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View Poll Results: Which bid should host the FIFA World Cup 2018 / 2022?
Australia - 2018 255 12.32%
Belgium / Netherlands - 2018 247 11.94%
England - 2018 538 26.00%
Indonesia - 2018 68 3.29%
Japan - 2018 35 1.69%
Mexico - 2018 105 5.07%
Qatar - 2018 78 3.77%
Russia - 2018 279 13.48%
South Korea - 2018 16 0.77%
Spain / Portugal - 2018 267 12.90%
USA - 2018 116 5.61%
Australia - 2022 378 18.27%
Belgium / Netherlands - 2022 111 5.36%
England - 2022 114 5.51%
Indonesia - 2022 122 5.90%
Japan - 2022 37 1.79%
Mexico - 2022 149 7.20%
Qatar - 2022 153 7.39%
Russia - 2022 148 7.15%
South Korea - 2022 23 1.11%
Spain / Portugal - 2022 184 8.89%
USA - 2022 249 12.03%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 2069. You may not vote on this poll

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Old July 7th, 2008, 01:00 PM   #3741
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When FIFA wants and needs to grow the sport in other regions they will look to go to the largest countries with the strongest growing markets. Such countries, like South Africa for example, have growing economies and populations which can support the required stadium infrastructure - which is why FIFA is interested in the first place.
Australia doesn't have an increasing population or economy?
Population growth rate: 0.801% (2008 est.)
GDP - real growth rate: 3.9% (2007 est.)

South Africa:
Population growth rate: -0.501% (2008 est.) (Notice the negative? I think the HIV AIDS epidemic is having a profound effect).
GDP - real growth rate: 5.1% (2007 est.) (Lets remember, South Africa is an as emerging market, and hence it would be expected for it to have significantly better economic growth figures than developed nations, so this figure is not really as good as it looks).


Quote:
Why bend the rules to include Australia (for example) with it's small 22m (?) population, when you can use stronger rules to push the finals toward China with it's 1.2b population?
In the Chinese national football league, the teams near the top of the table consistently gets good crowds in the tens of thousands. But mid-table teams can only attract a hardcore 3000 to 8000 while yo-yos and relegation battlers can manage just about 1000.
The Australian league has several teams which regularly have attendance in tens of thousands, but only Perth Glory has an average attendance at less than 10,000 (7,596 2008).

This, combined with China's league being almost completely fixed and corrupt, resulting in skepticism from fans, hardly puts China in a better position of filling stadiums in the future than Australia. Australia also has three other sporting codes which get significant crowds and would use the grounds, resulting in high overall yearly attendance for stadiums.
A stadium in China will be used by it's resident football team, which will almost never fill the ground, and for other sporting events (considering all the current stadiums have a running track around the ground). Either way, most grounds will only be filled a couple of times per year AT BEST.

There are other arguments why Australia MAY be more suited.
I still think China has more of a chance, but there are many problems in China.

Either way the thread more about a China vs Australia vs USA is http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=654977
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Old July 7th, 2008, 01:09 PM   #3742
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Can hardly say that England is among the countries that has done “extremely well” in the World Cup.
Well they've won once. which only a handfull of countries has managed to do. And they have participated in 12, which is as many as France and Spain.

Either way, The sport is HUGE in England, they have arguably the best league (definately in the top three, far, far ahead of USA) and England has significant importance to FIFA.
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Old July 7th, 2008, 01:59 PM   #3743
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Originally Posted by Benjuk View Post
Didn't mean to imply that one MUST have 8 over 7, just that 8 over 7 is the minimum, 8 over 8, 9 over 8 or 9, 10 over 9 or 10, etc., are all within the desired range as well.



When FIFA wants and needs to grow the sport in other regions they will look to go to the largest countries with the strongest growing markets. Such countries, like South Africa for example, have growing economies and populations which can support the required stadium infrastructure - which is why FIFA is interested in the first place. Why bend the rules to include Australia (for example) with it's small 22m (?) population, when you can use stronger rules to push the finals toward China with it's 1.2b population?



18 stadiums have been put forward, they will narrow the selection down closer to the finals.
South Africa also taps into the entire African market of billions, thats the level of influence while perhaps Australia could argue that it taps into Asia but then again Asia has hosted..leaving NZ and Taz. Not exactly a breakthrough?

