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View Poll Results: Which bid should host the FIFA World Cup 2018 / 2022?
Australia - 2018 255 12.32%
Belgium / Netherlands - 2018 247 11.94%
England - 2018 538 26.00%
Indonesia - 2018 68 3.29%
Japan - 2018 35 1.69%
Mexico - 2018 105 5.07%
Qatar - 2018 78 3.77%
Russia - 2018 279 13.48%
South Korea - 2018 16 0.77%
Spain / Portugal - 2018 267 12.90%
USA - 2018 116 5.61%
Australia - 2022 378 18.27%
Belgium / Netherlands - 2022 111 5.36%
England - 2022 114 5.51%
Indonesia - 2022 122 5.90%
Japan - 2022 37 1.79%
Mexico - 2022 149 7.20%
Qatar - 2022 153 7.39%
Russia - 2022 148 7.15%
South Korea - 2022 23 1.11%
Spain / Portugal - 2022 184 8.89%
USA - 2022 249 12.03%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 2069. You may not vote on this poll

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Old November 22nd, 2010, 02:01 AM   #8541
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gondolier View Post
Duh! Who will buy the tickets? Who will buy the mascots, the souvenirs, the T-shirts, etc., that will pay for the event? WHo will man the venues and the operations? Duh!

Not unless you want every citizen to be TAXED directly to pay for the event? If INDIA could not fill its recent Commonwealth Games venues, then what more a 25 million market vs. a 310-million market (the USA)?
This is Australia. Entice the population with some alcohol and you can get 120,000 people to turn up to see horses run around and get every woman to wear a funny hat in the process.

We even have a public holiday for the sole purpose of allowing people to attend said sporting event. The AFL Grand Final is also treated as an unofficial public holiday (in the AFL-watching states anyway) and some businesses will shut down for the day. I don't think you'll ever struggle to fill seats for a major sporting event in this country.
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 02:49 AM   #8542
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I can't believe someone was stupid enough to suggest Australia wouldn't fill stadiums.
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 02:54 AM   #8543
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This really does not mean to sound derogatory or generalising in anyway, but I'm not even joking when I say every Australian I have ever met always starts the conversation about some sporting event we (England or Britain) are either playing them in, or are terrible in. One time I was studying in America for a year, I bumped into an Australian at a party, out of a hundred people I bump into an Aussie, first thing he asks is "So looking forward to the Ashes?".

Australia will have no problem selling tickets.
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 06:37 AM   #8544
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gondolier View Post
Duh! Who will buy the tickets? Who will buy the mascots, the souvenirs, the T-shirts, etc., that will pay for the event? WHo will man the venues and the operations? Duh!

Not unless you want every citizen to be TAXED directly to pay for the event? If INDIA could not fill its recent Commonwealth Games venues, then what more a 25 million market vs. a 310-million market (the USA)?
Tourists?
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 06:42 AM   #8545
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Correct Matthew
Australia=SPORT
Live it,breathe it
Its said we'd turn up in our thousands for the opening of an envelope
I just can't see the World Cup not being completely sold out in Australia-100%
Had the highest crowd ave in stage 3 of WCQ for all of Asia and in Stage 4 we were a close 3rd but only because we Qualified so early
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 09:02 AM   #8546
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Will737 View Post
I can't believe someone was stupid enough to suggest Australia wouldn't fill stadiums.
FOOL! You think Oz would be the only one to fill their stadia? World Cup 1994 still STANDS as the BEST ATTENDED World Cup bar none. It had like a 93% attendance. And that was with ONLY 24 teams. What can Oz brag about that EVEN COMES CLOSE TO THAT? How can 25 million COMPARE to 310 million??? DUH!! Why do you think they ask about population bases in the bid books??

And the Eval Report points out that Oz will bring SIGNIFICANTLY LOWER TV revenues from Europe and North America because of your location? But of course, you are all ostriches that bury your head in the sand and dismiss this point. Well, that's why you're all here and NOT on the Executive Committee.
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 09:13 AM   #8547
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Originally Posted by Gondolier View Post
FOOL! You think Oz would be the only one to fill their stadia? World Cup 1994 still STANDS as the BEST ATTENDED World Cup bar none. It had like a 93% attendance. And that was with ONLY 24 teams. What can Oz brag about that EVEN COMES CLOSE TO THAT? How can 25 million COMPARE to 310 million??? DUH!! Why do you think they ask about population bases in the bid books??

