daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > World Forums > Stadiums and Sport Arenas

Stadiums and Sport Arenas » Completed | Under Construction | Proposed | Demolished



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


View Poll Results: Which bid should host the FIFA World Cup 2018 / 2022?
Australia - 2018 255 12.32%
Belgium / Netherlands - 2018 247 11.94%
England - 2018 538 26.00%
Indonesia - 2018 68 3.29%
Japan - 2018 35 1.69%
Mexico - 2018 105 5.07%
Qatar - 2018 78 3.77%
Russia - 2018 279 13.48%
South Korea - 2018 16 0.77%
Spain / Portugal - 2018 267 12.90%
USA - 2018 116 5.61%
Australia - 2022 378 18.27%
Belgium / Netherlands - 2022 111 5.36%
England - 2022 114 5.51%
Indonesia - 2022 122 5.90%
Japan - 2022 37 1.79%
Mexico - 2022 149 7.20%
Qatar - 2022 153 7.39%
Russia - 2022 148 7.15%
South Korea - 2022 23 1.11%
Spain / Portugal - 2022 184 8.89%
USA - 2022 249 12.03%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 2069. You may not vote on this poll

Closed Thread

 
Thread Tools
Old July 12th, 2008, 10:36 AM   #3781
Joop20
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 610
Likes (Received): 4

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skyline_FFM View Post
We are talking about a distant future! And until then, football may be promoted in Canada. Is China a football nation? Or South Korea? They had nothing to do with football some decades ago, but they are more and more intersted...
Canada has only 2 or 3 stadiums that are suitable for a world cup at the moment, and they have only 1 team in the MLS.

It's really going to have to change its sporting leagues if it ever wants to get on a WC level stadium wise. There are probably many ways of growing the CFL beyond the 8 cities that are in it now. Regarding soccer, they either have to set up their own professional soccer league and stop being so dependent on the USA for their sport leagues, or they get more teams in the MLS.
Joop20 no está en línea  

Sponsored Links
Old July 12th, 2008, 10:59 AM   #3782
Skyline_FFM
Atheism rulez!
 
Skyline_FFM's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Here in the middle of nowhere
Posts: 3,388
Likes (Received): 109

In other words: Canadians aren't even interested in changing the situation. What a pitty. Would like to see a WC in Canada, which has so many great cities to show!
__________________
Ziss Iss Mei Sicknetscha
Skyline_FFM no está en línea  
Old July 12th, 2008, 11:40 AM   #3783
hngcm
Registered User
 
hngcm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: San Diego
Posts: 1,644
Likes (Received): 20

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobH View Post
More important to the future in FIFA's eyes would be China, just because their population is almost 20 times that of Australia's; I think even most Australians would agree with that.
Try 62x Australia's population.
hngcm no está en línea  
Old July 12th, 2008, 12:16 PM   #3784
woozoo
Registered User
 
woozoo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 800
Likes (Received): 185

Quote:
Well then, why does it return to Europe every 8 or every 12 years? Why should it return to Asia 16 or 20 years? Why is that acceptable for Asia, but 28 years is too 'soon' for the USA? Your reasoning does NOT compute.; but your 'bias' does.
Ummmm, the USA is one country, you are mentioning continents.

On Europe,
Firstly, and most importantly, Europe is where the overwhelming majority of FIFA's tv money comes from. 500 million rich people who all watch the sport compared to 300 million rich people which only a percentage watch the game.
Secondly, UEFA has 13 teams participating in the world cup, thats over a third, by rights they should get to host every third cup.
Thirdly, Europe is the main bread basket of football, the 6 biggest leagues, the most support, the most money.

On Asia vs USA:
If another CONCACAF country could host the cup, it may have had a stronger chance, but no such country exists. Canada has no facilities. Mexico has already hosted twice, and has many other problems.
South America had to wait 36 years from 1978 Argentina to 2014 Brazil despite having 2 of the best football nations in the world and incredible support for the game. If a continent does not have adequate hosts, then it has to wait.

28 years is too soon for USA.
The MLS is shit. It barely rates a mention on highlight shows and in the news. Soccer is the fifth sport after football, hockey, basketball and baseball. USA does not have entrenched support for the game.
USA national team is poor, especially when compared to the countries which have hosted the cup twice (Italy, France, England, Brazil have all won at least once, Like ive said, Mexico only got it twice because of default the second time.)