Please dont confuse this with questioning Australias ability to host. After some major work to prepare each host city it certainly would be capable.
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Old July 7th, 2008, 02:02 PM   #3744
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Originally Posted by Iain1974 View Post
Brazil has proposed 18 stadiums for 2014
Of which 8 or 10 will be used. South Africa I think bid with 13, using a bunch of existing venues and decided to build 2 new venues once the bid was won.
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Old July 8th, 2008, 05:28 AM   #3745
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The reason i wouldn't like USA to host WC is it's time zone. If the game is played at casual time, it would be broadcasted at late night here in Europe (Largest football market). You know that noone watches recordings here. It wouldn't be a problem if the game is played at the mid of day, but you must get air condisioned stadiums. I would go for Qatar. Time zone is OK and they could afford to get all their stadiums air condisioned.

p.s. In US noone play nor watches football. You will have to wait untill you get latino majority.
wow, many flaws in your argument. Go learn something about the US before you post, then try again. Bet you didnt know that soccer is the biggest youth sport over here did you? Everyone grows up playing it. I guess its gonna suck when Brazil hosts it, and im sure you were pained about the times in 2002. Point is, although Europe is a big market for the game FIFA is going to want to spread it out. What, do you want every WC in Europe? The world doesnt revolve around you. Maybe you should have just said "I hate the US so i dont want the WC to be there."

Last edited by en1044; July 8th, 2008 at 05:34 AM.
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Old July 8th, 2008, 10:11 AM   #3746
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Originally Posted by en1044 View Post
yeah, and what about your pointless argument to try and tell everyone LP Field was too small too...do you realize how dumb that is.

And i just hope you do remember that Giants Stadium was too small during the last WC too, they just made an exception
Why don't you list up and show us the stadiums which definately seem to have more than 8.5 meters on the sides in association football configuration?
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Old July 8th, 2008, 10:24 AM   #3747
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Originally Posted by Index_LT View Post
The reason i wouldn't like USA to host WC is it's time zone. If the game is played at casual time, it would be broadcasted at late night here in Europe (Largest football market). You know that noone watches recordings here. It wouldn't be a problem if the game is played at the mid of day, but you must get air condisioned stadiums. I would go for Qatar. Time zone is OK and they could afford to get all their stadiums air condisioned.

p.s. In US noone play nor watches football. You will have to wait untill you get latino majority.
USA Worldcup is especially detrimental to Asian football fans who are the biggest audience group of FIFA Worldcup. If a football match is held in the evening there, it's broadcasted in the time zone when people are already in workplace or school in Asia. This would cause severe damage to TV viewing figures because any employers or teachers would not let their employees or students watch Worldcup during work or class.

Last edited by Carrerra; July 8th, 2008 at 10:30 AM.
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Old July 8th, 2008, 10:27 AM   #3748
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Originally Posted by Nneznajka View Post
By that time Russia will have all stadiums needed to host World cup 2022 !

I vote for RUSSIA !
can you show us Russian projects that will be realize till 2022?

By the way, Russia is an European country wich belongs to UEFA. So, 2022 is impossible for an European country wich is UEFA member.
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Old July 8th, 2008, 10:44 AM   #3749
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Quote:
Originally Posted by en1044 View Post
wow, many flaws in your argument. Go learn something about the US before you post, then try again. Bet you didnt know that soccer is the biggest youth sport over here did you? Everyone grows up playing it. I guess its gonna suck when Brazil hosts it, and im sure you were pained about the times in 2002. Point is, although Europe is a big market for the game FIFA is going to want to spread it out. What, do you want every WC in Europe? The world doesnt revolve around you. Maybe you should have just said "I hate the US so i dont want the WC to be there."
The world doesn't revolve around USA either. As for spreading football out, China or India would be much more attractive choice than USA to FIFA in terms of growth potential.
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Old July 8th, 2008, 10:58 AM   #3750
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Originally Posted by en1044 View Post
wow, many flaws in your argument. Go learn something about the US before you post, then try again. Bet you didnt know that soccer is the biggest youth sport over here did you? Everyone grows up playing it. I guess its gonna suck when Brazil hosts it, and im sure you were pained about the times in 2002. Point is, although Europe is a big market for the game FIFA is going to want to spread it out. What, do you want every WC in Europe? The world doesnt revolve around you. Maybe you should have just said "I hate the US so i dont want the WC to be there."
No I don't hate US. In fact, i'm from one of most pro-american states in Europe . The thing i don't like id the broadcasting time (When WC would be held in ANY states near date change line). The first game would start between 2 a.m. and 5 a.m. This means a month with football instead of sleep . It isn't good for health you know. Of course there wouldn't be any problem if football is played in air conditioned indoor arenas so the game could be played in daytime.

