NZ | Energy Projects

[Kane007]

decapitation That would be 1 tall dude.

[jarbury]

Originally Posted by Classic Man

Windfarms are just lunacy. Think of the noise pollution, andwhat if someone is decpiated by the turbines? I just can't abide that idea.

What do you suggest then? Dirty coal?

[Kane007]

Hmmmm COAL .... the new 4 letter word?


I can just see people swearing and calling someone a mother COALer! Me I prefer to be swinging from a star... I mean blade.

But, now serious, there still remains a need for peak load supply and other backups in case the wind stops blowing from the SSC!

[jarbury]

Geothermal is a great baseload power generator.

[Kane007]

Yeh but, how many resource consents are in the works for increased geothermal capacity??? And why not?

[Kane007]

Okay I can answer some of this myself...

Contact’s steam winning at Ohaaki has resulted in generation picking up from 25MW in September to around 50MW currently, with more generation to come.

Poihipi (which now has consents allowing full output) should have additional separator capacity in place next year, allowing that station to generate consistently at full load for the first time, effectively doubling its capacity (say another 20-25MW).

Contact Energy has recently started formal consultation on the Te Mihi power station. This will eventually largely replace the old Wairakei station (and exceed its capacity due to higher efficiency).

The Te Mihi consultation announcement also included the floating of a Tauhara station concept, potentially up to 200MW.

Separately on Contact’s website, they also identify their part-interest in the Mokai field for which they have a role on the steamfield management committee, and may eventually look at a further 40MW.

Mighty River Power continues with the construction of the 90MW Kawerau station, which should be fully on stream by the end of next year. MRP has lodged a consent application with Environment Waikato for the next 100MW stage for the Rotokawa development. It is worth pointing out that their interim report for December 2006 published earlier this year spoke of a 400MW geothermal programme over a 10 year period, clearly including Kawerau, Rotokawa and Ngatamariki.

Top Energy has started drilling for the Ngawha extension, civil works are about to start and all of the Ormat equipment will be on site by the end of January 2008.

[Kane007]

Just out of interest I did a little research into how many homes 1 MW of energy would supply. General (and out of date) rule of thumb 1MW = 1,000 homes, but in reality certain factors come into play to drastically curtail these figures.

Wind farms putting out 100MW - this is actually its max potential capacity - however in reality wind strength would average closer to 30% in most areas so that 100MW actually will provide 30MW.

A Coal burner @ 100MW isn't affected by the moods of the wind but does experience more down town for servicing etc so I'm picking 75% of max potential so that will provide 75MW.

The other big factors are what environmental/economic factors affect individual homes. Do homes in colder locals require more electricity than milder climes, or how may of these use alternatives to electrical heating. The same is true in hot climes especially those with air conditioning. Wealthier homes may be better insulated but also have bigger and hungrier appliances. Poorer homes may use a lot of electrical heating. These factors can increase or decrease peak demand.

So a high use home may consume 1,193 kWh while a lower use home consumes 618 kWh. This will increase or decrease the estimate 1MW = ?? homes.

So I'm going to put my neck out and say/advise 1MW = 500 homes for non renewable/hydro/geothermal power stations vs 1MW = 200 homes for renewable's - solar/wind/tidal/wave .

SOURCE

[jarbury]

Sounds about right Kane. One must also remember that an awful lot of power gets eaten up by commercial customers, so just because a power station could supply enough for all the homes in Christchurch, for example, that's still a long way off supplying all of Christchurch's power. Heck, the aluminium smelter eats what - 20% of NZ's power?

[Kane007]

Also, we must factor in the amount of power that is LEAKED from the inefficient transmission methods.

[Classic Man]

Originally Posted by Kane007

decapitation That would be 1 tall dude.

No, I mean there is a chance of the turbines detaching and killing innocent people. What happens if school girls go on a trip to a windfarm and a turbine detaches?

Well then what would you suggest?

Nuclear my friend. Nuclear.

[Kane007]

the likelihood of the blade flying off and injury someone is less likely than the engine in a late model car detaching and falling out onto the road.

Malfunctions tend to be electrical such as short circuits. Googled it and only came up with this news item.

Nuclear has a more jaded past. Though I for one am interested in the possibility of several 500 MW near Auckland for local supply.

[Paulsy]

Originally Posted by Kane007

Just out of interest I did a little research into how many homes 1 MW of energy would supply. General (and out of date) rule of thumb 1MW = 1,000 homes, but in reality certain factors come into play to drastically curtail these figures.

Wind farms putting out 100MW - this is actually its max potential capacity - however in reality wind strength would average closer to 30% in most areas so that 100MW actually will provide 30MW.

A Coal burner @ 100MW isn't affected by the moods of the wind but does experience more down town for servicing etc so I'm picking 75% of max potential so that will provide 75MW.

The other big factors are what environmental/economic factors affect individual homes. Do homes in colder locals require more electricity than milder climes, or how may of these use alternatives to electrical heating. The same is true in hot climes especially those with air conditioning. Wealthier homes may be better insulated but also have bigger and hungrier appliances. Poorer homes may use a lot of electrical heating. These factors can increase or decrease peak demand.

So a high use home may consume 1,193 kWh while a lower use home consumes 618 kWh. This will increase or decrease the estimate 1MW = ?? homes.

So I'm going to put my neck out and say/advise 1MW = 500 homes for non renewable/hydro/geothermal power stations vs 1MW = 200 homes for renewable's - solar/wind/tidal/wave .

