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Old January 24th, 2007, 05:33 AM   #1
Sundaravelu
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Chennai Traffic Management

Fellow forumers, you are doing great job. I am visiting this forum for six months now and it is very informative. We can have all our traffic management discussion in this thread. Thanks
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Old January 24th, 2007, 06:10 PM   #2
ferrari_fan
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no offence, but i think this is a topic for the chaibar..
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Old January 24th, 2007, 08:53 PM   #3
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traffic management

(a) This is not really traffic management.. but I hope that DMV updates its handbook and testing procedures to incorporate the concept of driving within a lane, using signals when changing lanes and when to change lanes etc. Also, educate folks on the concept of slower traffic and buses on left lanes and allow fast moving traffic to be on the right lanes. Key education should be for bus and truck drivers.

(b) Can we replace the "Halt and Go" with the more universal "STOP" sign ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stop_sign

(c) Can introduce the concept of a center right turn lanes where cars can wait to make turns without affecting normal traffic flow ? Can we also standardize on lane markings. Attached is the blurb from the California driver's handbook.

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/hdbk/pgs22thru25.htm#lanes

(d) How about posting and enforcing speed limits for city roads and reduced speed limits for school areas ?

(e) How about making sure that all school buses are uniformly painted (e.g yellow like in most countries) and making sure that they are given priority to ensure that children are protected ?

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/hdbk/pgs1...htm#speedchild

(f) Finally, how about making seat belts mandatory and start encouraging the use of child restraint systems to protect children and infants ?

(g) Make helmet use mandatory for 2-wheelers and prohibit more than 2 people on 2-wheelers (esp children in front or in the lap) on highways and other roads with higher speed limit.

Thanks
- KC
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Old January 25th, 2007, 07:12 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ferrari_fan View Post
no offence, but i think this is a topic for the chaibar..
Ferrari I think we must thank Sundaravelu a lot for taking the initiative to create this thread But, no offence to you too. You were just letting us know the forum conventions. We will learn them fast :-)

Jumping into the subject...

First and foremost - Pedestrians should be given utmost priority whenever any kind of traffic management or planning happens. We Chennaiites use the road to walk rather than the footpath.
- Footpath height (from the road) and width should be standardised
- Hawking (if at all permitted) should be done in restricted areas that will or should have wider foot paths (preferably twice as wide as the standard)
- A duct under the footpath (preferably at the side opposite to the road) for all the cables and pipes!!!

WOW!!! That would solve 50% (atleast my guess) of the traffic mess we have in our hands. We most probably will have the entire width of the road to use if we take of our pedestrians with utmost care.

I really have a strong feeling that we will succeed, if we all forumers take this up in baby steps till the end with lot of persistence.

As a Chennai road user, total lack of safety and regard to the pedestrians, let alone the physically challenged and the senior citizens, scares me the most.
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Old January 25th, 2007, 08:11 PM   #5
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Smile Need some proper planning..

First thanks to Kannan for takin this effort to start an activity...

Some serious planning should happen in chennai to control the traffic...traffic is increasing like real estate prices...
This govt which seemed to do some infrastructure work, has suddenly stopped every thing...
There are lot of things pending in City which would help to control the traffic if completed soon

1) MRTS - i think this will be a 20 yr plan...delhi metro started and completed TWO phases...we are still constructing...I would say the MRTS should run in OMR...which will help ppl to leave their cars and take the train...

2) Flyovers - We have the first flyover in india(Gemini flyover)...but now we lack in building them also...In germany they built a football stadium in just 2 years...we are takin 5 years to complete one flyover...flyovers should be contructed in proper places to reduce the traffic...

3) Proper Traffic rules - People should follow the traffic rules, lane rule should be strictly followed. Strict fines should be collected for the ppl who voilate the traffic rules

4) IT corridor - I think its better they convert the project to elevated Highway, anyway its delayed...they havent done anything after srp tools, so they can very well start the elevatd high way from that point...which would help in future also...

