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Old December 20th, 2015, 12:08 PM   #13081
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Nice pictures, why was it again that they chose to have only two south bound lanes, instead of three? I think it is a matter of months before it gets busy enough to justify another lane, why wait?
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Old December 20th, 2015, 03:09 PM   #13082
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What happened to A4 exit 15? Was there an exit planned between exit 14 and the A20 that simply didn't get made or is it faulty numbering and in the future exit 16 will be renumbered to 15?

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Old December 20th, 2015, 03:14 PM   #13083
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I doubt if they ever planned an exit between Delft-Zuid (#14) and A20. Topographic maps from the 1960s to 1990s do not show any earthworks or projected interchange.

This 1968 topographic map shows how the motorway was planned through Schiedam and Vlaardingen. As you can see these residential areas were developed at the same time as A4 went under construction.
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Old December 20th, 2015, 05:34 PM   #13084
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I am not familiar with any plans for an additional exit either. There may be many reasons behind the missing number, including in the A4 section between Delft and Ypenburg (intersection with the A13). After all, the Western bypass of Delft was only opened in 1998, six years after the introduction of exit numbering. And even the section between Rijswijk and the Ypenburg interchange was not a motorway back then. The route was still called N4 at the time. I seem to recall that this route did not carry the A4's exit numbering back then.

So either they took out one exit anywhere between Ypenburg and Schiedam from the early 1990s plans, or they decided in the early 1990s that everything was so uncertain that it would be preferable to create a little headroom. A final alternative could be that they had reserved the number for the Schiedam-Noord exit integrated in the A4/A20 interchange.

EDIT: I now gather that the plans as they existed pre-2000s included one additional exit between the A20 interchange and Delft, more or less on the Northern fringe of Schiedam. But no groundworks had been made for that one.
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Old December 21st, 2015, 03:44 PM   #13085
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A4 Delft - Schiedam opening

The southbound direction of A4 between Delft and Schiedam also opened to traffic last night around 10.30 p.m. This means A4 is now in full operation in both directions.





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Old December 21st, 2015, 06:41 PM   #13086
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Rijkswegen

An interesting discrepancy in the length of rijkswegen (national roads) can be found in the data of the CBS (Central Bureau for Statistics) and Rijkswaterstaat (National Road Authority).

According to CBS, the 2015 length of rijkswegen is 5279 kilometers. However, according to the latest list of current rijkswegen by Rijkswaterstaat, the length is 3082 kilometers.

It is unclear how this significant discrepancy can exist. There is currently 2471 kilometers of motorway in the Netherlands, a small share of that is not a rijksweg but a provincial road (3-digit motorways except for A200, A205 & A208). There is only a small number of non-motorway rijkswegen, such as N3, N9, N11, N14, N18, N31, N33, N35, N36, N44, N48, N50, N57, N59, N61, N65 and N99. The combined length of them is around 500 kilometers, so that makes the 3082 kilometer figure by Rijkswaterstaat correct.

It's also not possible that CBS counts both carriageways separately, as that would put the total length near 6000 km. CBS statistics also show that the length of rijkswegen grew by 170 kilometers since 2010, which is clearly not the case.

So, who knows?
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Old December 21st, 2015, 09:59 PM   #13087
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TM_Germany View Post
I'm sorry, this may seem totally absurd and is probably just wrong, but recently word has gotten around Germany that you can pay for your driving lessons in the NL with sex (!). Normally I wouldn't even consider the idea, but multiple normally trustworthy newspapers reported about it. So is this true or have any of you ever heard of this?

If you can read german:
http://www.n24.de/n24/Nachrichten/Pa...rerschein.html
http://www.focus.de/panorama/welt/de...d_5160362.html
http://www.autobild.de/artikel/niede...x-8451293.html
If I had a driving school I would be quite careful with this. Once they come from the tax office demanding their split, it won't be so much fun any more... having seen the ladies/gentlemen there...
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Old December 21st, 2015, 10:46 PM   #13088
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
An interesting discrepancy in the length of rijkswegen (national roads) can be found in the data of the CBS (Central Bureau for Statistics) and Rijkswaterstaat (National Road Authority).

According to CBS, the 2015 length of rijkswegen is 5279 kilometers. However, according to the latest list of current rijkswegen by Rijkswaterstaat, the length is 3082 kilometers.

It is unclear how this significant discrepancy can exist. There is currently 2471 kilometers of motorway in the Netherlands, a small share of that is not a rijksweg but a provincial road (3-digit motorways except for A200, A205 & A208). There is only a small number of non-motorway rijkswegen, such as N3, N9, N11, N14, N18, N31, N33, N35, N36, N44, N48, N50, N57, N59, N61, N65 and N99. The combined length of them is around 500 kilometers, so that makes the 3082 kilometer figure by Rijkswaterstaat correct.

It's also not possible that CBS counts both carriageways separately, as that would put the total length near 6000 km. CBS statistics also show that the length of rijkswegen grew by 170 kilometers since 2010, which is clearly not the case.

