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View Poll Results: Which bid should host the FIFA World Cup 2018 / 2022?
Australia - 2018 255 12.32%
Belgium / Netherlands - 2018 247 11.94%
England - 2018 538 26.00%
Indonesia - 2018 68 3.29%
Japan - 2018 35 1.69%
Mexico - 2018 105 5.07%
Qatar - 2018 78 3.77%
Russia - 2018 279 13.48%
South Korea - 2018 16 0.77%
Spain / Portugal - 2018 267 12.90%
USA - 2018 116 5.61%
Australia - 2022 378 18.27%
Belgium / Netherlands - 2022 111 5.36%
England - 2022 114 5.51%
Indonesia - 2022 122 5.90%
Japan - 2022 37 1.79%
Mexico - 2022 149 7.20%
Qatar - 2022 153 7.39%
Russia - 2022 148 7.15%
South Korea - 2022 23 1.11%
Spain / Portugal - 2022 184 8.89%
USA - 2022 249 12.03%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 2069. You may not vote on this poll

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Old October 30th, 2007, 02:25 PM   #2501
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quintana View Post
There was nothing wrong with the '94 World Cup (apart from the overall quality of football but you can't blame the Yanks for that). Big stadiums with incredible attendances. England not being there made it even better
Yeh well. we needed to win by 7 goals in our final game and only won by 6 so we were a little unfortunate.

And everything was wrong with the 94 world cup. It was'nt good. Attendences being big or not. Its the size of the stadium. Any country around the world for a world cup would sell more tickets they just have smaller facilities.

You should expect a 300m person country to have 12 decent sized stadiums not to mention they used thier biggest ones not just football stadiums. England could use Wembley, Twickenham, Old Trafford, etc and beat 68,000 on average without even breaking a sweat.

If it was'nt for the africans 1994 would have gone down as the worst world cup in history.

And it was all down to diana ross

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Old October 30th, 2007, 03:23 PM   #2502
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Originally Posted by Dasher39 View Post
I don't think we are much of a chance for 2018, think we have a better chance for 2022, but at least we are putting our name in the ring.

As for stadiums, if I remember correctly the minimum number of stadiums is 8. I can see us just filling this quota, and maybe using 10 if we also put in Canberra and Townsville.

...

Adelaide would need to build a new stadium is none of their current stadia (AAMI Stadium, Adelaide Oval and Hindmarsh Stadium) fit the requirements. By such time as 2018/2022 Adelaide will require a larger rectangular stadium for Adelaide United, Socceroos, Wallabies games and this will provide just that. Something similar to the Gold Coast would be ideal.

I think Australia is more than capable of hosting a brilliant FIFA World Cup. Obviously we have some factors against us, but we have shown in the past we are capable of putting to world class events and a FIFA World Cup would be no different!
Melbourne is the key to Australia's world cup thinking... The reason? The new Melbourne Rectangular Stadium (MRS) is being built with foundations for a 50k capacity. The statement at the time was that this would aid any future world cup bid. If the MCG is used, there will be no need for the MRS. I suspect that the authorities recognise that the AFL won't step aside for 2 months in May/June to allow exclusive use (as is required by FIFA) of the MCG, so the MRS is required.

If you accept that logic - then you have to accept that the same would go for Telstra Stadium in Sydney and the new stadium in Perth. That's without starting on the rugby codes and whether they'd be willing to step aside for two months...

I think we'd agree that the 2018 bid is almost certainly going to be a 'trial run' for 2022, and I honestly hope it works out for 2022, but I still think it's a hard sell in a country with such diverse sporting interests and such a poor geographical location.
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Old October 30th, 2007, 05:23 PM   #2503
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They can't seriously think about using the MCG for football, the distance to the stands is seriously pushing it.
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Old October 30th, 2007, 05:36 PM   #2504
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sibyl-vane View Post
@ FlicKlings:

do you think Brazil will bid for 2018 again?
No!

I only showed the stadiums for 2014, to compare with other countries.

