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Old January 19th, 2011, 02:00 PM   #4981
Surel
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If I so far noticed something that I could hold against the Dutch road signage it is:

Not consistent and completaly clear signage about the priority on the crossings.

The really dumb, according to me, habbit of signing directions on the roundabout in such a way that when entering roundabout it is impossible to read the signs because they are parallel with the road. Thus many times when you want to know where does given road direct to you have to wait till you are on the roundabout and then look to the left from behind the wheel. In Italy was this almost on every crossing, not only roudnabouts, if I am not mistaken. I dont remember seeing it somewhere else yet.

I am talking about this:
image hosted on flickr


I would preffer something like this :




On the other side. The signage is everywhere and leads to the right destination. That is not something given by default in many countries, including the one where is the second picture from .

Last edited by Surel; January 19th, 2011 at 02:07 PM.
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Old January 19th, 2011, 02:46 PM   #4982
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I agree with that. I usually end up doing 2 rounds on the roundabout. First round to check all the signs, second round to make my decision where I should go

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Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
This section was planned over 50 years ago. Space has been kept available for such an extension, but it would require two bridges or a long tunnel across/under the Oude Maas and Spui Rivers. The A15 needs to be widened no matter what, as a 2020 55.000 truck volume is projected (currently 35.000 trucks per day). Rotterdam will remain Europe's largest port by far. It currently is larger than the next 3 largest European ports combined and a major expansion is under way in the North Sea with a huge container terminal. Rotterdam is currently the leading port for containers with almost 11 million TEU in 2008, while the new container port will be 2 or 3 times larger than the existing one. You can imagine the amount of additional traffic this will create.

However, the A4-south option is still considered, especially after the A4 missing links south of Delft and around Steenbergen will be finished in 2015, leaving this one as the last gap.

A4-south has high potential to relieve the Heinenoord Tunnel (A29) that currently carries around 100.000 vehicles per day. They do not expect an extensive shift of traffic from A16 to A4.
Was a Southern extension of the A4 to meet the A20 near Maasdijk ever considered? Since there's such a huge fuss about the Midden Delftland 'nature reserve'?
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Old January 19th, 2011, 02:56 PM   #4983
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I agree on the roundabout signage. I've read a blog about a well-known signage font specialist (forgot his name) who also mentioned Dutch roundabout signage is hard to read, especially in urban areas where by far not all roundabouts are preceded by guiding signage. The horrible ANWB Uu font is hard to read from a distance, but the signs are placed so high you need to read them from a distance. I don't understand why this problem isn't addressed in over-regulated Netherlands.

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Was a Southern extension of the A4 to meet the A20 near Maasdijk ever considered? Since there's such a huge fuss about the Midden Delftland 'nature reserve'?
That would be A54. This is a possible option with the Oranje Tunnel link between A20 and A15. The so-called "Westland" area has 100.000 inhabitants and one of the largest and most productive greenhouse districts in the world. The amount of truck traffic to and from these greenhouses is incredible.
You can also see this in the traffic volumes. The A20 starts with a high count of 47.000 vehicles per day in Westerlee. This is incredibly high for a motorway that starts off several two-lane non-high standard roads. Another example is A4, where volumes boom from 32.000 to 71.000 vehicles per day just after one interchange to the Wateringen/Westland area.

This is the Westland area. This image is approximately 15 kilometers across. The Hague (Den Haag) is to the north, A4 to the east and A20 to the south. The area itself is served by several provincial highways, non of which are built to any improved standards. They are two-lane and roundabout-ridden.
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Old January 19th, 2011, 02:59 PM   #4984
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Surel View Post
I am talking about this:

I would preffer something like this :
Most roundabouts do have guidesignage when approaching, apart from the signage in the middle-circle.
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Old January 22nd, 2011, 06:13 PM   #4985
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The first elevated motorway of the Netherlands is coming along quite nicely. A5 in western Amsterdam. Opening in 2012.