So, enough about USA.

Who will win out of China vs Australia?

This is the way I see it.

Stadiums:


China:
Currently all have a running track around them, disapproved of by FIFA.
Could probably build several new rectangular stadiums, but the Chinese league has very very small attendances (top teams average several tens of thousands, middle teams between 3 - 8 thousand, bottom teams around 1 thousand), so FIFA may disapprove of new stadiums getting built which will sit empty after the cup.

Australia:
Has several purpose built rectangular stadiums, but several are in the same city, which will mean they cannot be used unless the 1 stadium per city rule is waived - unlikely.
Many of its larger stadiums are oval shaped, and despite having movable seating, are not preferred by FIFA.
Building big stadiums in small towns such as Townsville with projected population of 200,000 may not be viable.

China's pros:

FIFA wants to grow the sport in the biggest nation in the world. There is MASSIVE room to grow in China. This is extremely important in my view.

China's cons:

Pollution - Very bad in some cities. Australian Olympic team is not participating in opening ceremony so that athletes spend as little time as possible in Beijing due to pollution. This problem may be even bigger in the future.]

National team is worse than Australian (ranked 10 in Asia).

National league is dismal. Totally corrupt and fixed.

Altitude of some venues.

VISA problems for visitors. Visitors to the 2008 Olympics are having trouble obtaining Visas to attend the game. This would seriously have to be fixed for China to host the world cup.

Tibet issue. May flare up again. I recently read of an ethnic Tibetan, British citizen being arrested and deported from China after living in Beijing legally for two years. She was arrested on her way to work, taken to her house, allowed to pack one suitcase, her passport and mobile phone were taken, and she was taken by convoy to the airport, put on a plane and sent to London. Such crack downs on civil liberties would be frowned upon by FIFA.

Australia's pros:
Better fan atmosphere, more touristy, more civil liberties.
Has hosted many international sporting events in various parts of the country.
Overall I can imagine Australia hosting a better world cup, with a better atmosphere for the several million traveling fans. This is still important to FIFA. They do not want the world cup to turn solely into a promotion tool. FIFA wants its world cups to be enjoyable for the players, spectators and viewers alike.

Australia's cons:
New stadiums need to be built. Their viability is questionable. How many times would a 40,000 seat stadium be filled in a city of 300,000 residents?

Can some of the smaller cities host so many touring fans?

Is Australia's public transport infrastructure capable of moving several million visitors?




As you can see, i pretty much think that Australia would host a better world cup. I think it would be be much more enjoyable for the touring fans, and overall would have a better atmosphere. I also think staging the cup in Australia would be less risky. China still has many problems in terms of pollution, civil liberties and the like. How Chinese police would react to millions of (drunk) traveling Europeans used to their rights is questionable.

However, this does not mean it will get the cup. There is so much potential of football in China, FIFA may have too much to gain from hosting the cup in China.
woozoo no está en línea  
Old July 12th, 2008, 01:08 PM   #3785
Kuvvaci
Strange User
 
Kuvvaci's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Istanbul
Posts: 19,708
Likes (Received): 64

wonderful post
Kuvvaci no está en línea  
Old July 12th, 2008, 02:51 PM   #3786
theespecialone
Top
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 309
Likes (Received): 0

India also has potential

too bad that they're sooooo crap at football
theespecialone no está en línea  
Old July 12th, 2008, 06:26 PM   #3787
rover3
BANNED
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 562
Likes (Received): 2

uhmmm. woozoo...as I posted previously but either you missed or purposely played 'blind' to...

"Well, think about it. Mexico's already had it twice. Canada's soccer prowess? Uhmmm, I think 2 or 3 Caribbean/Central American nations could beat them by a mile. But no Carib/Central American nation that can handle WC sporting demands, comes to mind.

So, realistically, it's only the US can logistically, sportingly, and financially handle a WC the way it is today. So, why even beat around the bush? "

As for Mexico's hosting a 2nd time by default --so what? The fact and records still indicate that the 1986 WOrld Cup was played in Mexico. The 'default' thing DOES NOT take that away from history.

So you say about a weak US team? Well, what about China? Australia? Enough about China and Australia.