What you think of Brazilian stadiums?
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Old October 30th, 2007, 06:06 PM   #2505
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benjuk View Post
Melbourne is the key to Australia's world cup thinking... The reason? The new Melbourne Rectangular Stadium (MRS) is being built with foundations for a 50k capacity. The statement at the time was that this would aid any future world cup bid. If the MCG is used, there will be no need for the MRS. I suspect that the authorities recognise that the AFL won't step aside for 2 months in May/June to allow exclusive use (as is required by FIFA) of the MCG, so the MRS is required.

If you accept that logic - then you have to accept that the same would go for Telstra Stadium in Sydney and the new stadium in Perth. That's without starting on the rugby codes and whether they'd be willing to step aside for two months...

I think we'd agree that the 2018 bid is almost certainly going to be a 'trial run' for 2022, and I honestly hope it works out for 2022, but I still think it's a hard sell in a country with such diverse sporting interests and such a poor geographical location.
I agree they probably won't use the MCG, unless they figure out some terms so it could be used for a final. The melbourne rectangular system with a boosted capacity would host the Melbourne matches.

However, I think Telstra Stadium and the new Perth Stadium would definately be used.

Also, 2018/2022 is a long way away, the whole stadium landscape in Australia could change by then. I think the only currently built stadiums that would be used in any sort of capacity would be Telstra and Suncorp, and maybe the MCG for a final. Throw in upgraded Gold Coast and Melbourne stadiums (50k each) and Perth Stadium (60k) and that's only 5 stadiums.

Adelaide must build a new stadium, and also North Queensland (45k each). That brings the total to 7, if you add the MCG that's 8. An upgraded Sydney Football Stadium and either a new Canberra or Newcastle Stadium are essential to bring it to 10.

The finals stadiums would be Telstra, Perth, MCG and Suncorp. Suncorp will need an upgrade to bring it to 65,000 which is very doable (fill in the corners). The only thing that brings down this list is there won't be a truly stand-out show stopping Stadium like there was in Germany with Allianz. Possibly one of the new stadiums such as Adelaide or North QLD or an upgraded Melbourne rectangular stadium could fit the bill with an amazing design/redesign. However all the stadiums will be great venues.

I think Australia is very capable of hosting the World Cup in 2018.
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Old October 30th, 2007, 06:19 PM   #2506
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mephisto View Post
only thing that brings down this list is there won't be a truly stand-out show stopping Stadium like there was in Germany with Allianz. Possibly one of the new stadiums such as Adelaide or North QLD or an upgraded Melbourne rectangular stadium could fit the bill with an amazing design/redesign. However all the stadiums will be great venues.
You're forgetting the new Perth stadium there, the renders look pretty promising althoug they're far from definitive. The Melb rectangular stadium will also have a great design!
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Old October 30th, 2007, 06:54 PM   #2507
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So what's the cost of getting a flight from Perth to Sydney?
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Old October 30th, 2007, 07:13 PM   #2508
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Originally Posted by Flogging Molly View Post
Yeh well. we needed to win by 7 goals in our final game and only won by 6 so we were a little unfortunate.

And everything was wrong with the 94 world cup. It was'nt good. Attendences being big or not. Its the size of the stadium. Any country around the world for a world cup would sell more tickets they just have smaller facilities.

You should expect a 300m person country to have 12 decent sized stadiums not to mention they used thier biggest ones not just football stadiums. England could use Wembley, Twickenham, Old Trafford, etc and beat 68,000 on average without even breaking a sweat.

If it was'nt for the africans 1994 would have gone down as the worst world cup in history.

And it was all down to diana ross

2002 was much worse than 1994 if you ask me.
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Old October 31st, 2007, 01:52 AM   #2509
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparks View Post
So what's the cost of getting a flight from Perth to Sydney?
About 120 quid one way. 5 hour trip.

Your real costs worry is the flights over here in the first place.

Last edited by Benjuk; October 31st, 2007 at 01:59 AM.
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Old October 31st, 2007, 02:00 AM   #2510
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlicKlings View Post
No!