And the Eval Report points out that Oz will bring SIGNIFICANTLY LOWER TV revenues from Europe and North America because of your location? But of course, you are all ostriches that bury your head in the sand and dismiss this point. Well, that's why you're all here and NOT on the Executive Committee.
no-one has said the USA will not fill the stadiums, they are responding to your claim that an Australian WC would have empty ones
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 09:15 AM   #8548
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The stands will be full either in the USA or in OZ.

What matters more are the TV revenues.

OZ supporters say that there will be higher revenues due to whole "asian WC" thing, USA supporters say they'll be lower TV revenues in NA/Europe.

Not sure who'll be right in the end.
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 09:23 AM   #8549
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Europe and the Americas will be worth more, that ain't changing in 12 years but the gap is closing. By how much in that time, God knows.
Still Europe to the Americas is a wider timezone spread than what Australia is talking about in East Asia and Australia like South Korea and Japan can still provide comfortable morning viewing to Europe.

Last edited by Walbanger; November 22nd, 2010 at 11:59 AM.
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 09:30 AM   #8550
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Originally Posted by hngcm View Post
The stands will be full either in the USA or in OZ.

What matters more are the TV revenues.

OZ supporters say that there will be higher revenues due to whole "asian WC" thing, USA supporters say they'll be lower TV revenues in NA/Europe.

Not sure who'll be right in the end.
esp when you have the two emerging issues of the growing middle class of Asia and the movement of broadcasting from traditional means

trying to predict what the rights will be worth in 12 years, let alone how the images will be transmitted is like trying to nail jelly to the wall
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 09:43 AM   #8551
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T74 View Post
esp when you have the two emerging issues of the growing middle class of Asia and the movement of broadcasting from traditional means

trying to predict what the rights will be worth in 12 years, let alone how the images will be transmitted is like trying to nail jelly to the wall
These things can be calculated exponentially. And it's NOT like Oz is going to ALL OF A SUDDEN absorb 75 million Chinese refugees who will then watch all 64 Games of a 2022 World Cup.

Now, would a Ghana v. Paraguay first-round game in Perth really sell out? Hey, I got a bridge in the San Francisco Bay Area to sell ya.
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 09:54 AM   #8552
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hngcm View Post
OZ supporters say that there will be higher revenues due to whole "asian WC" thing, USA supporters say they'll be lower TV revenues in NA/Europe.

Not sure who'll be right in the end.
Well the television contracts will be negotiated for 2018/2022 at the same time, which means that discussions will have to happen within the next 4-5 years. Highly doubtful we see the massive shift in Asia that the Oz bid is predicting will occur in that time span. Very thin argument. Reading the reports, I'll have to lean towards FIFA's skepticism of the television rights situation for that bid.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Walbanger View Post
Europe and the Americas will be worth more, that ain't changing in 12 years but the get is closing. By how much in that time, God knows.
Still Europe to the Americas is a wider timezone spread than what Australia is talking about in East Asia and Australia like South Korea and Japan can still provide comfortable morning viewing to Europe.
Comfortable? Did you see the television ratings in Europe for 2002?
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 09:58 AM   #8553
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gondolier View Post
These things can be calculated exponentially. And it's NOT like Oz is going to ALL OF A SUDDEN absorb 75 million Chinese refugees who will then watch all 64 Games of a 2022 World Cup.

Now, would a Ghana v. Paraguay first-round game in Perth really sell out? Hey, I got a bridge in the San Francisco Bay Area to sell ya.
we won't need 100 million here to sell out the stadium, look at our history with Olympics and CWG and you will see that Australian's do attend international sport in high numbers. Still remember I couldn't even get tickets for the badminton finals for my wife (and we don't give a stuff about that sport here)
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 10:05 AM   #8554
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Now, would a Ghana v. Paraguay first-round game in Perth really sell out? Hey, I got a bridge in the San Francisco Bay Area to sell ya.
Yes, it would actually because just like at the Olympic games and just like it was at the rugby world cup, when even nations such as Uruguay and Georgia, sold out, the world cup games, will sell out because at the moment, Australia gets almost zero decent football (other than a few socceroos games once in a blue moon and an odd visit from david beckham once every six years) and people in Australia love their sport. They don't care what it is, as long as it's top class sport and the world cup is the best there is. Australia's population is also booming and most of those coming in are immigrants and they definitely love football plus the game has so many juniors playing it that they cannot find enough grounds for them, so by 2022 I think that the Australian bid committee would have no problem in pretty much selling out the whole event. Where as the US has zero chance in becoming a football nation, Australia has every chance, that is the key difference here, they just need the best in football to show them in their country and the best of football, is the WORLD CUP.
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 10:13 AM   #8555
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Comfortable? Did you see the television ratings in Europe for 2002?
**News Flash** It's a WORLD CUP not European Cup..... I'm sure Europe will survive one tournament where the timezones aren't favourable for them.