5) Illegal Building and hoarding - Remove all these illegal things from road, which will clear the road for better traffic, I have heard old ppl saying that in old days most of the roads are as big as six lane road, now only very few are broad..
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Old January 25th, 2007, 08:20 PM   #6
WillyWick
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was'nt this thread about preparing a detailed plan?
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Old January 25th, 2007, 08:58 PM   #7
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Thats right, we should be coming up with detailed solutions to specific problems. Like identifying roads to make it one way, or suitable areas for flyovers or a new road perhaps, to ease congestion

Quote:
Originally Posted by kannan infratech View Post
Another good news which I have to share with the forumers!!!

The TN Govt ( Urban Dev Ministry Officials) have asked me to give suggestions for traffic management at each important junction within Chennai city and the crucial junctions within the CMA. They have made it very clear that this is not an official assignment and they will not pay any money.

They were very impressed that a bunch of guys are so much interested in Chennai development and spending so much time in discussing the finer points. One official passed a comment that if the suggestions given by the forumers are good and acceptable to them, they may arrange a Felicitation Meeting at Chennai for the forumers, who contributed and the Chief Minister can be invited for the same.

I have the following suggestions, which our forumers may decide collectively.

We will start a separate thread - CHENNAI TRAFFIC MANAGEMENT or similar.

Let us have a few forumers (Voulanteers) who will act like moderators and remove the unnecessary / unwanted details.

First we will list all the crucial junctions and number / name them. Each relevant suggestion should be quoted with the reference no / name.

We may start with city first and then go to the suburbs, unless they are very crucial and needy.

We will submit the final approved reports at a seminar / conference to be arranged by SSC Forum at Chennai.

If the Chennai based Forumers can help me by giving support, I will arrange a gala meeting - may be one day seminar / conference at a city hotel on a convenient date when most of the forumers (incl ones from abroad) are available. (may be Summer Hols, Puja Hols, Deepavali Hols or Christmas hols - 2007). I will try to rope in CII or any other similar agency as co partners. I will also try to get sponsorships by giving advt space. I will use our influence and try to get the TN CM / Urban Dev Minister or Union IT Minister to preside over the conference. We can also invite the top notch guys from Infra Dev field who can also participate in the deliberations.

We at SSC Forum will have the satisfaction that all our efforts and time spent will not go waste and we can showcase the fruits to those who matter. Implementation of our suggestions is another BIG issue and lets hope for the best.
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Old January 25th, 2007, 09:19 PM   #8
WillyWick
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maybe i will repost some of the solutions proposed by sridhar... if any of the regular forumers find some relevant post that i missed, pls do post them. apart from that we were supposed to stick to the topic and prepare a report... not get into any other gibberish

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sridhar
My dream expressway network for Chennai (with detailed alignments and selected interchange locations)

1. Mount Road Expressway - 6 lanes - entirely along NH45 - elevated till Kathipara, surface alignment after that
Start at War Memorial (Chennai Port Trust Gate No. 2) - a complex interchange at this location as it meets three other expressways (Western, Coastal and Ennore expressways)
Cloverleaf interchange at Chintadripet (with potentially a connection to the Western expressway described below)
Trumpet interchange at LIC building
Cloverleaf interchange at Nungambakkam
Trumpet interchange at Teynampet
Trumpet interchange at Nandanam
Cloverleaf interchange at Saidapet Cloverleaf interchange at Chamiers Road/Venkatanarayana Road junction
Trumpet interchange at Guindy/SPIC building (junction with Coastal expressway described below)
Cloverleaf interchange at Kathipara junction (already under construction by NHAI)
Trumpet interchange plus connecting road to new airport north of Meenambakkam terminal
Diamond Interchange at old Airport (under construction by NHAI)
Elevated rotary at MIT Gate/Chromepet (under construction)
Trumpet interchange at Tambaram (junction with Chennai Bypass)

2. Western Expressway - 6 lanes - along NH4 - entirely elevated till Maduravoyal
Start at War Memorial (Chennai Port Trust Gate No. 2) - a complex interchange at this location as it meets three other expressways (Mount Road, Coastal and Ennore Expressways)
Exit at Central Station
Exit at Egmore Station
Trumpet interchange at Anna Nagar
Cloverleaf interchange at junction with Inner Ring Road (under construction by NHAI)
Cloverleaf interchange at junction with Chennai Bypass expressway (under construction by NHAI)