I only showed the stadiums for 2014, to compare with other countries.

What you think of Brazilian stadiums?
I think they look wonderful... But they'd look better on the Brazil 2014 thread.
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Old October 31st, 2007, 09:12 AM   #2511
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Originally Posted by Sparks View Post
They can't seriously think about using the MCG for football, the distance to the stands is seriously pushing it.
They are ("seriously think about using the MCG for footbal") and it's in contention for the final.

At the risk of repeating myself again, the MCG is not much different to any of the multiple venues with athletic tracks that have played host to the final. In fact up to 10 rows of seating had to be removed for the 2006 Commonwealth Games to accommodate the running track.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mephisto View Post
The only thing that brings down this list is there won't be a truly stand-out show stopping Stadium like there was in Germany with Allianz.
This is what the MCG should look like when it's next redeveloped by continuing the new Northern Stand to encircle the entire stadium. The new stand is future proofed with comfort levels and amenities equal to that of the new Wembley.

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Old October 31st, 2007, 09:21 AM   #2512
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Originally Posted by NavyBlue View Post
They are ("seriously think about using the MCG for footbal") and it's in contention for the final.
It's the best venue in the country, and it would be hard to argue against it if Australia could put together a winning bid... However...

It still leaves the question of where are the AFL boys going to play throughout May/June? Switch all games to TelstraDome and interstate for 2 months? And if so, where to interstate - Tassie, Canberra and the Gold Coast? Any new stadium in Perth and Adelaide are likely to be multi-purpose, which would then be used for AFL as well, in which case there would be a problem in May/June again.

Also poses the question, why put in foundations for 50k at the MRS and say it's for a potential world cup bid, if you intend on using the MCG... No way they'll get the MCG (with the final) and a second stadium in Melbourne.
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Old October 31st, 2007, 10:10 AM   #2513
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Originally Posted by Benjuk View Post
It still leaves the question of where are the AFL boys going to play throughout May/June? Switch all games to TelstraDome and interstate for 2 months? And if so, where to interstate - Tassie, Canberra and the Gold Coast? Any new stadium in Perth and Adelaide are likely to be multi-purpose, which would then be used for AFL as well, in which case there would be a problem in May/June again.
Definitely the biggest hurdle in an Australian bid but the FFA are adamant that it's not insurmountable. In theory AFL games could be shared between TD, Princes Park and Skilled Stadium (Geelong) in Victoria with Tasmania hosting some as well. Perth and Adelaide are a bit more difficult because as you said, they will be multi purpose venues. Adelaide could have AAMI Stadium still in use as any new venue will be built at a more attractive location, only to have it demolished when AFL take over the new venue after the WC. Similar options are also available to the rugby codes.

Financial sweetners could also be offered to the domestic codes for the use of stadiums???

It will be interesting to see what they come up with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Benjuk View Post
Also poses the question, why put in foundations for 50k at the MRS and say it's for a potential world cup bid, if you intend on using the MCG... No way they'll get the MCG (with the final) and a second stadium in Melbourne.
The 50k foundations for MRS were mainly a compromise to appease the MVFC and have them sign on at the venue as the major tenant. It future proofs the venue should the club continue to grow past it's 28k average crowds this season. The "potential world cup bid" was an afterthought.
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Old October 31st, 2007, 11:39 AM   #2514
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Originally Posted by NavyBlue View Post
The 50k foundations for MRS were mainly a compromise to appease the MVFC and have them sign on at the venue as the major tenant. It future proofs the venue should the club continue to grow past it's 28k average crowds this season. The "potential world cup bid" was an afterthought.
Bit of a smokescreen - MVFC backed down because the State Gov. threatened to back a 2nd Melbourne franchise in 2010 if Victory didn't sign up - also, it was made clear that long term, Victory's deal wouldn't be so sweet at the Dome once ownership reverts to the AFL in 2010.

