daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Subways and Urban Transport

Subways and Urban Transport Metros, subways, light rail, trams, buses and other local transport systems



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old January 30th, 2007, 01:25 AM   #301
herenthere
I♥H.K.
 
herenthere's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NYC/紐約市/Nueva York
Posts: 427
Likes (Received): 70

NYC Subway Emergency Exits Abuse

The Metropolitan Transportation Agency of NYC installed emergency exits at every entrance/exit location, near the turnstiles, of every station. This was originally installed to allow for easy exit access in case of emergency. In the past, such gates called "service doors" could only be opened by a buzzer from the station agent in the kiosk. The MTA also shut down many booths in order to save money.

These new exits can now be operated from the inside by pushing the bar. However, this presents NEW problems:
1) Many people use it to exit during non-emergency, which triggers an annoying high-pitched alarm,
2) Frequent alarm will condition passengers to ignore the alarm during a REAL emergency, and
3) Many fare jumpers use it to enter when the door is open.

The MTA has reinstated many (6 stations for now) of its kiosks in order to deter such people. However, how does positioning an employee in a booth stop many from abusing the Emergency Exit ??

>>Should the MTA do more to prevent people from abusing the emergency exits? ie: Rule of conduct/By-Law; Exit operated by Agent during emergencies...

Post your opinion, suggestions, and pictures!
__________________
Proponent of Mass Transit, Livable Streets, and Progressive Politics

mrsmartman liked this post
herenthere no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old January 30th, 2007, 01:56 AM   #302
micro
Registered User
 
micro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Hamburg, .de Home: everywhere
Posts: 1,258
Likes (Received): 106

The problem with the "gate" fare checking systems is that the exits must always be watched.

The only exception are metro systems whose fare is the same for the entire system (like in small subway systems and in many Eastern European or Asian systems, e.g. Moscow, where you can ride as far as you want with one token). The exits need not be watched because no tickets need to be inserted.

They could install hires cameras in NYC that capture everyone who passes while the gate is opened in emergency mode, but who wants to find the fare cheaters from just their photos?

Maybe the only way to de-staff the stations and decrease the personnel expenses is to use the "trust" (or fear?) fare checking system which is found in many European cities. No gates at all, but undercover ticket checking agents and hefty fines.
__________________

metrobits.org
| Follow metrobits.org on Twitter

mrsmartman liked this post
micro no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old January 31st, 2007, 07:33 PM   #303
herenthere
I♥H.K.
 
herenthere's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NYC/紐約市/Nueva York
Posts: 427
Likes (Received): 70

Well, the fare is the same for the entire NYC metro system--US$2.00. When exiting, you don't need to insert fare ticket. And there is definitely not enough transit police in system.
__________________
Proponent of Mass Transit, Livable Streets, and Progressive Politics

mrsmartman liked this post
herenthere no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 3rd, 2007, 11:03 AM   #304
micro
Registered User
 
micro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Hamburg, .de Home: everywhere
Posts: 1,258
Likes (Received): 106

I was probably wrong with my assumption that no staff is needed when the fare is the same for the entire system. Even though the gates can be technically very simple one-way gates they must be capable of being unlocked in case of station evacuation.

The unlocking could be remote-controlled by a central control room but it is probably a safety requirement to have the emergency opening mechanism accessible locally at the gate itself. And if it is there it can always be abused by fare cheaters if there is no staff in the station.
__________________

metrobits.org
| Follow metrobits.org on Twitter

mrsmartman liked this post
micro no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 4th, 2007, 09:56 AM   #305
Don Omar
Bark twice if in Milwauke
 
Don Omar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Nueva York
Posts: 487
Likes (Received): 36

I had to laugh when I read this thread title because I see people do it all the time. It seems like every time I am at Penn Station they just leave the door own. I have only heard the noise a few time, but otherwise there just people rushing through. Also I believe individuals with disabilities can use the gate, if I am not mistaken. I will try a get of picture of people in the 'act'.
__________________
Brooklyn, Bronx, Queens and Staten
From the Battery to the top of Manhattan
Asian, Middle-Eastern and Latin
Black, White, New York you make it happen