3. Coastal Expressway - 4 lanes - along beach road till the lighthouse, then along Foreshore road (new alignment) till Adyar and then along S.P.Road till Guindy (meeting the IT expressway at Madhya Kailash)
Start at War Memorial (Chennai Port Trust Gate No. 2) - a complex interchange at this location as it meets three other expressways (Mount Road, Western and Ennore Expressways)
Trumpet interchange at Kamarajar Salai
Trumpet interchange at Ice House (plus widening/improvement of road towards Triplicane)
Trumpet interchange at Radhakrishnan Salai
Trumpet interchange for new road towards Mylapore
Cloverleaf interchange at Chamiers Road/Adyar Bridge road intersection
Cloverleaf interchange at Malar Hospital
Trumpet interchange at Madhya Kailash (junction with IT expressway)
Trumpet interchange at IIT Gate
Trumpet interchange at road going towards Saidapet
Trumpet interchange at Guindy, where this road meets Mount Road expressway

4. IT expressway - 6 lanes - alignment as planned (along old Mahabalipuram road, plus connection to the East Coast Road) - trumpet interchanges at Madhya Kailash and Velachery Road at Taramani/TIDEL park. Exits (trumpet interchanges) along the way at regular intervals, trumpet interchange at connector to ECR

5. Chennai Bypass expressway - 4 lanes - alignment as planned - trumpet interchange at Tambaram (junction with Mount Road expressway/NH45), cloverleaf at junction with Western Expressway at Maduravoyal/NH4 and trumpet interchange at junction with NH5. New exits to be planned as the areas adjacent to it develop

6. Ennore Expressway/NH5 - 4 lanes - alignment as planned (to be converted into a full access-controlled expressway)

In future, there will be scope to convert the East Coast Road into a four-lane expressway and the construction of a new Outer Ring Road (4 lanes). Of this dream expressway network, 4 through 6 are already under construction and 2 has just been announced. I wish they quickly move towards announcing 1 and 3 also. While 1 (Mount Road) has been talked about in the past, 3 (coastal expressway) is entirely new - I have not seen discussion of any such plan in the press. However, it is essential, as it would form a crucial link between the other expressways and the IT expressway. If the IT corridor is to be the future business district of the city, this expressway is absolutely essential. I have pointed out many times in the past that the current plans do not provide for any means of efficient dispersal of traffic from Madhya Kailash junction onwards. Without this expressway, there is going to be chaos at Madhya Kailash and on S.P.Road once the IT expressway is completed.

Since the S.P.Road stretch is hard to convert into an expressway (expensive land acquisition at Adyar itself, two flyovers that will need to be torn down, heavy local traffic, heritage concerns due to multiple memorials, Raj Bhavan etc. on this stretch), an alternative alignment could be the following

Malar Hospital
Besant Nagar Road
Tiruvanmiyur
TIDEL Park
Velachery
Adambakkam
Kathipara

This will relieve the pressure at Madhya Kailash (since vehicles going towards Mount Road will take the expressway towards Kathipara and those towards Mylapore or north of that can take it in the other direction). I actually like this alignment more (though it will be more expensive as more land will need to be acquired) since it creates a road corridor into the rapidly developing Velachery area.

Most of the coastal expressway is feasible. The only concern will be beach road, where the magnificient vista of the beach and the old buildings along the road could be potentially destroyed by ugly concrete structures. However, I believe that with proper design, one can take care of such concerns quite easily. There are many coastal highways around the world that add to, rather than reduce the beauty of the promenade.
http://skyscrapercity.com/showpost.p...1&postcount=20
http://skyscrapercity.com/showpost.p...1&postcount=21



Quote:
Originally Posted by Sridhar
Here is an idea I have about a way we in this forum can contribute positively towards our cities' development. The idea I have is based on the observation that planning in India still happens in a piecemeal fashion. We think that one expressway can be built in isolation, without thinking what will happen at its ends (e.g. IT expressway). We think that building a new international terminal at an airport, while retaining the same concrete monstrosity (with eight gates, where 18 are necessary today) for domestic operations would be sufficient. There is a need for more awareness building on what is possible, with somewhat more thought given to the planning process. And this does not require high level of expertise at least for conceptualizing the infrastructural needs (later stages of course need a very high level of expertise).