SOURCE

1kW demand per home averaged out over the year may be about right (I think we used to use 2kW) but that isn't how the power is used. The system must be able to supply the peaks (or shed load) or it will collapse. These peak loads could well be close to 10kW per house (certainly would be at my place on a cold winter night). Also these days the system is having to provide power with a poor power factor due to the nature of the loads (all the switch mode power supplies and motor driven heat pumps) meaning that a lot more apparent power (VA) must be supplied. We will still need some standby coal stations or some pumped water storage facilites (pump the water up hill to a reservoir during low demand and run it down through your alternators at peak load times).

[Paulsy]

Originally Posted by Kane007

the likelihood of the blade flying off and injury someone is less likely than the engine in a late model car detaching and falling out onto the road.

Malfunctions tend to be electrical such as short circuits. Googled it and only came up with this news item.

Nuclear has a more jaded past. Though I for one am interested in the possibility of several 500 MW near Auckland for local supply.

I've seen two total failures of wind turbines over the last 20 or so years and both were mechanical - they both collapsed.

[Classic Man]

Originally Posted by Paulsy

I've seen two total failures of wind turbines over the last 20 or so years and both were mechanical - they both collapsed.

See? THIS IS WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE! Those wind turbines could have easily collapsed on a school, an orphange, or heaven forbid - a chuch. This is why wind power is too dangerous! I'd rather go hunting with Dick Cheney that go within 10 miles of a wind turbine!

[Paulsy]

Originally Posted by Classic Man

See? THIS IS WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE! Those wind turbines could have easily collapsed on a school, an orphange, or heaven forbid - a chuch. This is why wind power is too dangerous! I'd rather go hunting with Dick Cheney that go within 10 miles of a wind turbine!

They were both development ones and were experiencing some teething problems in NZs windy conditions. Nothing like telling only part of the story to spice things up a bit though.

[KIWIKAAS]

Originally Posted by Classic Man

See? THIS IS WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE! Those wind turbines could have easily collapsed on a school, an orphange, or heaven forbid - a chuch. This is why wind power is too dangerous! I'd rather go hunting with Dick Cheney that go within 10 miles of a wind turbine!

[jarbury]

Originally Posted by Classic Man

Nuclear my friend. Nuclear.

You're worried about the safety of wind turbines and you suggest nuclear.

Hilarious....

Hmmmm... troll me thinks.

[Kane007]

$600m power lines upgrade planned

NZ Herald
2007/11/09

State-owned enterprise Transpower is set to release plans for a $600 million line upgrade.

The upgrade is designed to bolster the main transmission line between Benmore and Wellington and meet demands created by new electricity generation in the South Island.

Details of the plan will be released at the end of the month.

At the same time, Transpower is keeping a close watch on the demands, and possible constraints, on local transmission lines within Otago and Southland if the Project Hayes and Mahinerangi wind farms are built.

Transpower's general manager of grid investment Tim George yesterday outlined how it planned to cope with Project Hayes, Mahinerangi and other renewable electricity generation projects being planned in the South Island.

This follows arguments between South Island generators over Transpower's ability to transmit the extra electricity.

There are two issues - Transpower's "local transmission" within Otago and Southland, and the high voltage direct current (HVDC) link which delivers electricity from Benmore to Wellington through the Cook Strait cable.

Mr George said once a decision was made to upgrade the link, there would be more certainty for South Island generation companies and they were "more likely" to invest in new generation. At the end of the month, the options for upgrading the link and a preferred choice would be released for public comment by February 1.

Those options ranged from leaving the HVDC link as it was through to upgrading it to 1700MW.

At this stage, the preferred option - costing between $500 million and $600 million - is upgrading the lines' capacity to 1400MW. Only 1200MW would be delivered to Wellington without a new Cook Strait cable.

Mr George said there were options to obtain "a bit more capacity" on local transmission lines.

Those options were "not on the books at the moment" but, when Project Hayes and the Mahinerangi projects became firmer, Transpower would look seriously at upgrading those lines.

Transpower recovered costs of such upgrades through the Transmission Pricing Methodology, set by the Electricity Commission.

Mr George said the costs associated with the HVDC link were recovered from designated South Island generators who used it. He accepted that cost was eventually passed on to consumers through what they paid for their electricity.

The costs associated with local transmission lines were recovered from the distribution lines companies which passed them on to consumers through lines charges.

Minister of Energy David Parker would not comment on the issues involved which, he said, were up to the industry to resolve.

Appeals to the Environment Court on the Central Otago District Council's granting of resource consent to Meridian's Project Hayes wind farm close with the court on November 20. As of yesterday, no appeals had been received.

[Kane007]

Just heard on the news this morning that the Discoverer 2, a 2000-tonne 37 crewed seismic vessel survey vessel, commissioned by the OMV consortium, has departed Southport on it's survey mission to begin mapping the Great Southern Basins Oil deposits

[Kane007]

Contact to build new geothermal plant

Contact Energy has confirmed its plans to develop a 20MW geothermal generation in Taupo.

Chief executive David Baldwin said the $75m "binary" plant was already covered by resource consents held by Contact, and would hopefully be operational in 2009.

"This project will take geothermal steam from the Tauhara steamfield and produce enough renewable electricity to power nearly 20,000 homes," Mr Baldwin said.

It was the first stage of Contact's proposed development of the Tauhara geothermal system, which would include a new power station of up to 225MW by 2012. Resource consents would be applied for next year.

Mr Baldwin added that Contact had filed resource consent applications for its proposed 220MW Te Mihi geothermal power station at the end of July.

He told a geothermal workshop today that geothermal electricity was critical to meeting the Government's goal of 90 per cent of electricity coming from renewable sources by 2025, so the speed at which consents were processed was critical.