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Old April 1st, 2016, 05:07 AM   #13461
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2025 might be too early, but 2030 should be a good date to ban sales of new ICE cars. Before that, increasingly higher taxes should be used to reduce demand for ICE and shift it towards electric-powered cars.

I'm now convinced the future of car is electric, denying it is like the situation of a person aggressively saying, in 1905, that horse-drawn carriages were there to stay and that attempts to ban horses from city areas were unacceptable.
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Old April 1st, 2016, 05:56 AM   #13462
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why so? In 1905 people were saying aggressively electric cars were to stay and will win over ICE too ICE still has considerable development room in it... if you can cut emissions by half and improve fuel efficiency by 20 % vs today, is electric even interesting anymore?

And of course, why should bans and taxes be used instead of letting the market decide automatically?
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Old April 1st, 2016, 06:22 AM   #13463
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ICEs will never solve the problem of point-of-use emission...
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Old April 1st, 2016, 11:22 AM   #13464
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanadzie View Post
why so? In 1905 people were saying aggressively electric cars were to stay and will win over ICE too ICE still has considerable development room in it... if you can cut emissions by half and improve fuel efficiency by 20 % vs today, is electric even interesting anymore?

And of course, why should bans and taxes be used instead of letting the market decide automatically?
Banning them is pretty stupid, but imo it's entirely reasonable to tax fossil fuels more than we're currently doing. We tax things that have a negative (financial) impact on society (like alcohol and cigarettes burdening the health care system), and fossil fuel emissions are on that list.

And let's not forget that the market isn't currently deciding anything. We're still subsidizing fossil fuels. That's completely backwards.
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Old April 1st, 2016, 01:00 PM   #13465
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Why are we having a vehicular discussion when there's actual megaprojects to be commented on?
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Old April 1st, 2016, 04:49 PM   #13466
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speed limits

Another segment of motorway has been increased to 130 km/h, day and night. An 11 kilometer segment of A1 between Soest and Hoevelaken (near Amersfoort) is now limited at 130.

It used to be a confusing mix of 100, 120 and 130 km/h on this stretch, depending on the time of day.
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Old April 4th, 2016, 09:31 PM   #13467
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A10, Amsterdam

h/t to Koesj, the final EIA of A10 in Amsterdam has been published.

They managed to include two through lanes on the local lanes of A10. They originally planned two lanes in the tunnel, but only one through lane at the S108 and S109 exits. There are now two continuous lanes. They have a very tight workspace for this project.

The images evolve west to east.

1. The 'De Nieuwe Meer' motorway interchange (A4/A10)


2. The S108 interchange. The blue part denotes the 12 lane tunnel. Notice the very tight ramps at the S108 interchange.


3. The eastern end of the tunnel.


4. The S109 interchange and Rozenoord Bridge (17 lanes) across the Amstel River.


5. The western part of the 'Amstel' motorway interchange (A2/A10). A complex situation.


6. A bit zoomed out to show the entire Amstel motorway interchange.
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Old April 4th, 2016, 10:27 PM   #13468
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As much as the spatial aspects of this project have been bungled (only the motorway goes underground, rail will still be a massive barrier; lotsa cash for only a couple of extra lanes) I'm still in awe that these kinds of >1b€ megaprojects can be done in this rigidly overplanned country
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Old April 4th, 2016, 10:38 PM   #13469
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The Rozenoord Bridge had only 4 lanes until 1989.... and will now expand to 17 lanes.

Late 1980s photo:
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Old April 5th, 2016, 12:32 AM   #13470
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Koesj, remember that this project is not only done because motorway capacity needs to be increased, it's also done for the quality of life in the area + to be able to expand current railway infrastructure and to have the possibility to the build highrise buildings over the railway tracks in the future. This is a small part of a bigger plan. Still a lot of money though.
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Old April 5th, 2016, 12:48 AM   #13471
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrAronymous View Post
Koesj, remember that this project is not only done because motorway capacity needs to be increased, it's also done for the quality of life in the area + to be able to expand current railway infrastructure and to have the possibility to the build highrise buildings over the railway tracks in the future. This is a small part of a bigger plan. Still a lot of money though.
Quality of life - okay, but it's mostly officeworkers in shitty industries next to the current embankment. I don't really give a toss about their view. Railway infrastructure is already being expanded though and they didn't need to move the A10 for that, or do you think we're going to see six continuous tracks along the mainline? Highrise buildings on top of the corridor I don't believe: A. it's permit hell and B. I don't think this plan makes it possible to build on top of the road tunnels anyway.

Bottom line for me is that it'd better have been a (already large) part of a giant plan: as a continuous spatial concept, with road and rail underground together, with provisions for real estate-development, etc. What we get now though fits like the proverbial flag on a broomstick.
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Old April 5th, 2016, 01:24 AM   #13472
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You need to visit the Amsterdam subforum more often then, there's plenty of housing units under construction.

And yes I do think they will expand rail. The plan was to have an international train have its final stop here as well, so some extra platforms could be very needed. The plan still is to make Amsterdam Zuid the second largest and second most important rail station in Amsterdam. 4 Platforms isn't gonna cut it.

