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Old October 21st, 2015, 02:19 PM   #12841
sotonsi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Nobody cares about exit numbers.
Well use the name then! Like I (and the London traffic reports) did! That I also used the number is neither here nor there.

I'm not saying traffic reports should say "afrit 8", I'm saying there's no reason why traffic reports can only give prominence to knooppunts and not "Exit Schiphol", etc.
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In addition, a knooppunt does not have an exit number in the Netherlands.
I've never understood that in France, Netherlands, etc. It makes a mockery of sequential exit numbers in a worse way than missing numbers for exits that weren't built, or suffixed exits for later additions are: unlike those other things, it's actually planned into the system that you have exits that aren't numbered.

At best, knooppunt status is pointless. This not numbering them and the ignoring of afrits in traffic reports makes them worse than pointless - the two-tier system of motorway junctions become a needless impediment to navigation!
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Old October 21st, 2015, 02:53 PM   #12842
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Lol ok you just keep believing that.
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Old October 21st, 2015, 03:16 PM   #12843
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My point was indeed that it changing a status from exit to an interchange doesn't change the actual situation.

I don't have a strong opinion if it should be an interchange or an exit, but if an interchange suggests a free flow of traffic, this "Knooppunt Bodegraven" might be a bad example. Because its only partly free-flowing. Coming from the N11 driving towards A12, is not free-flowing at all, there are a couple of roundabouts and I think also traffic lights but I'm not sure about that, and during rush hours that part is always jammed.

Another question about interchanges. There are several interchanges in the Netherlands that look more like road mergers and road splits than real interchanges (for instance Gouwe A12/A20, and Burgerveen A4/A44). They are incomplete and lack several options, one cannot drive from Rotterdam to The Hague for instance. Isn't naming these mergers and spits a Knooppunt/interchange a bit misleading? Or do other countries have that too?
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Old October 21st, 2015, 05:36 PM   #12844
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Who says a knooppunt must always be complete (or freeflow) in all directions ? Look at Beverwijk, Velsen, Kooimeer, De Hoek, Kruisberg, Ten Esschen, Tiglia, Het Vonderen, Paalgraven, Oud-Dijk, Gouwe, Ypenburg, Rottepolderplein, Joure, Julianaplein, Hooipolder, etcetera. (Or in the past: Burgerveen, Kunderberg, Klaverpolder, Lankhorst, De Baars, etcetera)

From the 1980's on a knooppunt has been a junction of two motorways.
Since "Duurzaam Veilig" categorisation of roads also non-motorway national motorroads ("stroomwegen") can be part of a knooppunt.

Thus a knooppunt is an interchange between several stretches of the national (motor)roadway network. A knooppunt is because of it's function in national traffic flows more important than the average exit.

Last edited by aswnl; October 21st, 2015 at 05:42 PM.
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Old October 23rd, 2015, 11:36 AM   #12845
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aswnl View Post

Who says a knooppunt must always be complete (or freeflow) in all directions ? Look at Beverwijk, Velsen, Kooimeer, De Hoek, Kruisberg, Ten Esschen, Tiglia, Het Vonderen, Paalgraven, Oud-Dijk, Gouwe, Ypenburg, Rottepolderplein, Joure, Julianaplein, Hooipolder, etcetera. (Or in the past: Burgerveen, Kunderberg, Klaverpolder, Lankhorst, De Baars, etcetera)
I do not believe that such a standard is in effect anywhere. Still, making the interchanges to full-functional ones is a typical expectation. The partial solutions typically lead to odd kludges as some of your examples are.

A major exception is the Y-shaped 3-way branch-type interchange where the angle between branches is small. But if there is a need for moving between branches, the result is often a kludge, like in Het Vonderen.

Of course, the local conditions may limit the number of options. The typical constraint is lack of space. The extra cost-class constraints may apply in the Netherlands: It is not cheap to build motorway bridges on polders, is it?
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Old October 23rd, 2015, 03:14 PM   #12846
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The Dutch motorway network is dense enough for incomplete interchanges not to be a major issue. Sometimes they only added ramps that will be useful in case of incidents and an unusual detour is needed. They added a ramp at the Kunderberg interchange (A76/A79) in Heerlen mainly to be able to detour A2 traffic in case of closures (maybe a few days per year).