- Beastie Boys

mrsmartman liked this post
Don Omar no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 4th, 2007, 10:19 AM   #306
hkmember
HKM-Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 63
Likes (Received): 2

they can just fix the problem by using a switch with a break-glass device instead of a panic bar
__________________

mrsmartman liked this post
hkmember no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 4th, 2007, 03:34 PM   #307
invincible
Lurker
 
invincible's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 3,804
Likes (Received): 523

Why don't they just replace the turnstiles with retractable gates that are used in the majority of systems worldwide? Then a staff member can push a button, or turn a key and all the gates open. They do it here quite often just to speed up the flow of passengers.
__________________

mrsmartman liked this post
invincible no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 4th, 2007, 04:18 PM   #308
micro
Registered User
 
micro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Hamburg, .de Home: everywhere
Posts: 1,258
Likes (Received): 106

Quote:
Originally Posted by hkmember View Post
they can just fix the problem by using a switch with a break-glass device instead of a panic bar
Wise idea!
__________________

metrobits.org
| Follow metrobits.org on Twitter

mrsmartman liked this post
micro no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 4th, 2007, 04:39 PM   #309
Rebasepoiss
Registered User
 
Rebasepoiss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Tallinn
Posts: 5,818
Likes (Received): 1819

Wise but not new:
__________________

mrsmartman liked this post
Rebasepoiss no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 4th, 2007, 11:14 PM   #310
herenthere
I♥H.K.
 
herenthere's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: NYC/紐約市/Nueva York
Posts: 427
Likes (Received): 70

Replacing all gates with the automated/electronic retractable gates would be too expensive for NYC. Just recently, the MTA said that they were US $1billion over budget. Maybe someone should start a thread "How much is your metro system in deficit?"
__________________
Proponent of Mass Transit, Livable Streets, and Progressive Politics

mrsmartman liked this post
herenthere no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 14th, 2007, 05:22 AM   #311
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,925
Likes (Received): 18186

MTA: 7 line extension on hold in NY due to possible cost overruns
By SAMANTHA GROSS
13 February 2007

NEW YORK (AP) - A major element in the mayor's plan to develop Manhattan's far west side was called into question Tuesday when transit officials said they would not immediately proceed with the extension of the 7 subway line.

Metropolitan Transportation Authority Executive Director Elliot Sander said that the agency, which runs the nation's largest mass transit system, did not plan to pay for any cost overruns on the planned project and that no construction contracts could be signed until it was clear how such costs would be covered.

The city agreed last year to pay up to $2.1 billion for the project, which would extend the Manhattan-Queens subway line west from Times Square along 42nd Street then south on 11th Avenue to 34th Street. But the rising cost of construction and other miscalculations could increase the cost by up to $1 billion, according to Assemblyman Richard Brodsky, chairman of the committee that oversees the MTA.

Sander said the MTA's problem was that "we are in a financially constrained position." He added that he expects to meet soon with city officials about the issue and is "optimistic" the project will continue.

John Gallagher, a spokesman for the mayor's office, said the city had no plans to contribute additional money to the project.

"A deal is a deal, especially since the extension of the (No. 7) line will contribute billions of dollars to the MTA through the development of the rail yards and dedicated tax revenues," he said in an e-mail.

The extension was expected to create "hundreds of thousands of jobs and billions of dollars in tax revenues," he said.

Sander said it was too early for the MTA to estimate the cost of any possible overruns.

The first contracts for the project had been expected by the end of 2006, according to the MTA's own schedule. It was unclear how any further delay would affect plans to redevelop the area, where the Jacob K. Javits Convention Center is located.

The administration of Mayor Michael Bloomberg has been pushing since 2003 to redevelop the area with high-rise office towers, calling the plan vital to the city's economic well-being. A connected proposal to put a new football stadium in the area was blocked by a state board in 2005.

