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Old September 12th, 2012, 02:47 AM   #8101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keokiracer View Post

Still no link? Can't find it anymore?
It was on CapNTransit... but he removed several posts about other countries (other than his native New York City, USA) and published this

EDIT: I actually looked in the "bio" of that blogger with more details. He started the blog when he witnessed a traffic accident in NEw York and vowed never to drive again and campaign for abolition of almost all urban car usage (it's on his own blog I linked).
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Old September 12th, 2012, 07:15 AM   #8102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist

They should have demolished those buildings near the canal and built higher modern towers (more or less like they did in Eindhoven in a smaller scale or in Rotterdam in a much larger and awesome scale).
You have just mentioned the two ugliest cities in the Netherlands. But you can't argue with taste I guess. Just want to remind you that we are in Europe, and not in the United States. Have you considered relocating?
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Old September 12th, 2012, 09:11 AM   #8103
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Ugliness aside (can't argue with taste), I struggle to see why Utrecht needs the edge-of-citycentre freeway. You cannot say that Central Utrecht is driver's paradise, but the city centre's access is reasonable, much better than many other Dutch towns. So why the push to start a demolishing process and build a freeway. That's something you'd only advocate for the sake of freeways, if you don't care about anything other than the freeway.

By the way, Rotterdam and Eindhoven are not good examples. Eindhoven is largely a 20th century town as the town grew rather late. Rotterdam could make a new start after the Germans bombed town in 1940. And still I am not too impressed with the roads in that "new" area.
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Old September 12th, 2012, 09:18 AM   #8104
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I think the old cities in NL should be surrounded by urban expressways with partial grade-separation. They can even build lots of parking lots in this fringe to reduce traffic within the old area.

For instance, the avenue along the Slinge in Amsterdam should be converted into a depressed 2x2 expressway without grade crossings for through traffic (underpasses).
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Old September 12th, 2012, 09:18 AM   #8105
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I believe these two cities represents everything that is wrong with Dutch post-war architecture. City centre in Eindhoven is nicer then Rotterdam though.
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Old September 12th, 2012, 09:24 AM   #8106
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Rotterdam is just bigger:

- longer bridges over the rivers
- wider avenues with 2x2 lanes + wide sidewalks and bike paths
- a big river instead of a canal

It would be quite easy for Rotterdam to speed up urban traffic along 3 ridiculously 50km/h limited boulevards (increasing to 70 and building underpasses (= no visual intrusion at street level) to speed up access from A15 (south), A20 and A16

Some sectors that go through industrial areas could well do with elevated expressways.

But the Dutch city that lacks fast urban arteries most and a ring road is Apeldoorn. Groningen is not bad but they should carve more car lanes on its inner ring road and do like Maastricht (big underground garage in the central square).
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Old September 12th, 2012, 09:39 AM   #8107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist
I think the old cities in NL should be surrounded by urban expressways with partial grade-separation. They can even build lots of parking lots in this fringe to reduce traffic within the old area.

For instance, the avenue along the Slinge in Amsterdam should be converted into a depressed 2x2 expressway without grade crossings for through traffic (underpasses).
Credit to you that you are not suggesting that city and town centres should be demolished. Suburban Holland is a ugly as hell, but at least keep the pretty side of Dutch architecture in tact...

There are if course exceptions. Almere has some nice architecture, but there is also a new housing estate in Hoofddorp I like. But these are exceptions. Nothing else.
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Old September 12th, 2012, 11:28 AM   #8108
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A12 Ede - Grijsoord

The Council of State has rejected the appeals against the record of decision to widen A12 between Ede and Grijsoord motorway interchange to 2x3 lanes. This mean there are no more obstacles to commence construction on this highly saturated motorway.

This section of A12 opened in 1956 and carries 88.000 vehicles per day on 2x2 lanes. The road widening will commence later this year or early 2013 and will be completed in late 2014 or 2015.