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Originally Posted by en1044 View Post
Bet you didnt know that soccer is the biggest youth sport over here did you? Everyone grows up playing it.
That was a surprise. Never heard of any american player in major football clubs. Maybe soon i will.

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Originally Posted by en1044 View Post
...and im sure you were pained about the times in 2002.
It was painful for players. They played at daytime, climate was extremely hot and players were already exhausted at the start of the game.

Do you have many stadiums like this : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louisiana_Superdome ? Can the football be played in them?

p.s. Sorry for my bad english.
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Old July 8th, 2008, 11:34 AM   #3751
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Originally Posted by Index_LT View Post
The reason i wouldn't like USA to host WC is it's time zone. If the game is played at casual time, it would be broadcasted at late night here in Europe (Largest football market). You know that noone watches recordings here. It wouldn't be a problem if the game is played at the mid of day, but you must get air condisioned stadiums. I would go for Qatar. Time zone is OK and they could afford to get all their stadiums air condisioned.

p.s. In US noone play nor watches football. You will have to wait untill you get latino majority.
The Americas woke up at 2am to watch games in 2002, Europe can do the same.
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Old July 8th, 2008, 11:57 AM   #3752
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Why don't you list up and show us the stadiums which definately seem to have more than 8.5 meters on the sides in association football configuration?
Dallas, New Cowboys Stadium (80k-100k)


Chicago, Soldier Field (61.5k)


Los Angeles, Rose Bowl (92k)


Denver, Invesco Field (76k)


Phoenix, UoP Stadium (63k-73k)


San Francisco, 49ers new stadium (80k)


Boston, Gillette Stadium (69k)


Houston, Reliant Stadium (71.5k)


Seattle, Qwest Field (67k)


Washington DC, Fedex Field (92k)


New York City, New Meadowlands Stadium (82.5k)


Miami, Dolphin Stadium (75k)


Most of these stadiums were built with soccer in mind, which includes detachable stands in order to incorporate the larger soccer field. Most of these stadiums have held FIFA sanctioned matches like the CONCOCAF Gold Cup. This doesn't account of the numerous stadiums in their planning stages that will probably be build before 2022.

The USA has no shortage of WC soccer-capable stadiums.
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Old July 8th, 2008, 12:42 PM   #3753
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Where are photos of football mode? The only case is Gillette Stadium, but do you see that it has more than 8.5 meters at all points of sidelines?

Don't say that those stadias have held FIFA-sanctioned matches, so they won't have dimensional problems. Worldcup is not like any of continental championships or matches controlled by each confederation. Even if they are sanctioned by FIFA, stadium requirements of each confederation are not exactly same with those of FIFA. For example, UEFA requires that stadiums hosting European football championship have at least 6 meters on the sides, 7.5 meters on the ends, but FIFA requires 8.5 meters on the sides, 10 meters on the ends!

hngcm, don't be so sure about the matter Do you know what dimensions those stadiums had for playing pitch and auxiliary area around it when they hosted, as you called, FIFA santioned matches?
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Old July 8th, 2008, 02:33 PM   #3754
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Originally Posted by Index_LT View Post
The reason i wouldn't like USA to host WC is it's time zone. If the game is played at casual time, it would be broadcasted at late night here in Europe (Largest football market). You know that noone watches recordings here. It wouldn't be a problem if the game is played at the mid of day, but you must get air condisioned stadiums. I would go for Qatar. Time zone is OK and they could afford to get all their stadiums air condisioned.

p.s. In US noone play nor watches football. You will have to wait untill you get latino majority.
Actually if you had been bothered to do little bit of research, you would have realized that when The United States last hosted the World Cup the kick off times were arranged to play for the European TV market. An example the opening match between Germany and Bolivia kicked off in Chicago at 2.05pm Central Daylight Time (the time in Chicago), this would have been 9.05pm in Germany and most of Europe, and 4.05pm in Bolivia. In fact many of the matches kicked off at around mid day (including the final) so to fit for the appropriate TV market. I would expect that if America were to host again, it would use a similar kick off time structure.