Anyway, your 'bias' is still blatantly showing.

And yours is only 1 opinion. Our is equally valid, if not more so, than yours. So let me say you ARE WRONG!!

Last edited by rover3; July 12th, 2008 at 06:32 PM.
rover3 no está en línea  
Old July 13th, 2008, 01:52 AM   #3788
Kuvvaci
Strange User
 
Kuvvaci's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Istanbul
Posts: 19,708
Likes (Received): 64

China or Australia will get it!
Kuvvaci no está en línea  
Old July 13th, 2008, 03:32 AM   #3789
Overground
Registered User
 
Overground's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Vancouver BC
Posts: 1,594
Likes (Received): 125

Part of the problem in regards to Canada hosting is infrastructure. Canada's main sport is ice hockey and arguably the best in the world at it, with the best facilities for that sport. The problem is that they are covered ice hockey arenas that hold 20k people, and we've got heaps of those to boot. The money that goes into this sport kills on anything else. Canada's other traditionally main sport is Canadian football or CFL. Unfortunately due to cost, most or all of these stadia are old and need replacing or completely refurbished. Not an impossible task though.


The thing about Australia, a smaller country then Canada by a third in population is their main sports are grass sports obviously and their stadia can support cricket, rugby, football - oblong and round, and rugby. Cut most of those in half and replace them with ice rinks and you get the idea.

Football is very popular in Canada and the sport maintains the most registered players than any other. Football in Canada is competing with mainly ice hockey, CFL, basketball, American grid-iron, and everything else under the sun. But the interest is there especially with the popularity of Toronto FC. It's just going to take awhile for it to get bigger.
Overground no está en línea  
Old July 13th, 2008, 08:23 AM   #3790
rover3
BANNED
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 562
Likes (Received): 2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuvvaci View Post
China or Australia will get it!
Yeah, in 2026 or 2030!!
rover3 no está en línea  
Old July 13th, 2008, 11:44 AM   #3791
theespecialone
Top
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 309
Likes (Received): 0

no, rover3, they will get the world cup in 2022.
theespecialone no está en línea  
Old July 13th, 2008, 12:10 PM   #3792
Kuvvaci
Strange User
 
Kuvvaci's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Istanbul
Posts: 19,708
Likes (Received): 64

Quote:
Originally Posted by rover3 View Post
Yeah, in 2026 or 2030!!
why? the logical resul is China or australia for 2022

read the post of woozoo once more please. You can understand better.
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpo...4&postcount=80
Kuvvaci no está en línea  
Old July 13th, 2008, 12:23 PM   #3793
woozoo
Registered User
 
woozoo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 800
Likes (Received): 185

Quote:
Kuvvaci wonderful post
Thanks

Quote:
As for Mexico's hosting a 2nd time by default --so what? The fact and records still indicate that the 1986 WOrld Cup was played in Mexico. The 'default' thing DOES NOT take that away from history.
You don't understand. Maybe I didn't make myself clear. I will explain again.
Yes, Mexico held it twice, therefore the records indicate it held it twice. Thats why it won't get it for a very very long time to come.
The reason I mentioned it was by default was because Mexico held the cup twice with a space of 16 years. The only reason Mexico could hold the cup twice in such a short period of time was because it was by default.
Quote:
So you say about a weak US team? Well, what about China? Australia? Enough about China and Australia.
Come on man, this is not rocket science. China and Australia would be hosting the cup for the first time, not the second like the US.
FIFA has given the hosting privileges to weaker countries in the past: South Africa, Japan/Korea, Columbia, Sweden.
It has only awarded the cup to powerful football antions a second time.

Quote:
Anyway, your 'bias' is still blatantly showing.
So is yours. At least I'm being realistic and am backing up my arguments with facts.

Quote:
And yours is only 1 opinion. Our is equally valid, if not more so, than yours. So let me say you ARE WRONG!!
Your "plural" opinion? Is there 2 or 3 of you sitting behind that computer screen putting your heads together to rebut my arguments?
How is your opinion more valid?