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Old September 12th, 2012, 12:08 PM   #8109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
They should have demolished those buildings near the canal and built higher modern towers (more or less like they did in Eindhoven in a smaller scale or in Rotterdam in a much larger and awesome scale).
You mean the old ones? Are you mad?
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Old September 12th, 2012, 12:13 PM   #8110
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Quote:
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You mean the old ones? Are you mad?
They are not old.

The Utrecht Tower is old, for instance. Or the central canals.

Those buildings are at most 140 years old. So they can be demolished in the name of progress and improved traffic flow. I do agree, though, only a larger fast urban expressway would make sufficient difference. They could even put massive parking lots around it and reduce car traffic on the inner old town/canal area.
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Old September 12th, 2012, 12:52 PM   #8111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

You mean the old ones? Are you mad?
Yes. He's raving mad.
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Old September 12th, 2012, 12:54 PM   #8112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist

They are not old.

The Utrecht Tower is old, for instance. Or the central canals.

Those buildings are at most 140 years old. So they can be demolished in the name of progress and improved traffic flow. I do agree, though, only a larger fast urban expressway would make sufficient difference. They could even put massive parking lots around it and reduce car traffic on the inner old town/canal area.
Are there people living there, in those buildings?
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Old September 12th, 2012, 01:23 PM   #8113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
Those buildings are at most 140 years old. So they can be demolished in the name of progress and improved traffic flow.
Focus on improved traffic flow is fine, but it comes at a price. Even if there is no need to demolish monumental areas, it is a destruction of an area nonetheless and having the type of wide urban expressways that you have in mind impacts on many environmental / urban issues. Ignoring those is something that they did in the name of progress 50 years ago, but thankfully not in the 21st century.

As I mentioned, I do not believe that any urban project to create a better traffic flow should be excluded upfront, even where that project might result in burying canals or demolishing residential area. Except for a few areas only, pretty much everything that we have in Dutch cities is replacable. But because a larger number of issues needs to be weighed against "better traffic flow", you need to pick your battles. Your scribbles cannot be taken seriously without any specific and demonstrated upside. For your idea to bury the Singel in Amsterdam for starters, I fail to see the upside. The problem in Central Amsterdam is in its poor spokes and in the poor s100. Burying the Singel might bring something, but it would solve the least of our problems.
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Old September 12th, 2012, 01:50 PM   #8114
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N305 widening

The Zeewolde municipality published the zoning plan to upgrade the N305 to a 4-lane divided highway. It is currently a two-lane road with a speed limit of 100 km/h. The widened highway will not include grade-separation. The widening costs € 16.9 million and will be executed in 2013-2014.

It is phase I of a plan to widen the N305 from A27 to N302 to a divided highway.

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Old September 12th, 2012, 04:01 PM   #8115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
They are not old.

The Utrecht Tower is old, for instance. Or the central canals.

Those buildings are at most 140 years old. So they can be demolished in the name of progress and improved traffic flow. I do agree, though, only a larger fast urban expressway would make sufficient difference. They could even put massive parking lots around it and reduce car traffic on the inner old town/canal area.
What's currently located where those massive parking lots would be?
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Old September 12th, 2012, 04:10 PM   #8116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Penn's Woods

What's currently located where those massive parking lots would be?
My uncles bedroom, my sisters bathroom, your cousins garden and the local chippy. And through the pub.
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Old September 12th, 2012, 04:23 PM   #8117
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The Dutch vote today. What influence will the result of the elections have in road-related policies?
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Old September 12th, 2012, 04:24 PM   #8118
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Whatever it is, left will blame right, and right will blame left.
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Old September 12th, 2012, 04:27 PM   #8119
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Quote:
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My uncles bedroom, my sisters bathroom, your cousins garden and the local chippy. And through the pub.
LOL.
Seriously, I'm having visions of a sanitized, artificial-feeling downtown frequented mostly by tourists surrounded by parking and cut off from the rest of its city, and I'm not sure that's a good thing.
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Old September 12th, 2012, 04:36 PM   #8120
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It's total rubbish, this whole idea. It would mean a whole new design of a city, with entire communities being removed. They don't need that sort of thing anyway, most Dutch people go on their bikes to town. And for those who don't, existing multi-storey car parks do the jobs just fine.
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