I never said they were going to build on the road tunnels, because they won't. They'll put regular streets and tram tracks there. You think there would have been plans for years to do this (building highrise above the rail) without it being possible? It's either possible, or they will make it possible. It's technically possible though, just look at Hudsons Yards in NYC. And why is it so hard to believe they're doing this project in phases? Just this tunnel alone - phase 1 - is mega expansive/expensive. Even if they leave the train station above ground this tunnel is very welcome. It isn't as big of a boondoggle compared to say, A4 Delft-Schiedam or A9 Gaasperdammertunnel.
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Old April 5th, 2016, 08:46 AM   #13473
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
The Rozenoord Bridge had only 4 lanes until 1989.... and will now expand to 17 lanes.

Late 1980s photo
I didn't even know that the RAI railway station as we know today was only constructed around 1993, I always thought that it was from 1981 as is the most of the railway west from Amsterdam RAI.
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Old April 5th, 2016, 06:46 PM   #13474
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The last point I'll agree to, the others I can imagine in some sense, but I don't consider very well-thought out with regard to this road tunnel.

I think we both want the same thing: a very vibrant Zuidas.
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Old April 5th, 2016, 06:51 PM   #13475
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A1, Muiden

Some recent photos of the A1 realignment east of Amsterdam. The new A1 will feature 12 lanes, in a 5+2+5 layout with two reversible lanes (7 lanes in the peak direction). The official completion date is 2020, but it appears that this could open much earlier.







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Old April 5th, 2016, 07:01 PM   #13476
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Does anybody have data about how traffic between Antwerp/Den Haag re-accommodated after some months of a fully functioning A4?

Are there substantially more traffic going through A4/A15/A4 to avoid the worse bottlenecks on A20/A16?
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Old April 6th, 2016, 10:30 AM   #13477
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A24 Blankenburg Link

The final EIA for the construction of the new A24 west of Rotterdam has been signed on 28 March 2016 and is open for appeals starting 7 April.

There are no significant changes from the draft EIA which was published in September 2015. One connector road within the A15-A24 interchange was moved slightly.

The A24 is a motorway with six lanes and a 100 km/h design speed. It includes two tunnels, the Aalkeet Tunnel and the river-crossing Blankenburg Tunnel. The Blankenburg Tunnel has a closed length of 945 meters. The Aalkeet Tunnel has a closed length of 510 meters. The Blankenburg Tunnel is an immersed tunnel. The southern entrance of the tunnel is very steep due to pipelines in the area. Moving those pipelines would result in 'possibly unmanageable risk'. There will be climbing lanes to accommodate slow trucks.

The tunnel will be a toll road, the first motorway toll in the Netherlands since 1980. Tolls will pay a share of the investment (€ 315 million will be paid through tolls). The toll rates are estimated at € 1.18 for passenger cars and € 7.11 for trucks. It is expected that the toll component will be paid off after 25 years, the tunnel will then become toll-free. The toll collection will be 'open road tolling' with no toll plazas.

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Old April 6th, 2016, 11:19 AM   #13478
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
The Rozenoord Bridge had only 4 lanes until 1989.... and will now expand to 17 lanes.

Late 1980s photo:
The Dutch evidently had a massive land reservation ready for any such expansion according to that photo.

Do your 17 lanes include the high speed railway twin track bridge built in the middle of that land reservation nowadays..that factory shown waterside is long gone. ?
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Old April 6th, 2016, 11:26 AM   #13479
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the age of mega projects

Four € 1 billion+ motorway projects will move forward this year.

A27, Utrecht
The draft EIA of the A27 widening along the east side of Utrecht has been signed. It will be published on 10 May. It is planned to widen the motorway to 14 lanes and significantly unweave the traffic flows between A12 and A28. This is a highly congested stretch of motorway. It will address no less than 5 bottlenecks noted in the Traffic Jam Top 50. It is a € 1.1 billion project.

A24, Rotterdam
The final EIA has been signed for the construction of the A24 motorway west of Rotterdam (see previous post). It is a € 1.2 billion project

A13-A16, Rotterdam
The final EIA will be signed for the A16 extension north of Rotterdam 'before summer'. This will extend the motorway along the north side of Rotterdam and link it up with A13. This will relieve A20 and address several top 10 traffic jams. It is a € 1 billion project.

A10, Amsterdam
The final EIA has been signed for the A10 tunneling and widening to 12 lanes in southern Amsterdam (see earlier posts). It is a € 1.9 billion project.

A1, A6, A9 Amsterdam-Almere
Meanwhile construction is going at a frantic pace to widen A1, A6 & A9 south and east of Amsterdam (Schiphol-Amsterdam-Almere). The reversible lane on A9 will open soon so it can handle the traffic once the A1 realignment near Muiden opens to traffic. A1 will be widened to 12 lanes and A9 will be widened to 10 lanes. This is a € 5 billion project.
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Old April 6th, 2016, 12:44 PM   #13480
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Quote:
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The Dutch evidently had a massive land reservation ready for any such expansion according to that photo.

Do your 17 lanes include the high speed railway twin track bridge built in the middle of that land reservation nowadays..that factory shown waterside is long gone. ?
I think the 'factory' is the second highway bridge being built?

Neither the new twin track, nor the metro tracks (which were added after that photo was taken) are included in Chris' numbers:

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