In the Netherlands, traffic is almost always detoured via alternate motorways instead of secondary roads. Most motorways carry a far higher volume than even an non-downgraded secondary road could carry. 50,000+ on rural four-lane motorways is pretty much the norm, only in parts of Friesland and eastern Groningen traffic volumes are lower than that.
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Old October 23rd, 2015, 03:58 PM   #12847
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Traffic in 2015

Kilometers traveled on the national road work increased from May to August 2015, by 0.9% to 67 billion kilometers. The Dutch national road network comprises mainly the motorways and a few select other N-roads.

Traffic congestion grew by 3.1%. A20 through Rotterdam remains the most congested motorway in the Netherlands. Only 4% of traffic congestion is caused by road works.

The most congested motorway locations;

1) A20 eastbound through Rotterdam
2) A16 northbound through Rotterdam
3) A28 westbound at Utrecht
4) A1 eastbound near Amersfoort
5) A27 southbound near Gorinchem
6) A20 westbound through Rotterdam
7) A13 southbound in Rotterdam
8) A1 westbound near Amsterdam (Diemen)
9) A27 southbound at Gorinchem
10) A1 westbound near Amersfoort

Some notes;

The two most congested motorways meet at the Terbregseplein interchange in Rotterdam. The A13-A16 link will alleviate this.

The A1 just west of Amersfoort is the #4 and #10 most congested location (both directions). This segment carries the highest volume of any rural 2x2 motorway: 110,000 vehicles per day. A widening to 2x4 lanes is planned to begin shortly.

The A27 southbound has two top locations right after each other, #5 and #9 just north and through Gorinchem. Gorinchem is only a small city, but is the location of the outdated Merwede Bridge (95,000 vehicles per day on a narrow 2x2 bridge). An expansion is planned to start later this decade.

Also notable, only one location near Amsterdam is located in the top 10.

Vehicle kilometers on the motorway network:


Traffic congestion (kilometer-minutes) development:


The increase of traffic congestion is mainly due to traffic growth, economic growth has picked up over the last year, with lower unemployment and a recovering transportation sector. Housing construction is also increasing, which means more vans on the road during rush hour. In addition, not much expanded or new capacity came available in the past two years.
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Old October 23rd, 2015, 08:59 PM   #12848
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Traffic jams on the A9 and A13 are notorious and add significant to the filezwaarte. Given the completion of A9 around Badhoevedorp and A4 between Delft and Rotterdam I expect the filezwaarte to decrease until 2018. However, there are plans for the A10-zuid that may cause a sharp rise in the years thereafter. At least during the reconstruction.
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Old October 24th, 2015, 03:18 PM   #12849
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The ever so badly missed link between the A4 near Delft and the A4 near Schiedam/Vlaardingen will open late this year. With only a slight delay of just 45 years after it should have been opened according to the initial plans.

This will relieve the A13 as the only connection between Amsterdam/Schiphol/The Hague on the one hand, and the Rotterdam Metropolitan Region on the other hand. The long and costly daily traffic jams will not be missed after this connection opens.

Here is a picture out of the newspaper AD (www.ad.nl) published yesterday:


A4-MD
by Erwin Pakasi, on Flickr
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Last edited by EPA001; October 25th, 2015 at 12:50 PM.
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Old October 24th, 2015, 09:53 PM   #12850
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An aerial photo of the A1 realignment and widening east of Diemen. This is where A1 and A9 will split in a massive 19 lane interchange.

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Old October 25th, 2015, 05:48 PM   #12851
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Wasn't it meant to be even wider (20/21 lanes)?
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Old October 25th, 2015, 06:09 PM   #12852
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Yes, there used to be plans for a separate bus facility, that was supposed to be part of the motorway. This would've resulted in 14 lanes through the 'Aquaduct Veldzicht', but was scrapped for being superfluous.
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Old October 28th, 2015, 11:54 AM   #12853
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A2 130 km/h

Both parties of the governing coalition (liberals and labour) have announced that they want to raise the speed limit on A2 between Utrecht and Amsterdam to 130 km/h.