To your second comment that nobody plays football in the USA,.... well again you didn't do your research, over 20 million Americans play football. And as for them not watching, during the 2002 world cup when I was living in New York, I recall many times their being huge queues of people going around the block at 6am to get into the sports bars to watch the games before work!
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Old July 8th, 2008, 06:02 PM   #3755
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Can we all please put a few things to rest...

- No matter where the WC is held, some audience is going to be screwed by the game times! But assuming we're all fans, we make it work out and FIFA knows this. The host isn't selected with the intention of p***ing off one continent or the other.

- In lieu of the above, please stop insinuating the time zone issue is solely a "USA" problem. It would apply for any games held in Mexico or Latin America, and it will be realized when Brazil hosts, albeit not as egregiously.

- Regarding Asia's huge population: Uh, yeah, we get it. But until we hear that FIFA is mandating a certain year for an Asian WC then this is a non-issue, because if Asia doesn't get the WC in '18 or '22, chances are they'll get one of the next two. It's not as if these will be the last games ever played.

Similarly, fans for a US bid needn't panic if they miss out as the Americas will get their chance in due time as well.

- Anyone being pithy about US stadiums is simply being that - pithy. Unless I've missed it the US Soccer Association has not yet made their bid official, but they have confirmed the nation has more than enough stadium that meet FIFA requirements that have also expressed an interest in hosting, including most NFL facilities. They're in an exploratory phase right now to determine the bid feasibility, comparison against other potential bids, etc. Bottom line, maybe not all of the new NFL stadiums will be included, but enough will be available for the bid to be top rate.
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Old July 8th, 2008, 06:37 PM   #3756
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Why don't you list up and show us the stadiums which definately seem to have more than 8.5 meters on the sides in association football configuration?
Carrerra, no one cares about your anti americanism agenda anymore...give up
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Old July 8th, 2008, 06:38 PM   #3757
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The world doesn't revolve around USA either. As for spreading football out, China or India would be much more attractive choice than USA to FIFA in terms of growth potential.
i never said the world revolves around us ya big goof...i just said it doenst revolve around europe
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Old July 8th, 2008, 06:41 PM   #3758
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Originally Posted by Carrerra View Post
Where are photos of football mode? The only case is Gillette Stadium, but do you see that it has more than 8.5 meters at all points of sidelines?

Don't say that those stadias have held FIFA-sanctioned matches, so they won't have dimensional problems. Worldcup is not like any of continental championships or matches controlled by each confederation. Even if they are sanctioned by FIFA, stadium requirements of each confederation are not exactly same with those of FIFA. For example, UEFA requires that stadiums hosting European football championship have at least 6 meters on the sides, 7.5 meters on the ends, but FIFA requires 8.5 meters on the sides, 10 meters on the ends!

hngcm, don't be so sure about the matter Do you know what dimensions those stadiums had for playing pitch and auxiliary area around it when they hosted, as you called, FIFA santioned matches?
there are not photos of soccer mode, but it doesnt matter...they all have been designed to host it when the time comes
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Old July 8th, 2008, 06:51 PM   #3759
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there are not photos of soccer mode, but it doesnt matter...they all have been designed to host it when the time comes
Keep dreaming until you die
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Old July 8th, 2008, 06:55 PM   #3760
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Keep dreaming until you die
carrerra, you dont know anything about this country...i live here, and am a stadium enthusiast like everyone else. I keep an eye out for these things. I follow stadium development. Why are you arguing with me? I know for a fact that those stadiums have been designed to host international soccer. This is not an arguable point, and the fact that you continue to do just shows you cant admit to being wrong.
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