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Old December 24th, 2014, 12:11 AM   #11901
verfmeer
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The N201 has gotten a new alignment between the junctions with the N196. The N196 used to be the (old) N201, until the new N201 was build.
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Old December 24th, 2014, 12:11 AM   #11902
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Here you go:
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Old December 24th, 2014, 12:16 AM   #11903
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrAronymous View Post
But it will eventually be broken. Literally. And the concept of a 2x3 lane road only carrying 2x1 road worths of traffic could be classified as 'broken'.
Unfortunately thats how people think.

Another view is that it's a perfect and a dream to drive on. Just like most roads at night.
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Old December 24th, 2014, 03:01 AM   #11904
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Is it really hard to do N196 south -> N201 continue? If you are going from say N201 at the top to N201 at the right side, the N196 seems so much shorter and easier, you miss that left turn and then the mess at that interchange.

I guess it the N201n passes on an overpass without ramps, but even if you turn left and then right along that local street...
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Old December 24th, 2014, 03:28 AM   #11905
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snowdog View Post
Unfortunately thats how people think.

Another view is that it's a perfect and a dream to drive on. Just like most roads at night.
Perhaps an option would be to not do anything now, but when the road is in such a state that it needs major repairs consider whether it has enough traffic (present & projected) to justify the cost?

Just thinking out loud....
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Old December 24th, 2014, 03:34 AM   #11906
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Thanks Chris.

About rebuilding the road, I think at the moment it's enough to just turn it into 2 lanes + emergency. Cheap and quick. A 3-lanes road with no shoulder is always substandard, with such low flow there's no point in keeping all of them.
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Old December 24th, 2014, 01:33 PM   #11907
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snowdog View Post
Unfortunately thats how people think.

Another view is that it's a perfect and a dream to drive on. Just like most roads at night.
There's no need to use it anymore, the new N201 is much nicer to use anyway. Roads are just a means to an end: improving life. If life can be improved by breaking up roads, what's wrong with that?

In other news, the Rhenen Rhine bridge will be expanded to a 3-lane road, with the third lane functioning as a tidal wave lane. I think the plan is to construct a low-weight cycle path extension to the current bridge and use the freed space of the current cycle path to create the third lane.

The N233 is an important traffic link for local and regional traffic as it is the only fixed Rhine crossing between Utrecht (A27 motorway) and Arnhem (A50 motorway).

Source: https://www.provincie-utrecht.nl/act...flow-rijnbrug/

Last edited by Neverworld; December 24th, 2014 at 01:39 PM.
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Old December 24th, 2014, 03:43 PM   #11908
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neverworld View Post
There's no need to use it anymore, the new N201 is much nicer to use anyway. Roads are just a means to an end: improving life. If life can be improved by breaking up roads, what's wrong with that?
Not if you have to be in Aalsmeer for example .

Life is almost never improved by destroying a road . Life is pretty much always improved with new roads! There is no such thing as to many roads! ( well from my point of view, which is of course in conflict with loads of people who only see pollution, noise and annoying metal things on wheels ).

Until the road needs money for maintenance there is no logical reason to destroy it. Let drivers enjoy a nice relaxing drive on a wide road without an annoying amount of traffic on it.
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Old December 24th, 2014, 04:29 PM   #11909
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Every square meter used for empty roads can't be used for something else, something that produces money and is more needed, like houses or offices of company buildings. I think it in't hard to remove the southern lanes and let the northern lanes handle all the traffic. That way the area the southern lanes used to occupy could be used for something useful.
I am not against roads, but I am against useless roads or roads that are blown out of proportions. 2x3 is overkill here and with 2x2 or 1+2 you don't lose any driving comfort (overtaking still possible) while using less space. And the changes of traffic jams will still be zero.
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Old December 24th, 2014, 06:43 PM   #11910
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There's plenty of space, even in NL. No need to remove every m2 of pavement because it isn't filled up to it's maximum.
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Old December 24th, 2014, 07:06 PM   #11911
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I just wanted to say, there are massive green medians everywhere, and that's supposedly not a huge waste of space ?

