Wirral Waters

[kat2]

You see those two large glass towers in the last render? their going to be business towers, but whats special about them? you will find out in October of this year.
kat

[Gareth]

They generate their own electricity?

[kat2]

No, although micro regeneration will be installed on some of the towers. most towers in the uk are around the thirty four thirty five story height, indeed canary wharf is around fifty storys there will be nothing in the united kingdom that could match the height as a pair.
kat

[Oges efc]

Originally Posted by kat2

No, although micro regeneration will be installed on some of the towers. most towers in the uk are around the thirty four thirty five story height, indeed canary wharf is around fifty storys there will be nothing in the united kingdom that could match the height as a pair.
kat

Sounds good !

[Roo]

Following on from Kats news there.... todays dp news article on the scheme...

Peel pushes ahead with £4bn Wirral Waters scheme
Jul 21 2008 by Liam Murphy, Liverpool Daily Post


PLANS for shops, offices and new-build residential developments are expected to be with Wirral’s planners later this summer for the next stage in the ambitious £4bn Wirral Waters scheme.

The plans by the company behind the regeneration of Salford Quays are for the North Bank area of Birkenhead docks.

The site was the final home of the U534 German U-Boat which has since been cut into sections and relocated to Woodside Ferry Terminal by Merseytravel.

Now the site will be the location of the next step by Peel of their plans to build a new community around the already renovated corn warehouses at the docks.

The company is planning a major consultation exercise in the coming months on the Wirral Waters scheme which has undergone major changes since it was first revealed two years ago. Lindsey Ashworth, development director for Peel, said the recently completed baseline study which examined every aspect of the dockland area had represented a major investment in the area already by the company.

He said: “We spent hundreds of thousands of pounds on it.

“It’s a factual study and a massive piece of work, about 200mm thick, with a range of professionals such as archaeologists, recording what is there at the moment.

“When you put in a planning application you are supposed to improve the current environment.

“In 20 years when you come back and compare it to what is there then, it will show how the area has improved.”

He said Peel are about to submit planning applications for more primarily residential developments, but will also include offices and shops.

Mr Ashworth said: “The next phase will put some shops in there, maybe a foodstore about 10-15,000 sq ft, hopefully for the basis of a community.

“The area needs more population around there.

“We have got five buildings on that site and the aim is to build a community with the corn warehouses as the hub.”

The Wirral Waters scheme as it was first described by Peel would create 27,000 full-time jobs and see more than 500 acres of brownfield, underused dockland redeveloped.

As well as creating a waterfront to rival Shanghai the initial plans for Wirral Waters also included a major retail shopping centre at Bidston Moss, and more than 11m square feet to be developed to provide 15,000 new homes.

This ties in with last week’s announcement that the Mersey Heartlands had been made a “growth point” by the Government allowing significant numbers of new homes to be built in parts of Birkenhead and Liverpool.

The Peel plans are a key element in the council’s aims to regenerate Wirral’s economy through extra housing and business development.

[kat2]

since information seems to be coming out rather quickly i will say that the two glass towers in the above render are ninety floors in height, when topped out one of the towers will be one thousand two hundred feet. You will probably hear more about the glass towers in October. The thinking behind the towers is that it will mean that office space can be concentrated in one area and that many of the old renders will give way to lower residential construction which is far more suitable for wirral.
kat

[Roo]

F**K ME SIDEWAYS! lol. Thats like... whoa...

The shard eat your heart out! I would also suspect that the mass of towers being proposed (and submitted for planning this year) will not be watered down too much, as wirral council seem far more accepting than Liverpool, and excited even about the prospect peel have put forward.

The UK will literaly have its own twin towers, right here on the mersey, and thats a stunning concept to me. The question is though... say if the proposal did get past Wirral council... would the government be able to intervene because of its sheer size?

[Veinticinco]

Twin 90 floor office towers in Birkenhead. It will never happen. Sorry I like to be optimistic but that's ridiculous. No way on earth could Peel fill those 2 towers, they couldn't fill half of one.