I have had a look at Canada's stadiums. Like you said, not enough grass pitch stadiums that have the capacity. Also, not enough demand for those stadiums. Grass pitch sports don't have the spectator following needed in Canada. Canada could probably build them, but FIFA wouldn't allow it if they stay empty after the cup.
woozoo no está en línea  
Old July 13th, 2008, 12:37 PM   #3794
CiudadanoDelMundo
Ahí vamos pa´lante
 
CiudadanoDelMundo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Canary Islands
Posts: 256
Likes (Received): 3

I absolutely agree with woozoo's posts
__________________
El mundo es tan grande y uno tan pequeño...
CiudadanoDelMundo no está en línea  
Old July 13th, 2008, 01:02 PM   #3795
Benjuk
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 920
Likes (Received): 2

Best change for Australia would be if FIFA were to relax the rule on the number of stadia per city... If Sydney, Brisbane and Melbourne were each allowed 2 stadiums, with Perth and Adelaide chipping in one each, then they'd only need one more (probably Newcastle, which is already being extended), or maybe a heavilly revamped Aussie Stadium in Canberra.

Unfortunately, this doesn't match up to FIFA's desire to 'spread the game either geographically (no stadium in North Queensland, the NT, or Tassie), or in terms of stadium developement, or in terms of Australia's limited population.

I doubt that there's any question, even in the most anti-Aussie minds, that the country itself would be excellent hosts for the finals (so long as faclities are in place).
Benjuk no está en línea  
Old July 13th, 2008, 03:46 PM   #3796
Kuvvaci
Strange User
 
Kuvvaci's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Istanbul
Posts: 19,708
Likes (Received): 64

I don't think FIFA will change its rules.
Kuvvaci no está en línea  
Old July 13th, 2008, 03:54 PM   #3797
Iain1974
Registered User
 
Iain1974's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Longvieew
Posts: 950
Likes (Received): 0

I doubt FIFA will change their rules for the convenience of one nation of 20M who have a minimal interest in football. If that make them 'anti-Aussie' then so be it.
Iain1974 no está en línea  
Old July 13th, 2008, 03:58 PM   #3798
Kuvvaci
Strange User
 
Kuvvaci's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Istanbul
Posts: 19,708
Likes (Received): 64

not only for this. If FIFA will give the WC to Australia they will want the interest to football in australia must be increase. And for this FIFA wants a nation wide tournement.
Kuvvaci no está en línea  
Old July 13th, 2008, 04:38 PM   #3799
www.sercan.de
Galatasaray SK
 
www.sercan.de's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Istanbul
Posts: 27,950
Likes (Received): 2717

As rover said, after 2010 and 2014 again (2022) a WC in the Southern hemisphere?

But i would prefer Australia before USA and China.
__________________
International titles of Galatasaray SK
UEFA Europa League (1): 2000
UEFA Super Cup (1): 2000

ULEB Eurocup (1): 2016

FIBA EuroLeague Women (1): 2014
FIBA EuroCup Women (1): 2009

IWBF Champions Cup (5): 2008, 2009, 2011, 2013, 2014
IWBF André Vergauwen Cup (1): 2017
IWBF Intercontinental Cup (4): 2008, 2009, 2011, 2012

EJU Golden League (1): 2014
www.sercan.de no está en línea  
Old July 14th, 2008, 12:58 AM   #3800
Benjuk
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 920
Likes (Received): 2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iain1974 View Post
I doubt FIFA will change their rules for the convenience of one nation of 20M who have a minimal interest in football. If that make them 'anti-Aussie' then so be it.
Don't missunderstand me, I'm not saying that FIFA not changing the rules, or people preferring other venues, is 'anti-Aussie', all I'm saying is that few would deny that IF the finals were awarded to Oz, it would do a great job.

I'm also not suggesting that FIFA should change the rules - merely saying that the best chance Aussie would have would be if the rules were changed... I simply can't see us getting it any other way - there are too many other countries who can meet the required standards more effectively.

I'm not anti-Aussie, or pro-Aussie, just very realistic. Which is why I still believe it will be England in 2018, followed by either China or the USA in 2022, with 2026 being in somewhere like Argentina (unless FIFA change the rules again in order to have 2026 in Europe and free up 2030 for Uruguay/Argentina).
Benjuk no está en línea  


Closed Thread

Tags
australia, united states of america, world cup

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 10:42 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

Hosted by Blacksun, dedicated to this site too!
Forum server management by DaiTengu