So, who knows?
Might that be because the CBS counts dual highways (one for ongoing traffic and one for traffic leaving the motorway like the A16 going over the Brienenoordbrug) double, and maybe counting parts with double names (A15/A16) double? That might add a few kilometers. However, not enough to cover 2000km

In addition, like you also said, they could also have added the provincial motorways in addition to the national N-routes. Although that is again not enough to make up the gap of 2000+ km.

It might be interesting to look up the definition the CBS uses for 'Rijksweg.' Maybe they use the term dual carriageway as standard. In that case, quite a few N-routes could be added. Even though they are not official Rijkswegen.
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Old December 21st, 2015, 10:49 PM   #13089
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Maybe it's A-roads versus all Rijkswegen?
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Old December 22nd, 2015, 02:39 PM   #13090
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Could it be that CBS also includes the various ramps in their measurement?

In the Databank of the Danish Road Directorate the state road network have 4 categories:
Motorways: 1182 km (1.1.2015)
Expressways: 318 km (1.1.2015)
Other Roads: 2295 km (1.1.2015)
Ramps: 764 km (1.1.2015)

The first 3 categories add up to 3796 km which is the same number that Vejdirektoratets usually quotes as the state road network, but then they also have the 4th category called "Ramps", which totals 764 km. With the Dutch motorway network approx. 2,5 times larger than the Danish, the motorway ramps could easily measure approx. 2000 km in the Netherlands, and could explain the discrepancy.

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/DA/vid...er%202015.xlsx
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Old December 22nd, 2015, 03:00 PM   #13091
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It's a good guess, but the numbers also don't match that.

As of 2012, there is 5965 km of carriageway and 1491 km of ramps / connector roads. That combined is much higher than the CBS number.

As of 2012, the asphalt surface area was 74 km (main carriageways) and 13 km (connectors and ramps). Greenery area within the motorway right-of-way: 200 km.
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Old December 22nd, 2015, 04:07 PM   #13092
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A2 Amsterdam - Utrecht

A court in Utrecht has rejected the appeals by two municipalities along A2 to raise the speed limit from 100 to 130 km/h (19-6 h). The court says there is no legal reason to lower the speed limit and that the negative effects of the higher speed limit are minimal and remains within the limits.

The concentration of NO2 (nitrogen dioxide) along the motorway is two-thirds within the so-called 'not notable increase' of 1.2 g/m, and one third above that, but within limits. The concentration of PM10 (particles) along the motorway increases by 0.2 g/m at the greatest, and is within the limits set by law.

The noise levels also increase slightly, between 0.0 and 0.7 dB, and remains well within the limits.
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Old December 22nd, 2015, 04:10 PM   #13093
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What was A2 speed limited before the widening, when it was 2x3, in the area?
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Old December 22nd, 2015, 04:12 PM   #13094
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120 km/h.
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Old December 22nd, 2015, 04:43 PM   #13095
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Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
A court in Utrecht has rejected the appeals by two municipalities along A2 to raise the speed limit from 100 to 130 km/h (19-6 h). The court says there is no legal reason to lower the speed limit and that the negative effects of the higher speed limit are minimal and remains within the limits.

The concentration of NO2 (nitrogen dioxide) along the motorway is two-thirds within the so-called 'not notable increase' of 1.2 g/m, and one third above that, but within limits. The concentration of PM10 (particles) along the motorway increases by 0.2 g/m at the greatest, and is within the limits set by law.

The noise levels also increase slightly, between 0.0 and 0.7 dB, and remains well within the limits.
You mean someone decided to raise the speed limit and the municipalities appealed...i.e., they wanted it at the lower level?
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Old December 22nd, 2015, 04:49 PM   #13096
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That is correct.
And luckily they didn't get what they want.
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Old December 22nd, 2015, 04:49 PM   #13097
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Yes, back in 2009 there was a pact between the national government and municipalities to widen the A2 from six to ten lanes, but reduce the speed limit from 120 to 100 km/h, in exchange for not appealing to the project.

100 km/h is way too slow on this mega motorway, and is partially enforced with section control that measures the average speed over longer distances. The segment not within section control is also one of the top locations for mobile speed checks. It feels like one gigantic speed trap. For years you couldn't drive the speed limit due to very heavy traffic, and now that it's finally widened you can't drive at normal motorway speed that should come with a design like this.

Minister Schultz wants 130 km/h on all motorways if possible. That includes A2.
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Old December 22nd, 2015, 05:32 PM   #13098
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A classic case of bad-untrustworthy goverment.

A) They made a prommise to the municipalties. Breaking it nearly 1 week after opening
B) They didn't match road profile with percieved speed.

They should have been more clear on both fronts.
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Old December 22nd, 2015, 05:35 PM   #13099
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A classic case of bad-untrustworthy goverment.

A) They made a prommise to the municipalties. Breaking it nearly 1 week after opening
B) They didn't match road profile with percieved speed.

They should have been more clear on both fronts.
I was going to say it doesn't sound like much of a pact if the courts didn't enforce it, but that's none of my business.
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Old December 22nd, 2015, 06:09 PM   #13100
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It wasn't officially signed or anything. But it was used in brochures handed out to locals saying "meassures: 100km/h".
So it wasn't black and white, but it was used to speed up the planning proces. So partly the goverment misled the municipalties, but upping the limit was in their legal right as no official doccuments where signed. It isn't very pretty though.....
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