So how about putting together a Vision Chennai project here at the SSC forum. We have already articulated our vision of various elements of urban infrastructure in Chennai, but could go into more depth and channel the considerable energies here into something even more productive. The end result of the project would be a presentation, that we could put up on the internet (I am willing to pay to set up a website) and also distribute to people on CD-ROMS. These CDs can be sent to Government officials, media and opinion makers. The objective would be to spread awareness about the possibilities and also to contribute in our own small ways towards making a better city. This project can be extended to all other cities in the country in due course.

This is not going to be an easy project. And it will require the collaborative effort of many of us. If there are volunteers willing to work on this, we can go ahead with this project here. We will specifically require to look at the following elements of infrastructure (and this is only an illustrative list, not an exhaustive one).

1. Expressways and roads
2. Mass transit - metro, rail, MRTS (or other options like BRT where applicable)
3. Airport
4. Port (including the infrastructure for transport from the port to the hinterland)
5. Water (working out requirements for the future, available options and future phasing of projects)
6. Power
7. Sanitation, including solid waste removal
8. Recreation - parks, playgrounds

In each of these areas, we would need to
a. Collect data on the current status of Chennai
b. Benchmark against global standards, perhaps give case studies of key comparator cities
c. Recommend future direction (being specific wherever feasible)
d. Estimate costs for such projects

The project will aim to give a picture of today and where Chennai should be 15 years from now and what needs to be done to get there.

This seems like a tough project that only a McKinsey or a Scott Wilson can take up. But I do believe that the minimum expertise necessary already exists here. And if we take it one step at a time, this project is feasible over the next couple of months.

So let me ask. Are there any volunteers for this project that has the potential of changing the future of our city, instead of only talking about it? If so, we can put together a team to work on the project and spend the next couple of months finishing this. If there are volunteers on this thread, we could open a new thread and start putting together how we would go about this project in that thread.

Comments/suggestions/criticism are always welcome.
http://skyscrapercity.com/showpost.p...8&postcount=92

Last edited by WillyWick; January 26th, 2007 at 02:20 AM.
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Old January 25th, 2007, 09:43 PM   #9
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traffic management

We can build all the roads and expressways we want. But without proper driver education and enforcement of lane discipline and other rules, chaos will rule supreme. It is not enough if we pump in money to improve the roads and make them wider. We should also focus on imparting proper driving skills so that driving on these new roads will be enjoyable and incident free.

After living in the US for more the 10 years, I am still looking forward for the day where I can sit in a car or bus in India without clutching my heart and wondering when we are going to get into an accident. If folks in Bombay can follow lane discipline, why is it so tough to do the same in Madras ?

- KC
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Old January 25th, 2007, 09:53 PM   #10
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it is a chicken or egg prorblem... bTW have u visited NYC? why do people over there dont follow lane discipline(especially during peak hours)? Any over crowded place in the world people dont have time to follow lanes. let us not get into silly discussions like this and let us get into some real solutions

Last edited by WillyWick; January 25th, 2007 at 10:02 PM.
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Old January 25th, 2007, 10:04 PM   #11
PlaneMad
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The biggest problem concerning traffic in India?
a)Cows
b)Humans
c)2 wheelers
d)3 wheelers
e)4 wheelers

pretty much everything is a problem really
Good job willywick for the compilation.

Might i urge other forumers to contribute diagrams, maps etc rather than "roads need to be widened"

If needed you can use the SVG map from http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Im...ocator_map.svg
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Old January 25th, 2007, 11:00 PM   #12
Devarajan
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The thread is getting flooded with ideas as usual

Can we take one step at a time or in other words take one problem at a time (within traffic management) and arrive at a solution and then move on to the next? Chances of us deviating from the topic are huge here.