Secondly, there are enough empty offices everywhere. Housing is a different matter, I personally think housing is still ridiculously expensive in the NL, but if lowering the price ( by building lots of new housing) is the way to go? (I doubt it, I don't think people want their properties to lose value...) Besides, if you want housing to destroy a road for housing, then you might as well just build higher density in the first place, high rises in cities, rather than suburbs ( not that I'm against suburbs, I prefer suburbs, I think the Dutch suburbs are not ''suburby'' enough and there is too little personal space for each house/ the lots are to small. That way you get less traffic in the first place and less use of space.

Because there is less traffic on it than max capacity does not make a road useless.

The secondary road network in the NL is total shit compared to many other countries, there should always be decent alternatives, for if something happens on the ''main'' road.

The tiny amount of space used by roads is negligible compared to other wastes of space. The roads, buildings, offices, industry only takes 13% of the available space. Now I understand that a lot of space is used for farming and pastures, and some nature too, but there is loads of otherwise grasslands, bushes, and other rubbish that is not used as a pasture or for farming.

Motorists pay billions more than is being returned in infrastructure to them, in fact many of these ''nature'' areas can be seen as directly financed and existing by the motorist.

I'm just sick of the motorists always being taken in the ***, because, that's how it is, ''bend over please and **** you, thanks for the money btw, we will use it to ruin more roads for ya!''.

But who am I, I just need to move to a place ( Canada or USA) where there is more space for cars and for people, rather than for nonsense...

Last edited by snowdog; December 24th, 2014 at 07:13 PM.
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Old December 24th, 2014, 08:48 PM   #11912
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Calm down and celebrate Christmas, Snowdog. Thne Netherlands is one of he most advanced countries in the world when it comes to infrastructure.
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Old December 24th, 2014, 09:50 PM   #11913
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Quote:
Originally Posted by verfmeer View Post
Every square meter used for empty roads can't be used for something else, something that produces money and is more needed, like houses or offices of company buildings. I think it in't hard to remove the southern lanes and let the northern lanes handle all the traffic. That way the area the southern lanes used to occupy could be used for something useful.
I am not against roads, but I am against useless roads or roads that are blown out of proportions. 2x3 is overkill here and with 2x2 or 1+2 you don't lose any driving comfort (overtaking still possible) while using less space. And the changes of traffic jams will still be zero.
But in this case we're talking about a space savings of like 3 m next to a road, what useful purpose is possible?
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Old December 24th, 2014, 10:22 PM   #11914
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanadzie View Post
But in this case we're talking about a space savings of like 3 m next to a road, what useful purpose is possible?
Think of all the treeeees.
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Old December 24th, 2014, 10:27 PM   #11915
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanadzie View Post
But in this case we're talking about a space savings of like 3 m next to a road, what useful purpose is possible?
In the Netherlands, it all adds up....
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Old December 24th, 2014, 10:27 PM   #11916
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It is likely that eventually the land between N196 and N201 will be developed. They could build a frontage road serving those developments, similar to the existing one on the northern side of N196.

Note that the N196 (former N201) was widened from 2x2 to 2x3 lanes within the existing right-of-way. 2x3 lanes is a bit overkill today, but I think 2x2 should eventually remain to serve Aalsmeer and new developments in the area.
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Old December 25th, 2014, 02:01 AM   #11917
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Quote:
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But in this case we're talking about a space savings of like 3 m next to a road, what useful purpose is possible?
If the 3 meters are being add to a plot at the southern side of the road, it becomes bigger so some developments that aren't possible now could be build. 3 meters are enough for some extra off-street parking, a requirement for these kind of areas. So the extra parking might make it possible to add another floor to a office or hotel, making it more profitable.
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Old December 25th, 2014, 04:40 PM   #11918
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Just wanna take a moment and salute Chris, one of all humble forumers making this site what it is. Taking his time and making maps for others, cheers!
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Old December 26th, 2014, 04:24 AM   #11919
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Absolutely. I'll also praise his patience, even in front of a lot of basic questions from forumers
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Well, sir, there's nothing on earth like a genuine, bona fide, electrified, six-car monorail!

Marchionne means never having to say you're sorry.

Due to Photobucket f*cking up, most images won't be visibile in my old posts. If you need anything specific, please write me.

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Old December 26th, 2014, 04:58 PM   #11920
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Oversized sign at Maasvlakte (Port of Rotterdam).

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