Will Princes Park still be suitable for AFL by 2018? If they've stopped using it - how long before the property value will become irresistable for redevelopment?
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Old October 31st, 2007, 10:14 PM   #2515
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England to bid for 2018 World Cup

Wembley is the likely venue for the final should the bid be successful

The Football Association has confirmed it will bid for the 2018 World Cup.
The FA made an attempt to stage the tournament in 2006 but lost out as Germany won the right to play host.

But it believes the time is right to bid again after Fifa, the sport's world governing body, ended its controversial rotation policy earlier this week.

England will face strong competition to host the event, with Australia, China, Russia, United States, Belgium and the Netherlands, and Mexico all interested.


Report: England to bid for 2018 World Cup
Archive: 1966 World Cup final highlights

Bids need to be officially submitted by 2009, with Fifa's executive committee due to make a decision on the host nation in October 2011.

I think an England 2018 would be the best World Cup ever staged

Sports Minister Gerry Sutcliffe
The cost of mounting a bid has been estimated at between £12m and £15m, less than half the bill for London's bid for the 2012 Olympics.

FA chairman Geoff Thompson said: "I'm delighted to announce our intention to bid to host the World Cup in 2018.

"This follows Fifa's announcement on Monday that the previous rotation policy will be discontinued, and the positive comments made by Fifa president Sepp Blatter.

"The tremendous support from Prime Minister Gordon Brown and his government has also been a key consideration in today's decision.

We are conscious this is a very long road we are embarking on

FA chief executive Brian Barwick
"I'm delighted the FA board have been so positive in their support for a bid. It would be tremendous for English football and the whole country if we are successful."

Sports minister Gerry Sutcliffe is confident England can win.

"It's bound to be a tough contest but just like the Olympic bid for 2012, I'm sure we can win," he said.

"England is the home of football, has the best stadiums and our people have a long-standing love affair with the game. I think an England 2018 would be the best World Cup ever staged."

FA chief executive Brian Barwick told BBC Sport: "We believe there is huge public support for this.

"We are conscious this is a very long road we are embarking on but we decided to start the journey today.

"It will be a real contest and we will absolutely respect the opposition.

"There will be no complacency or arrogance. We have got our job to do which is to sell this country, its football and football message to Fifa and the rest of the world and that's what we will do."

606: DEBATE
I see us having the strongest bid. Football's coming home!

Scott

The FA looks to be in good financial shape to make a bid.

Barwick claims the organisation is in its "strongest ever financial position" after agreeing new international broadcast rights for the next four years.

The rights to FA Cup and England home games, which run from 2008-2012, are now worth a total of £145m compared to £39m for the previous four-year period.

England memorably hosted the World Cup once before in 1966, claiming their sole triumph in the tournament by beating West Germany 4-2 in the final.

Wembley hosted that match 41 years ago and the new stadium opened this year is sure to be among those used in 2018 should the FA's bid be successful.

Other grounds likely to be considered in the bid are:


Old Trafford, Emirates Stadium, St James' Park, Stadium of Light, City of Manchester Stadium, Villa Park, Stamford Bridge, Elland Road and the planned stadia at Liverpool, Everton, West Ham and Nottingham.
BBC Radio 5 Live sports news correspondent Gordon Farquhar says the FA's decision to launch a bid is not a surprise.

"There was always the attitude within the FA that if all the obstacles to a bid were removed, which they were when Fifa effectively dropped rotation on Monday, then why wouldn't it bid?" he said.

There is a feeling in the FA that now is the time to go for it

5 Live's Gordon Farquhar
"But there has always been this air of caution. It wanted to ensure the bid is winnable, because that is absolutely vital.

"Last time around the FA was pretty much stung by the fact that they were the victims of a split vote within Europe.

"It wasn't politically the most well-advised bid it put forward, so it wants to make sure it wasn't caught again.

"I understand what's happened at today's board meeting is that there is broad support and everyone is very enthusiastic about it. There is a feeling that now is the time to go for it."