The city's current plans for the area would add 24 million square feet of office space, 13,600 new units of housing, nearly 1 million square feet of retail space and 20 acres of parks.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!

mrsmartman liked this post
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 14th, 2007, 09:42 AM   #312
Jean Luc
BANNED
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Sydney
Posts: 460
Likes (Received): 15

???

Quote:
Originally Posted by hkskyline View Post
NYC can't build subway link unless it gets land

NEW YORK, Sept 7 (Reuters) - New York City cannot extend Manhattan's No. 7 subway to west Midtown unless a state authority sells it half of the land and certain development rights, a source familiar with the issues said on Thursday.

The No. 7 subway now stops at Times Square. Real estate experts say developers will not build in west Midtown without the new mass transit link.

Mayor Michael Bloomberg wanted to use a new financing arm to sell as much as $3 billion of bonds to pay for the subway extension, which would be the first in decades.

Though the city tried to strengthen the backing for the debt, most recently by pledging $1 billion of city funds over 10 years, financial experts say bondholders still want more assurances that there will be enough revenue to repay them.

The Republican mayor had hoped to entice developers to the desolate west Midtown area by offering reduced taxes. The tax revenue would then be used to help repay the new Hudson Yards bonds.

But the city cannot guarantee it can raise that money unless it controls development at the site, which runs from 30th Street to 33rd Street.

Otherwise, there is a risk that competing developers will build projects whose taxes cannot be used to repay the new bonds, said the source, who declined to be named.

"If (the city) doesn't give the bond market comfort that there will be no competition for the Hudson Rail Yards, it won't go ahead with the No. 7 line," he said.

The Metropolitan Transportation Authority, which runs New York City's bus, subway and commuter train lines, owns the 26-acre site.

A spokesman for the agency, which got Bloomberg's proposal for the land deal in July, said there was no new information. A mayoral spokeswoman had no immediate comment.

Last week, the MTA got a new appraisal valuing the eastern half of the site at nearly $1 billion more than the mayor offered to pay for it.

New York City's $300 million bid does not include a new $400 million platform that would have to be built over the rail yards. The mayor also envisions a less dense development with affordable housing -- two profit-cutting factors the appraisal does not reflect.

The city also offered the MTA $200 million for development rights for the western half of the site. This would enable the city to back its new bonds by selling developers the rights to build taller buildings and transferring air rights.
I don't get it. The MTA, which operates the New York subway, already owns the land, so why does the city have to purchase it before the line can be extended? Why can't the MTA build it and then sell off or lease the property for redevelopment, which will no doubt go up in value if it's built?
__________________

mrsmartman liked this post
Jean Luc no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 14th, 2007, 10:20 AM   #313
superchan7
EOS 40D
 
superchan7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: San Jose, CA, USA / Hong Kong, China
Posts: 2,098
Likes (Received): 23

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jean Luc View Post
I don't get it. The MTA, which operates the New York subway, already owns the land, so why does the city have to purchase it before the line can be extended? Why can't the MTA build it and then sell off or lease the property for redevelopment, which will no doubt go up in value if it's built?
This isn't Hong Kong
__________________
I speak English / 我講中文 / Ich spreche deutsch / 3y3 5p34k L337

mrsmartman liked this post
superchan7 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 15th, 2007, 09:23 AM   #314
Jean Luc
BANNED
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Sydney
Posts: 460
Likes (Received): 15

Please explain!!!
Jean Luc no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 15th, 2007, 12:25 PM   #315
gladisimo
If I could be anyone...
 
gladisimo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: SF, FC, HK
Posts: 2,525
Likes (Received): 39

Do you have pictures of trains?
__________________
I left my <3 in HK

RIP Dopey - 9/2005 - 20/2/2008

mrsmartman liked this post
gladisimo no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 15th, 2007, 03:38 PM   #316
thatchio
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 39
Likes (Received): 1

Quote:
I don't get it. The MTA, which operates the New York subway, already owns the land, so why does the city have to purchase it before the line can be extended? Why can't the MTA build it and then sell off or lease the property for redevelopment, which will no doubt go up in value if it's built?
In the US, property owners have rights to the land, air, and ground underneath. So if any of the route requires going under another person's property (ie. not the street) then you have to buy or take those rights. That makes it very expensive. Plus, most governments don't get into the habit of buying the actual property...rather they buy certain rights to the land...meaning they wouldn't buy the whole site and redevelop it.