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Old January 24th, 2011, 05:30 PM   #4986
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Indeed I have never seen an elevated motorway in NL. How come with that so far? In NL there no spare land for investment even... But, congratulation
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Old January 25th, 2011, 11:45 AM   #4987
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Lane extravaganza in Eindhoven.


source: https://beeldbank.rws.nl, Rijkswaterstaat / Joop van Houdt.
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Old January 25th, 2011, 12:14 PM   #4988
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I am driving here everyday Most of the time is not so empty as on picture :P
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Been in: A, B, BIH, BR, C, CH, CZ, D, DK, E, F, FL, GB, GE, GBR, H, HR, I, L, LT, MC, MEX, MNE, N, NL, P, PL, RO, RD, RSM, S, SK, SLO, SRB, TR, UA, USA, V
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Old January 25th, 2011, 12:53 PM   #4989
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mappero View Post
Most of the time is not so empty as on picture :P
It never is, anywhere, for anyone
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Old January 25th, 2011, 02:15 PM   #4990
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Quote:
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I am driving here everyday Most of the time is not so empty as on picture :P
Pretty big design flaw in my opinion is the 2x2 transit setup west of Eindhoven which is still congested on a daily basis, this should have been 2x3.
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Old January 26th, 2011, 12:09 AM   #4991
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Holy crap they really got carried away with the new signage in Rotterdam...
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Old January 26th, 2011, 12:54 AM   #4992
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What does those green borders around Erasmus MC and Museumpark mean?
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Old January 26th, 2011, 11:32 AM   #4993
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OMG! To much information on sign for first time, especially if you drive to hospital in case of accident.. Should we stop, park and then read this sign?
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Been in: A, B, BIH, BR, C, CH, CZ, D, DK, E, F, FL, GB, GE, GBR, H, HR, I, L, LT, MC, MEX, MNE, N, NL, P, PL, RO, RD, RSM, S, SK, SLO, SRB, TR, UA, USA, V
Driven in: A, B, BIH, BR, CH, CZ, D, DK, E, F, FL, GB, GBR, H, HR, I, L, MC, MNE, N, NL, P, PL, RO, S, SLO, SK, SRB, TR, USA
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Old January 26th, 2011, 11:46 AM   #4994
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And more, why is MC Erasmus repeated three times in the same sign? Is it that important?
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Old January 26th, 2011, 12:30 PM   #4995
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Quote:
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What does those green borders around Erasmus MC and Museumpark mean?
Named parking garages

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And more, why is MC Erasmus repeated three times in the same sign? Is it that important?
To indicate the hospital itself, than the designated-named parking garage (sometimes parking garages have names different than those of the buildings they are built under)
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Old January 27th, 2011, 08:19 PM   #4996
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Holy crap they really got carried away with the new signage in Rotterdam...
Godverdomme! And how many foreigners understand "volg"?

That said, it raises something I was wondering about: whether cities other than Amsterdam have S-routes. I see Rotterdam does; do other cities?

And is there a reason S100 is on its little marker but S114 isn't?
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Old January 27th, 2011, 08:32 PM   #4997
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Godverdomme! And how many foreigners understand "volg"?
Only Germans probably (folge)

Quote:
That said, it raises something I was wondering about: whether cities other than Amsterdam have S-routes. I see Rotterdam does; do other cities?
Nowadays, Amsterdam, Almere, Rotterdam and Den Haag (The Hague) have S-routes. The concept is newest in Rotterdam and Den Haag.

Quote:
And is there a reason S100 is on its little marker but S114 isn't?
Yes, road shields are the actual road numbers you're driving on, plain text are numbers this road will lead to. Previously brackets were used a lot, but they seem to be moving away from this fortunately.
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Old January 27th, 2011, 10:40 PM   #4998
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Godverdomme! And how many foreigners understand "volg"?
Dunno. It seems not too far-fetched that "volg" must be of the same linguistic origin as the English "follow". (I myself remember some Dutch VMS's displaying something like "A12, volg F") However, I admit that probably just a small part of foreign motorists are going to have the same thought.

It's difficult to turn that concept into a pictogram. I very vaguely remember that in one European country (Sweden???), something like a cartoon text bubble is used to signify "This destination also contains, or refers to:". That's the closest solution I've seen.
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Old January 28th, 2011, 12:16 AM   #4999
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Quote:
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It's difficult to turn that concept into a pictogram. I very vaguely remember that in one European country (Sweden???), something like a cartoon text bubble is used to signify "This destination also contains, or refers to:". That's the closest solution I've seen.
Yep, it's Sweden...



...and it's very nice solution, clear and clean. I like the whole "for X follow Y" concept, although the Dutch way is confusing for foreigners (I didn't have problem with it personally though).
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Old January 28th, 2011, 01:46 AM   #5000
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Godverdomme! And how many foreigners understand "volg"?
I checked in translator and am pretty certain that most of visitors from Germanic countries would get it.

Danish - følge
Norwegian - følg
German - folge
Swedish - följa
Icelandic - fylgja
and English, which in my opinion does not differ from the rest too much - follow

I used google translator which sometimes does its job in, let's say, interesting way:

Serbian - Фоллов.

Just could not believe since discovered this.
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