Time to move on old chap, your argument is getting boring.
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 10:19 AM   #8556
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the issue of Euro tv rights cannot be discounted. yes the landscape is moving, but Euro will still be a massive chunk of change.

Slippery is right though that the timing will be critical to determining any value
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 10:41 AM   #8557
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I realise that but it is after all, the World Cup & not European Cup.
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 10:51 AM   #8558
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This is not a dismissal of the Oz bid by any stretch. But it certainly doesn't behoove one to ignore several critical issues for the sake of nationalistic loyalty that I have seen from many of you. It's obvious that the US bid is the superior bid from virtually every technical standpoint, but technical merit is hardly the only consideration in awarding a tournament, nor should it be.

Spreading the game around the world is certainly a noble idea, and this tournament would certainly be valuable for the development of the game in Australia, but I am still quite skeptical of the tournament to do anything of the sort for the Asian market. A 'first-time continent' may sound nice in theory, but if we're being objective, it's not like we're talking about bringing the tournament to a continent like Africa. After all, this island 'continent' of 25 million is smaller than Tokyo or Seoul alone.

If I was FIFA and truly concerned about making significant, long-lasting in-roads in Asia, waiting four years really shouldn't matter very much; the population centers you need to be reaching are in China, Japan, Korea, India, or Indonesia. If it can't be China, I think a joint India/Indonesia bid in the vain of 2002 would be fantastic and very feasible by 2026.
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 10:54 AM   #8559
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the issue of Euro tv rights cannot be discounted. yes the landscape is moving, but Euro will still be a massive chunk of change.

Slippery is right though that the timing will be critical to determining any value
FIFA overestimated the love of the world cup in European markets for that world cup. The timing was set up poorly by Japan/South Korea, which was one of the reasons why FIFA were annoyed at both Japan and South Korea at the end of it. They thought that Europe would view the world cup at almost any time, as Asia is forced to at the moment, they were wrong. Although the total amount of viewers were more for the 2002 edition of the world cup than both the European editions in 1998 and 2006 thanks to the fact that Asia almost tripled the European viewing audience. Since then Asia has become the biggest viewing audience for the world cup consistently and they are growing. Australia will not have such a major problem because with the European time zone anyway, firstly the European market is going to be looked after at the 2022 world cup (where as it was an after thought for the 2002 edition) and secondly Australia has a much wider and more appropriate European time range than Japan or South Korea. A game in Perth will have almost 3 hours difference in time compared with that of Sydney or Brisbane.
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 11:02 AM   #8560
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This is not a dismissal of the Oz bid by any stretch. But it certainly doesn't behoove one to ignore several critical issues for the sake of nationalistic loyalty that I have seen from many of you. It's obvious that the US bid is the superior bid from virtually every technical standpoint, but technical merit is hardly the only consideration in awarding a tournament, nor should it be.

Spreading the game around the world is certainly a noble idea, and this tournament would certainly be valuable for the development of the game in Australia, but I am still quite skeptical of the tournament to do anything of the sort for the Asian market. A 'first-time continent' may sound nice in theory, but if we're being objective, it's not like we're talking about bringing the tournament to a continent like Africa. After all, this island 'continent' of 25 million is smaller than Tokyo or Seoul alone.

If I was FIFA and truly concerned about making significant, long-lasting in-roads in Asia, waiting four years really shouldn't matter very much; the population centers you need to be reaching are in China, Japan, Korea, India, or Indonesia. If it can't be China, I think a joint India/Indonesia bid in the vain of 2002 would be fantastic and very feasible by 2026.
Joint India/Indonesia bid You and Gondolier are on some serious crack. FIFA has to develop both China and India's football markets before they are able to even comprehend hosting a world cup, how can they achieve this? By hosting the world cup in Australia and giving prime time coverage of the world cup in India and China. Asia has had to cope with bad timings for television for the 2006 edition, 2010 edition, 2014 brazil will be the same (it's in the american time zone), 2018 bad time zone again, FIFA can't ignore Asia for five consecutive world cups and hope to develop the game in both of these Asian giants. Australia is a fantastic country who is an upcoming footballing power, they have developed their own professional league and they require a world cup to develop their national league and make football the number one sport in the nation. They have fantastic tourist destinations, the best developed economy at the moment, a fantastic legacy for the sport and they would be a safe destination for the world cup.
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