The FA have put out their blueprint for the bid identifying the key issues as:

maximising support for England internationally

financing the bid and financial planning for the tournament

forming a bid team and who will lead it

identifying the stadiums and training facilities to be used

working with all stakeholders to ensure the infrastructure is in place to support the tournament - transport, hotels, communications etc

plans for supporters - domestic and international

the tournament's legacy - for football and the whole country

ensuring the tournament is inclusive to everyone

making England the number one bid and to host the best World Cup ever
Barwick thinks England are in an excellent position to win a bid, adding: "We believe we have a very strong case for making a successful bid and hosting a wonderful tournament."

Alex McGivan was the campaign manager for the World Cup 2006 bid which ultimately failed.

He told BBC 5 Live: "The critical question is what sort of support will England get from within Europe.

"This time it is still complicated because it looks like there are going to be other European candidates.

"There are 24 votes of which a third are European so it's pretty fundamental. You then have to go around five other blocks of votes around the world to try to get them to support you.

"Where we came unstuck was not being able to get the European votes in a line to support us."

He added: "There is a cost but if you win the prize is a wonderful one worth a lot more than £12m-£15m."
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Old October 31st, 2007, 11:19 PM   #2516
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ENGLAND 2018
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Old November 1st, 2007, 02:16 AM   #2517
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Old November 1st, 2007, 09:15 AM   #2518
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Bit of a smokescreen - MVFC backed down because the State Gov. threatened to back a 2nd Melbourne franchise in 2010 if Victory didn't sign up
Victory achieved exactly what they wanted. The pressure they placed on the government eventually increased capacity from the original 20k to the current 34k with foundations for future expansion. As the potential major tenant they held all the aces in the negotiations and the government's threat of a second team was exactly that, a threat to quell any further demands. They have SFA influence in what clubs join the A-League and MVFC knew that very well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Benjuk View Post
also, it was made clear that long term, Victory's deal wouldn't be so sweet at the Dome once ownership reverts to the AFL in 2010.
News to me . . . the handover won't occur until at least 2025.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Benjuk View Post
Will Princes Park still be suitable for AFL by 2018? If they've stopped using it - how long before the property value will become irresistable for redevelopment?
Princes Park will forever remain the home base for the Carlton FC. It will be an AFL stadium in one shape or another, especially since Richard Pratt has recently expressed a desire to host games again. What form will the stadium be in 2018? Don't know, I just put it in as an example of how the AFL issue could be overcome.
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Old November 1st, 2007, 01:15 PM   #2519
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cmc, Mexico already had it twice (only 4 countries can say that, being Italy, France, Mexico, Germany (including West-Germany; 5 after 2014 with Brazil), now don't get too greedy

Personally I think two World Cups in the Americas in a row is too much, just as I wouldn't consider it to be fair if Europe had it twice in a row. I am in favour of a limited rotation policy. And I don't think the combined Americas includes more countries than UEFA... (well, maybe if you include the tiny islands in the Caribbean)
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Old November 1st, 2007, 02:36 PM   #2520
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Originally Posted by NavyBlue View Post
Victory achieved exactly what they wanted. The pressure they placed on the government eventually increased capacity from the original 20k to the current 34k with foundations for future expansion. As the potential major tenant they held all the aces in the negotiations and the government's threat of a second team was exactly that, a threat to quell any further demands. They have SFA influence in what clubs join the A-League and MVFC knew that very well.
One of the major influences on future franchises is the financial backing. The State Gov made it clear to Victory that if no other backers came forward in 2010 that the state would throw the city of Melbourne's weight behind a bid. That's a fact, but I can't say how I know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NavyBlue View Post
Princes Park will forever remain the home base for the Carlton FC. It will be an AFL stadium in one shape or another, especially since Richard Pratt has recently expressed a desire to host games again. What form will the stadium be in 2018? Don't know, I just put it in as an example of how the AFL issue could be overcome.
That's the best news I've heard all week. It'd be a shame to see the place pulled apart and turned into some wierd Waverly like 'shrine', or left to fall apart like Glenferrie Oval (I know that's on a different scale, but you get my meaning).
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