edition, just 6 weeks ago! Also fully updated with over 100 new maps in and a Dutch version of the world map - cant paste it here as it does not exist online anywhere yet but happy to email U a copy if you've not seen it :-)

Mark

Front cover of Dutch edition is very different too:

http://www.nl.bol.com/is-bin/INTERSH...%20de%20wereld

Last edited by MarkO; December 2nd, 2006 at 06:40 PM. Reason: Image details wrong
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Old December 2nd, 2006, 08:32 PM   #307
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I bought your book (the Dutch edition) a few months ago. Really a nice collection!
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Old December 2nd, 2006, 10:17 PM   #308
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My fantasy map for a fantasy city. All that's left to do is fill in the stations...

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Old December 2nd, 2006, 10:20 PM   #309
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That's great Alargule glad U liked it.

It's such a bizarre thing for an English person to visit a country where everyone appreciates the value of public transport - I heard that in the Netherlands planners forbid building of new large settlements unless there is a provision for new rail or tram operations! Is that true or just an urban myth?

Such a long way from where the UK is. They want to throw up 200,000 new homes without even considering new rail! It's bonkers!


Your fantasy map is really nice, and here's a little tip for map-making I picked up while researching the book; try and think of how to make space for the station names at the same time as drawing the map - reason is, as you'll see when you try to fit the names in, they are an important a piece of the jigsaw as the shape of the lines. Happy mapping!

:-)
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Last edited by MarkO; December 2nd, 2006 at 10:26 PM. Reason: typo
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Old December 2nd, 2006, 10:26 PM   #310
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That depends. Newly built-up areas in Amsterdam or Rotterdam usually get a new railway connection (metro, tram) to the existing network. In Amsterdam, they even built a completely new tram line to connect IJburg to the network.

Downside of it all are the huge costs, plus the fact that no project in the Netherlands somehow can be completed without considerable delays and cost overruns. In the meanwhile, the residents who came to live in the new areas all use their cars to get around...
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Old December 3rd, 2006, 04:57 AM   #311
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@MarkO: I've seen the Dutch version on the Dutch forum but I refuse to buy translations for publications of which I speak the language (unfortunately limited to Dutch, English, German, Danish, Norwegian and Swedish at the moment).

I won't buy each edition of a book, but as time progresses you'll probably have another sale here for the third or fourth one.
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Old December 3rd, 2006, 12:58 PM   #312
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Snob...

Since the Dutch translation is readily available and - I presume - cheaper than buying the original one, I'd just buy it. Oh wait, I already did
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Old December 3rd, 2006, 01:20 PM   #313
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@ MarkO: you're right about the stations. But my first concern was to design a map that would be a schematic derivative of this one:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alargule View Post
Furthermore, I saw you included the map of Max Roberts in your book (at least: the Dutch version). I can remember Max posting his drafts at SubTalk (the present SubChat), which inspired me to make this map. I think the NY MTA should reconsider using its present semi-geographic map. It doesn't really stand out, and makes a terrible mess of the Brooklyn Downtown area.
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Old December 3rd, 2006, 03:08 PM   #314
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Languages and New York Subway Map mess

CapzillaRobert makes a fair point (though if you're sort of guy who needs the latest of everything, the Dutch version has about 100 new maps in :-)) - and cudos to him for speaking so many lingo's - I'm having trouble learning just one more (French) but yes I'm sure MMOTW will be available in other languages too and I know there will be a new English edition in 2007 - and would love to include more space for fantasy maps as they are much more experimental than some of the official versions. :-)

Regards the current NY map; (speaking as someone who's only visited rather than lived there) I must agree that it is seems a bit strange that New Yorkers (or rather the heads of MTA design department) have chosen a geographic map for a city that's so in love the grid.

The popular story was that the cities most recent diagram (Vignell's) somehow "uspet" users because stations were not were not shown in exactly the same relation to their geographic reality. Well (much as I love the Vignelli map as a piece of art) I cant really see why it could not have just been tweaked a little? After all New Yorkers had been using a diagrammatic style of map since George Salomens 1959 version so it strikes me the drastic move back to geographic was a slightly extreme reaction they've been too embarrassed to move back from ever since.

Certainly the Kick map, Max Roberts, the Columbia University version, your own erstwhile efforts and many other designers have shown that it is entirely possible (if not preferable) to draw such a complex network as a more user-friendly diagram (and in the case of the Kick map in particular http://www.visualcomplexity.com/vc/project.cfm?id=267 still include the streets and districts with modern computer colouring techniques).

Those messy clumps of multi-coloured knitting wool on the curent NY map in Lower Manhattan, Brooklyn and elsewhere are no use to man or beast and a concerted campaign by map designers might still shift the MTA into tidying things up, maybe?! We can live in hope!
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Old December 4th, 2006, 12:47 PM   #315
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Maybe we should just spam the MTA with our alternative designs...
Of all attempts for a more user-friendly map, I like Jabbour's attempt (the Kick design map) most. And he really made work of it: he contacted the MTA with his map and held several interviews with local newspapers.
But the MTA seem more interested in building a new Fulton Transit Center with 'a fancy roof' than introducing a more user-friendly map...
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Old December 5th, 2006, 02:28 PM   #316
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Fantasy World Maps

....and finally thanks to the good people at London Underground Blogspot (http://london-underground.blogspot.com) I can include an image of the map I did for the MMOTW book.



Was never intended as a fantasy of map of desired connections, just a quaint way of linking all the worlds exisitng metro systems on a diagram of the world. :-)

Also check out the blogspot - it always has amusing and bizarre stuff on!

x
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Old December 5th, 2006, 02:41 PM   #317
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Nice map! I never knew Amsterdam was located near Rostock...
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Old December 5th, 2006, 07:18 PM   #318
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Great map, MarkO!

There are two "Valencia" in the dark blue line.
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Old December 5th, 2006, 07:20 PM   #319
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"Attention: service from Valencia to Valencia has been suspended due to a passenger fallen ill between Fortaleza and Lisboa."
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Old December 5th, 2006, 08:58 PM   #320
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this is a splendide idea! i didn't know Auckland has some kind of metro system.
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