[the pool08]

Originally Posted by kat2

since information seems to be coming out rather quickly i will say that the two glass towers in the above render are ninety floors in height, when topped out one of the towers will be one thousand two hundred feet. You will probably hear more about the glass towers in October. The thinking behind the towers is that it will mean that office space can be concentrated in one area and that many of the old renders will give way to lower residential construction which is far more suitable for wirral.
kat

wow

[Chris B]

Originally Posted by kat2

since information seems to be coming out rather quickly i will say that the two glass towers in the above render are ninety floors in height, when topped out one of the towers will be one thousand two hundred feet.

Thanks for the update kat. Let's hope they come to pass. While I was watching the Tall ships today, I couldn't help but think it would be nice if the Wirral had a skyline. I'm afraid the tunnel ventilation shafts don't cut it for me.

Originally Posted by Roo

as wirral council seem far more accepting than Liverpool, and excited even about the prospect peel have put forward.

Nail on head. I don't think it's that Liverpool has been against the Liverpool Waters scheme as such. It's just that the city has been rather indifferent, almost dis-interested. These schemes may feel like pie in the sky - and maybe that is all what they will ever turn out to be. However, if it's costing the city nothing, and given the financial clout of Peel, there exists a (open to opinion) realistic chance of it happening, why not encourage it?

Originally Posted by twiz

Twin 90 floor office towers in Birkenhead. It will never happen. Sorry I like to be optimistic but that's ridiculous. No way on earth could Peel fill those 2 towers, they couldn't fill half of one.

I'm sure someone, somewhere would have said the same thing once when someone revealed plans for an 800ft skyscraper - the tallest in Europe no less - on the derelict wastes of the former London Docklands. Never say never.

[eyeam]

There's no way a 90 storey tower will be built in the wirral any time soon. Nor in Liverpool. What kind of logic is having all the office space in a couple of supertalls so that there aren't too many tall buildings "unsuitable" for the Wirral?

Supertalls = suitable for the surrounding area. Talls = unsuitable. Er... what?!

I'm increasingly inclined to think Peel blow a lot of hot air. They'll probably end up building the Trafford Centre Jnr in Bidston, a couple of office towers much, much smaller than 90 storeys and a load of low/medium-rise residential of Bellway homes quality.

[Roo]

Originally Posted by Chris B

Thanks for the update kat. Let's hope they come to pass. While I was watching the Tall ships today, I couldn't help but think it would be nice if the Wirral had a skyline. I'm afraid the tunnel ventilation shafts don't cut it for me.



Nail on head. I don't think it's that Liverpool has been against the Liverpool Waters scheme as such. It's just that the city has been rather indifferent, almost dis-interested. These schemes may feel like pie in the sky - and maybe that is all what they will ever turn out to be. However, if it's costing the city nothing, and given the financial clout of Peel, there exists a (open to opinion) realistic chance of it happening, why not encourage it?



I'm sure someone, somewhere would have said the same thing once when someone revealed plans for an 800ft skyscraper - the tallest in Europe no less - on the derelict wastes of the former London Docklands. Never say never.

Exactly Chris.

People... how to cities begin life? They have an origin, a core. New york dockland began as what? Development began... The Empire State Building springs up. The Chrysler building. Supertalls arent just there on the landscape to start with, it takes planning, and...

People who think big, can create something big.

Now ask yourself why should Birkenhead not develop into something similar?

It is the same situation, only a century later.

[kat2]

Right i will give some more clues but, i do hope you will all apriciate its not out yet! why it could work for wirral and what is different and finally who to look out for so you on skyscraper can peace movements together and know why the movements are being made.

why it could work for wirral? simple, no heritage on brown field site same as canary wharf and no real objection in perliminary stages.
The logic behind why two tall towers and not lots of smaller ones? unlike most of Liverpools proposals wirral does have a housing shortage space in the origional renders you saw lots of towers there now scrapped. A compromise was reached the council needed more housing (currently short of housing stock and no where to build it) peel own the land but the council needed more housing hence the recent announcement about food stores see the postings above. The two towers are office space the lower rise buildings will be housing and leisure plus the usual infa structure.
Who could possibly go in the towers? well Peel for a start and some of its off spring business's, if you look at peels website you will see they are involved in telecomms too! (w)! Peel will over look its own port!
movements being made, look at steve foulks press diary is all i can say, more so recently, you will notice his diary looks like that of what Liverpool councillors did last year with Peel.
plus points, no world heritage site, peel already own the land, it recently got growth point status and finally wirral council has a housing shortage and for the volume of housing needed doesnt have much space to buid on, where as peel does.
kat
just watch moves in the press and look for that councillors recent events in the press.

[Veinticinco]

Originally Posted by Chris B

I'm sure someone, somewhere would have said the same thing once when someone revealed plans for an 800ft skyscraper - the tallest in Europe no less - on the derelict wastes of the former London Docklands. Never say never.

Canary Wharf is the obvious comparison, an office skyscraper built to regenerate old docklands constructed during a global reccession. But this is Birkenhead, it's not on any international radar as far as business goes, London is one of the biggest and richest cities in the world and is the financial capital of the planet, there is a big difference. Because of this London has a constant demand for office and residential space. Canaray Wharf is now obviously a massive success but it took a long time to get there.

One Canada Square took 11 years to fill up 50 floors in the financial capital of the world after bankrupting the original developers and changing hands several times.

A tower in Birkenhead - with not even a 100th the demand of London - wouldn't fill 90 floors in 100 years and it would most probably bankrupt anybody who kept the pipedream alive.

[kat2]

twiz, i dont want to draw to much attention to this thread, whats happening over in Liverpool to do with the container port? have a look at what peel think of Manchesters congestion charging, also moving stock around by sea is becoming much more profitable than road and will keep congestion down on the roads, dont forget Liverpool and the river mersey should not be under estimated. This isnt going to happen over night, but i can say its been proposed peel are also talking to their overseas customers, the difference here is that Liverpool Port, a ship building yard, an oil refinary and means of moving things around via that port. More and More hauliers are going bust and the government is looking at ways of reducing carbon emissions, sea would seem to be one answer and peel have already announced their plans for Liverpool Port, so it makes sense to possibly re locaite its business to here. I think its good for both Liverpool and the Wirral Liverpool with its port Wirral witht he office space that will look out over that port.
anyway enough said, its not going to happen tommorrow,we will of course have to wait and see.
kat

[Evertonian]

I have long suggested that there is a much greater chance of Wirral Waters being passed and supported than Liverpool Waters. It looks like that is becoming reality.

It remains to be seen whether people on here, who are so suposedly big on the "city region" concept, will support the scheme or whether there will start to be "That should be built in the city centre!" sniping.

I suspect that there will be envy and dare I say it a little bit of anomosity if Peel concentrate more on the Wirral side than Liverpool.

Of course if you believe totally in a city region it shouldn't matter either way, but a while back when I suggested that one day Birkenhead could become a city in it's own right I was laughed down.

....but ask yourselves, given past history with liverpools planning dept and past failures with project afater project being abandoned why they WOULDN'T want to get cracking at Birkenhead?

[Toadboy]

India and china need big ports here to shift their stuff in. It makes sense.

Large scale development in L1 or CHWirral or whatever, all welcomed, if Peel press ahead with Birkenhead you can bet it'll be part of a wider city strategy to repropel Liverpool back on to the global stage, this is the strength of viewing the city as a whole rather than a fragmented bunch of parochial self serving toy town boroughs.

[Veinticinco]

So Peel will relocate to the twin towers from their enourmous office HQ currently in Manchester? How many people do they actually employ who work in an office?

[Roo]

Considering how many seperate divisions of the company there are, id say a fair few

[Gareth]

Originally Posted by Evertonian

I have long suggested that there is a much greater chance of Wirral Waters being passed and supported than Liverpool Waters. It looks like that is becoming reality.

It remains to be seen whether people on here, who are so suposedly big on the "city region" concept, will support the scheme or whether there will start to be "That should be built in the city centre!" sniping.

I suspect that there will be envy and dare I say it a little bit of anomosity if Peel concentrate more on the Wirral side than Liverpool.

Of course if you believe totally in a city region it shouldn't matter either way, but a while back when I suggested that one day Birkenhead could become a city in it's own right I was laughed down.

....but ask yourselves, given past history with liverpools planning dept and past failures with project afater project being abandoned why they WOULDN'T want to get cracking at Birkenhead?

It's all Scouseland, so I couldn't give a shit. That said, I'm not convinced, by along way, that we'll see this developement, at the scale it's proposed, in the near, or even medium, future. I pray to god that I'm wrong though.