Transit in US cities was started by private companies. Many of them would buy land outside of the core and extend their transit lines to them, increasing the value of their land. In Minneapolis this was the case. So when the government took over transit, they received a lot of lines that today would not have been feasible to build. And back when these lines were built, being near transit almost always meant having a higher property value...as that was one of the most primary ways to travel. Now in NYC, transit still plays a major role...but property is very expensive, huge corporations own some of the land (meaning it can be hard to negotiate with them), etc.
__________________

mrsmartman liked this post
thatchio no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old March 24th, 2007, 10:58 PM   #317
Don Omar
Bark twice if in Milwauke
 
Don Omar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Nueva York
Posts: 487
Likes (Received): 36

A Museum-Quality Car for a Subway Yet Unbuilt


The last of 10 prototype cars from 1949 for the Second Avenue subway. It was clad in stainless steel, had porthole windows, and cost $100,000.

By WILLIAM NEUMAN
Published: March 24, 2007
nytimes.com

Expectations are high for construction of the Second Avenue subway, and the futuristic new subway cars that will run on it. Made from gleaming stainless steel, the cars have a range of modern innovations: round porthole windows that would look at home on a rocket ship; high-tech air purification systems that use ultraviolet lamps to kill germs; illuminated route maps on the wall; and — incredible as it seems — public address systems that make clear, intelligible announcements.

Sound pretty good?

It did in 1949, too, when 10 prototype cars were delivered to the New York Board of Transportation. The board planned to run the cars on a new subway line it was just then preparing to build under Second Avenue.

Of course, the Second Avenue subway was never built, and no additional cars of the same futuristic design, known as the R11, were ever ordered.

The cars cost about $100,000 each, and together the 10 prototypes became known as the “million dollar train.” They were not built to be compatible with other cars, though, so they could not be added to most other trains. Without a line to belong to, they remained an oddity. Orphans, they kicked around the subway system, running on a few scattered lines (the Canarsie line, the Franklin Avenue shuttle) until they were retired in 1976.

Nine of the cars were scrapped.

But one of them, Car 8013, sits on display in the New York Transit Museum today in Downtown Brooklyn, an artifact of a future that never arrived.

Until now. Maybe.

This week, the Metropolitan Transportation Authority, the eventual successor of the transportation board, signed a $337 million contract with a company that will, if expectations become reality, dig the tunnels from 96th Street to 63rd Street for the first leg of the long-awaited Second Avenue line.

“It’s a longstanding municipal dream,” said Charles Sachs, the senior curator of the Transit Museum. “It’s been planned for at least 75 years. It’s always been a heady idea for enhancing the public transportation network in Manhattan.”

Heady but unlucky.

Plans for the Second Avenue line, first prepared in the 1920s, were revived in the 1940s, when the R11 cars were built. In 1951, voters approved a measure allowing the city to borrow $500 million for rapid transit projects, which was primarily intended for construction of the new line.

Years of fiscal difficulties and political wrangling followed, but no tunnels were ever dug. “They had very high hopes,” Mr. Sachs said of the planners who ordered the R11 cars in the expectation that they would have a line to run on. The cars themselves seem to have reflected that same optimism.

“It was a radically new design for subway cars,” Mr. Sachs said.

When a scale model of the R11 was exhibited, an August 1948 article in The New York Times called it “New York’s subway car of tomorrow.”

With its sleek stainless steel shell, the R11 car was a stark departure from the painted and riveted steel cars that preceded it. It was not until some 15 years later, in the mid-1960s, that a full line of stainless steel cars came into use, Mr. Sachs said.