We would need 3 or 4 moderators to have the focus that is needed. I can be one of them if you all are ok with it.

More volunteers please!!!
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Old January 26th, 2007, 12:07 AM   #13
WillyWick
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mods of this forum are sudheeshnair, suncity and drwho. They would delete the posts when required.
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Old January 26th, 2007, 12:48 AM   #14
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please dont delete this thread. imho this promises to be a great thread.
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Old January 26th, 2007, 01:09 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WillyWick View Post
it is a chicken or egg prorblem... bTW have u visited NYC? why do people over there dont follow lane discipline(especially during peak hours)? Any over crowded place in the world people dont have time to follow lanes. let us not get into silly discussions like this and let us get into some real solutions
I respectfully disagree to this statement above. Driving in NYC is challenging but you definitely don't find people driving in multiple lanes, ignoring stop signs/lights etc. Citing overcrowding as a reason for chaos is not acceptable. Indian drivers are bad - lets accept that and try to improve that.

So, lets agree to disagree.

- KC

Last edited by metalfan; January 26th, 2007 at 01:17 AM.
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Old January 26th, 2007, 02:12 AM   #16
WillyWick
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Quote:
Originally Posted by metalfan View Post
Indian drivers are bad - lets accept that and try to improve that.
fixing the drving issues is not the intent of the thread, but rather creating maps and models on juntions to ease the flow of traffic

Quote:
So, lets agree to disagree.

- KC
sounds good to me
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Old January 26th, 2007, 10:00 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Devarajan
Ferrari I think we must thank Sundaravelu a lot for taking the initiative to create this thread But, no offence to you too. You were just letting us know the forum conventions. We will learn them fast :-)
definitely, a big 'thank you' to to Sundaravelu!!

well, to contribute to this thread, here is my somewhat amateurish plan for the Madhya Kailash junction.. please delete it if it is too impractical..




to explain, basically, there's a flyover from the Gandhi Nagar side of SP Road for traffic going towards Guindy and the Airport.. this flyover will have to be extra-high to pass over the MRTS tracks.. it'll be a 3-lane one-way flyover, and the existing service lane on the south side can be used for the remaining traffic, after it is widened to 2 full lanes width - 2 lanes should be sufficient since traffic will be signal-free..

there is a 4-lane subway for 2-way traffic travelling from OMR to the new 4-lane river bank road which is u/c, and vice-versa..

traffic from OMR going towards Adyar (i.e. turning right at MK junction) will continue to use the U-turn under the IIT flyover, and then proceed straight at the MK junction to reach Adyar.. therefore, traffic entering the city from OMR will either turn left, or use the subway to go straight..

traffic from Adyar will either use the flyover to proceed straight or turn left onto OMR.. there will be no traffic going straight or right at the junction.. to access the river bank road, traffic from Adyar can use interior roads and reach it near the Kotturpuram MRTS station, about 1 km north of this junction..

traffic from the new river bank road will either use the new subway to proceed straight to OMR, or turn left towards Adyar.. there will be no right turn..

finally, traffic on SP Road from Guindy side will either turn right (it will be a free right with no signal), or use the free-left turn or proceed straight (which will also be signal free..)


to sum up, all directions of traffic will have signal-free straight and left directions, but right turns will not be allowed.. the SP Road traffic from Guindy alone will have signal-free right-turn also..

pedestrian overbridges with escalators will be provided as shown and entry of pedestrians onto the carriageways of any of these roads will be forbidden and any violation will be heavily fined.. any accidents involving pedestrians will be considered the responsibility of the pedestrian only, and the drivers of vehicles will hold no liability..

edit : there is also supposed to be an FOB to cross the river bank road which i've forgotten to add in the image..




Last edited by ferrari_fan; January 26th, 2007 at 10:30 AM.
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Old January 26th, 2007, 10:48 AM   #18
kannan infratech
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Guys!

I am having problems with my broadband and am unable to upload any attachment. I have prepared a list of junctions and some solutions which were discussed earlier. We can take this and Sridhars Ring Road diagram as base to start with.

I am using Eicher's Chennai map and Google Earth for reference.

I will upload the details soon.
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Old January 26th, 2007, 05:20 PM   #19
kannan infratech
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I am posting the base format in formats:
I have covered North Chennai. Please add any detail I have missed.

KANNAN INFRATECH - PART I :

CHENNAI CITY TRAFFIC MANAGEMENT

City Zone: Borders:

Royapuram to Perambur to Villivakkam to Padi

Royapuram to Thiruvanmiyur to Velachery to Tambaram,

Padi to Koyambedu to Porur to Kathipara to Tambaram

INNER ZONES : North Chennai, Central Chennai, West Chennai, South Chennai

NORTH CHENNAI :

Major Roads:

Outside City Limits:

Ennore Expressway – Royapuram to Ennore
Thiruvotriyur High Road – Basin Bridge to Thiruvotriyur
Kathivakkam High Road – Basin Bridge to Manali / Thiruvotriyur
Erukkancheri High Road (GNT ROAD)
Inner Ring Road
Ambattur Red Hills Road
Outer Ring Road

Inside City Limits:

Rajaji Salai ( Beach Road) – Muthuswamy Road
Old Jail Road
Prakasam Road (Broadway)
Strahans Road – Konnur High Road
Medavakkam Tank Road
Mint Street
Walltax Road
NSC Boase Road
EVR Periyar Salai (Poonamallee High Road)
Sydenhams Road
Purasawalkam High Road
Ritherdon Road
Vepery High Road
Choolai High Road
Alagappa Road – Ormes Road
Kilpauk Garden Road
Taylors Road
New Avadi Road
Anna Arch Road – III Avenue
Anna Nagar II Avenue (Round Tana to Thirumangalam)
Anna Nagar VI Avenue (Anna Nagar West BS to New Avadi Road
MTH Road
Jawahar Lal Nehru Inner Ring Road

Major Junctions

Parry’s Corner
Royapuram RS
Basin Bridge Road– Wall Tax Road
Mint Street – Basin Bridge Road
Elephant Gate PS – Walltax Road – NSC Bose Road
Salt Cotarus - ESI Hospital
NSC Bose Rd – Mint Street
NSC Bose Road – Prakasam Road
Esplanade – High Court Rear Gate
PH Road – Walltax Road - Mint Street – Evening Bazaar Road
Central Station Entrance
Flower Bazar PS – High Court Bus Stand Road
Perambur RS (Paper Mills Road- Madhavaram High Road – Perambur Main Road – Perambur High Road)
Pulianthope (Near Binny Mills)
Perambur Barracks Road Subway – Vyasarpadi RS
Pattalam
Villivakkam RS
Nathamuni Theatre
Padi
Amabttur Redhills Road – JN Inner Ring Road
Purasawalkam High Road – Perambur Barracks Road – Ritherdon Road
EVK Sampath Road – Vepery High Road – Choolai High Road
Sydenhams Road – PH Road (Chennai Corporation)
Periamet (Vepery High Road – Sydenhams Road)
Daily Thanthi (EVK Sampath Road- PH Road)
CMDA Building (PH Road – Riverside Road)
Pur H Road – Ritherdon Road
PH Road – Dasprakash Hotel
PH Road – Flowers Road
Pur High Road – Balfour Road – Medavakkam Tank Road
Millers Road – Pur High Road - Brick Kiln Road
Balfour Road – Alagappa Road – Kilpauk Garden Road
KG Road – Taylors Road
KG Road – New Avadi Road
Anna Nagar – Chinthamani – KG Road
New Avadi Road – A Nagar VI Avenue
New Avadi Road – A Nagar III Avenue
A Nagar II Avenue – Anna Arch Road (Round Tana)
Thirumangalam
JN Inner Ring Road – Ambattur Estate Mogappair Road – A Nagar VI Avenue
Koyambedu Junction
Madhuravoyal ORR Junction
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Old January 26th, 2007, 09:22 PM   #20
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parking structures

Are there plans to build more parking structures ? Having more parking structures will clear the roads of parked vehicles allowing room to add at least one more lane.

- KC
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