The low speed limit on A2 is one of the worst annoyances on the Dutch motorway system. This über wide motorway has a speed limit of only 100 km/h and only a partial 130 km/h night limit.


A2 Nieuwer Ter Aa-4 by European Roads, on Flickr
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Old October 28th, 2015, 05:08 PM   #12854
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Wilma Mansveld

Second-in-command Minister of Infrastructure & Environment Wilma Mansveld resigns today. The main reason is an official report about the failure of the high-speed rail train service. Her duties did not include road infrastructure items, though she was responsible for the environmental part.

Dutch government ministries have a minister and a 'secretary' who can also bear the title of 'minister' abroad. They have a nearly similar salary and responsibilities at the ministry are split between the secretary and minister.

The current minister is Melanie Schultz. She is responsible for road infrastructure, spatial planning and water management / transport. The secretary Wilma Mansveld's responsibilities were railroads, aviation and environment. It is common in a coalition government that the minister and secretary are from two different parties. In this case Mansveld was from the Labour Party (PvdA), while Schultz is from the Liberals (VVD).

As railroads are a highly sensitive subject in Dutch politics, the job of secretary is sometimes said to be tougher than minister, due to the many debates and political problems with rail infrastructure.

Mansveld was called the 'Annie Lennox of The Hague' due to her resemblence to the Scottish singer.
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Old October 28th, 2015, 05:19 PM   #12855
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What do you mean by "failure of high speed trains"? Failure to create HS rails? Failure to attract customers? Technical failure?
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Old October 28th, 2015, 05:38 PM   #12856
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Mainly the Fyra train service: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fyra

The official inquiry was very critical of previous cabinets, the entire parliament and NS (railways). This was a very long-lasting issue, started with the decision to build the high-speed rail in 1996. It has cost over € 11 billion and the Fyra service failed to deliver.

Mansveld was not the only person under fire, but the only one that is currently in office. She was already under fire with other issues over the last couple of years (not related to the high-speed rail). So this was not really unexpected.

Sharon Dijksma is rumored as the new secretary of Infrastructure & Environment. She has more experience in such an office (it would be her third position as secretary of a ministry). Mansveld had no national experience prior to her appointment.
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Old October 28th, 2015, 10:01 PM   #12857
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Any chance Camiel Eurlings would return to the industry as an independent member of te cabinet?
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Old October 28th, 2015, 10:13 PM   #12858
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I'm not sure what you mean. Camiel Eurlings was CEO of KLM and minister of transport before that. He's a member of the CDA, which is not a governing party, and he's also not actively involved in politics today.
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Old October 28th, 2015, 10:22 PM   #12859
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An aerial photos of the 'Stichtse rotonde' or 'Sticht Roundabout' in Amersfoort, which used to be the starting point of the A28 motorway, until the Utrecht - Amersfoort segment opened in 1986. The roundabout has two lanes and still has the original early 1960s concrete slabs. A road runs around the roundabout.

It is named after the episcopal principality of Utrecht, which was known as Sticht Utrecht in Dutch. The Sticht Bridge of A27 from Almere towards Hilversum is also named for it.


Autumn flying by Vincent Kuipers, on Flickr
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Old October 29th, 2015, 01:34 AM   #12860
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Both parties of the governing coalition (liberals and labour) have announced that they want to raise the speed limit on A2 between Utrecht and Amsterdam to 130 km/h.

The low speed limit on A2 is one of the worst annoyances on the Dutch motorway system. This über wide motorway has a speed limit of only 100 km/h and only a partial 130 km/h night limit.


A2 Nieuwer Ter Aa-4 by European Roads, on Flickr
It's curious... aside from the relative lack of housing / commercial development on the side of the road it could be an Toronto-area Ontario highway. With tempo 100, and terribly annoying Not a chance they would switch the signs to 130

Do they have the same kind of issue with 5 lanes per direction with slow traffic on the more left lanes, faster traffic trying to sieve through the central lanes and general speed chaos?
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