A description posted at the museum says that because polio was a concern in the 1940s, officials were looking for a way to curb the spread of germs in the subway. Earlier subway cars had conventional fans mounted on the ceiling. The designers of the R11 developed a forced air system that brought in air from the outside, ran it through “electrostatic dust filters” and under ultraviolet lamps intended to kill germs, before blowing it through ceiling vents into the cars.

Another newfangled feature: fluorescent lights. The description accompanying the car said, however, that the lights were considered less than reliable and were hard to replace when they burned out.

Today only the exterior of the car looks as it did when it was new. To make maintenance easier, the cars were gutted in 1964 and renovated and rebuilt inside, with parts that were standard to other cars.

A black and white photograph that Mr. Sachs retrieved from the museum archives shows one of the cars in the days before it was gutted. The advertisements along the top of the car are for Schlitz beer, Life cigarettes, and a 1949 movie starring Loretta Young called “Come to the Stable.” A poster invites riders to “meet Miss Subways, Elaine Levine.”

Signs in the car indicate it was running from Brighton Beach in Brooklyn to Times Square. The rectangular windows on the sides of the car open with a crank. On the doors, above the porthole windows, is the admonition: “Please Keep Hands Off the Doors.” The seats are striped and upholstered in a faux wicker plastic.

On the outside, Car 8013 is almost as shiny as the day it arrived, a metallic symbol of its own bright promise.

But on the inside, the car conveys something more like dreary disappointment. The walls are two shades of a grayish, greenish blue. The fiberglass seats are hard and gray. The only sound is the buzz of the fluorescent tubes.


The exterior of Car 8013 remains as gleaming and futuristic as ever, sitting in the New York Transit Museum in Brooklyn.


A photograph of the R11 car before renovation, with faux wicker upholstery and ads for Life cigarettes and a Loretta Young movie.
__________________
Brooklyn, Bronx, Queens and Staten
From the Battery to the top of Manhattan
Asian, Middle-Eastern and Latin
Black, White, New York you make it happen

- Beastie Boys

Shrimpo7, austrian, bd popeye, mrsmartman liked this post
Don Omar no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 4th, 2007, 04:40 PM   #318
Songoten2554
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Miami Florida
Posts: 1,063
Likes (Received): 87

NYC Second Avenue Subway will finally begin Construction on April 12 2007

finally its here and its ready to be built along with the other projects that NYC and NJ is doing as well as the PATH Expansions as well

the Second Avenue Subway will begin construction on April 12 and all the new stations will have Air Conditioning to cool off the platforms cool and once it is completed it will be run by a new train route the T

but for right now it will be an extension of the Q line from its current terminus to where phase 1 will finish until phase two will start

i know this has been promised for years but i think this is promising and will start a whole new revolution for the city and its whole mess of construction projects inculding the 7 line extension to chelsea peirs sporting complex

what do all of you think?? postive or negative thoughts?? i got this from another thread so i brought it here
__________________

mrsmartman liked this post
Songoten2554 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 4th, 2007, 04:41 PM   #319
Songoten2554
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Miami Florida
Posts: 1,063
Likes (Received): 87

i heard it in the news about this on the NY1 website that it will begin on that date does any of you know what the NYC Second Avenue Subway is???
__________________

mrsmartman liked this post
Songoten2554 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 4th, 2007, 04:46 PM   #320
Alargule
Res Uder et Siger
 
Alargule's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 8,208
Likes (Received): 2090

All relevant info can be found here.

The SAS is probably the longest delayed and most expected subway line in NYC history. The first proposal for such a line dates back to 1929. In the 1970's, some construction work has even been done north of 96th St: over a length of almost twenty blocks, a two-track tunnels was built. It's still there and in 'pristine' condition, as the MTA would have it. It will be incorporated in the present design.
__________________
Nu op Wordpress: Rails in Amsterdam
Alargule no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
метро, metro, new york city, subway

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 06:04 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium