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Old January 3rd, 2008, 02:46 AM   #3541
Ebola
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WTC RISING


Another section rising:



The below grade areas are rising and coming together quickly:

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Old January 3rd, 2008, 09:25 AM   #3542
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Nice to finally see bits popping up above street level.
I hope to see some hight at last for 2008
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Old January 3rd, 2008, 05:35 PM   #3543
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a recent one from the spire?

I found this on SSP!



was this one posted before?
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Old January 3rd, 2008, 06:22 PM   #3544
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Although i was one of those who preffered the reconstruction of the old wtc, now its very late for something like that, since the f.t has started construction. But i cant say that i dont like the design of the new wtc Its very nice, and im sure that the real thing will look much better than the renderings when it is finished.
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Old January 3rd, 2008, 08:56 PM   #3545
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love the progress. So sad for the missed deadline, I truly hope it won't affect construction too much...
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Old January 3rd, 2008, 09:14 PM   #3546
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i hope construction starts speeding up a bit now
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Old January 3rd, 2008, 11:07 PM   #3547
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mudvayneimn View Post
I think he was talking about Larry Silverstein, just because of the picture posted right after it.

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Old January 4th, 2008, 12:07 AM   #3548
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Here is the article that goes with that shot, and don't attack me for posting it, b/c I am just the messenger.
http://www.nypost.com/seven/01032008...wer_456087.htm
FALTERING TOWER

SLOW GO ON ANTENNA, RENTS

January 3, 2008 -- IT'S good news the Port Authority finished most of the bathtub job at ground zero on time, and that Larry Silverstein will be able to start construction on towers 3 and 4 within a few weeks.

But the 1,776-foot tall Freedom Tower has been largely forgotten in the news blitz. The PA wants us to believe the project is sailing along.

But, the tower's crowning broadcast antenna seems lost in the clouds, with the PA nowhere near a deal on lease terms with TV stations which will transmit from it.

And neither of the ballyhooed office leases with government agencies for 1 million square feet of the project's 2.6 million feet, announced way back in June 2006, has yet been completed.

The good news is that the PA, which owns the $2.9 billion Freedom Tower, and architects Skidmore Owings & Merrill agree on what the antenna will look like. The shaft will constitute the project's top 408 feet.

That design, shown up-close on this page, looks a lot like the one first unveiled in the summer of 2005, when architect David Childs had to redesign the building because of security concerns.

It was suggested at the time that the final antenna design would be more "sculptural" than the original image, and later sketches and models sported various curlicued motifs.

But Childs says those ideas, which exposed the actual antenna to the air, were impractical. "A broadcast antenna is a very technical piece of equipment - it's like designing a hospital operating room," Childs said.

The more open designs would cause "rain to turn to ice, which would break and fall," and also make the antenna impossible to maintain at such a height.

So it was back to the original notion, which called for a top-to-bottom hood enclosing the actual broadcast spire.

The current design, done in consultation with sculptor Ken Snelson, shrouds the antenna in a synthetic material called Ray-dome - "very hard and permanent, but invisible to the broadcast rays that pierce through it," Childs said.

But PA Executive Director Anthony Shorris, asked where negotiations stood with the Metropolitan Broadcast Alliance, a consortium of 13 TV stations, said, "I don't have any news."

In fact, the talks are really bogged down, both over how much rent the stations are willing to pay the PA and by disagreements among the broadcasters themselves.

The negotiations "are complicated because the stations are competitors," Shorris said. "I don't want to diminish how complicated."

Pat Smith, a rep for the TV consortium, said only, "The members remain committed to broadcasting from the top of the Freedom Tower."

Meanwhile, Shorris said a lease for 600,000 square feet with the Federal General Service Administration "is not done. We're still negotiating the long-term escalations over the later years of the lease."

And while a deal with the state Office of General Services for 400,000 feet is signed, "it needs to get final approval in Albany," Shorris said. Meanwhile, the PA has imposed a gag order on Cushman & Wakefield heavy-hitter Tara Stacom and her colleagues who are marketing the rest of the office space.

The PA says steel will begin rising above street level by June. But with construction and material costs escalating almost by the hour, it's unclear whether the job can be completed over five years within budget with out employing "value engi neering" to cheapen the materials and detailing.
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Old January 4th, 2008, 01:13 AM   #3549
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They need to hurry up and "sell" the broadcasting rights. Broadcasting demand throughout the US is dropping. I have a feeling that when the required switch to digital occurs, a lot of people who use rabbit ears will use the excuse of having to swap out equipment to change to cable or satellite based TV. I really can't imagine that airwaves digital will ever be very big. So they need to lock someone into a big contract before the broadcasters decide they don't need more broadcast capacity.
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Old January 4th, 2008, 01:41 AM   #3550
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollie Maea View Post
The antenna on the old tower was a temporary piece attached to the tower. It was not permanent, and if contracts with the broadcasters were rescinded, it would be removed. Since it was not permanent, it did not count in the height.

The new antenna will be integrated in a permanent spire that will be part of the actual structure. It can not be removed, so it will be counted in the height.

Hope this clears it up for you.
Thanks.

However, I still can't fully understand the difference. So the ownership of the antenna makes the whole difference? I.e. if Port Authority had bought the antenna of 1WTC and made it "permanent", it would have been counted in the official height? Maybe Sears Tower can buy its antennas and increase the height to 527 m (past Taipei 101).

It would make more sense to either count the antennas of all buildings, or none. It seems that now they are counted somewhat arbitrarily. The official height of FT should be 417 m or 1WTC should have been 526 m.
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Old January 4th, 2008, 02:16 AM   #3551
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Woah some people need to quit whining. The FT has both a spire and antenna. The antenna is supposed to be inside the spire. That newspaper article picture makes the spire look bigger, which is good. Maybe a few lucky people will be lucky enough to go up in there. It looks like the crown (top) of the building, not including the spire, is still over 1,400 feet tall - taller than the Twins.

It almost looks like a twisting spire.


Last edited by Ebola; January 4th, 2008 at 02:49 AM.
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Old January 4th, 2008, 03:11 AM   #3552
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JR View Post
Thanks.

However, I still can't fully understand the difference. So the ownership of the antenna makes the whole difference? I.e. if Port Authority had bought the antenna of 1WTC and made it "permanent", it would have been counted in the official height? Maybe Sears Tower can buy its antennas and increase the height to 527 m (past Taipei 101).
If the lease for the antennas were canceled on the Sears Tower, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if they replaced them with spires that were actually structurally part of the building. The twin "spires" have become too much of an iconical part of the skyline and it people would hate it without it. No one remembers anymore that until around the late 70s, the Sears Tower looked like this:

http://www.caed.kent.edu//History/Mo...searstower.jpg
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Old January 4th, 2008, 05:04 AM   #3553
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JR View Post
However, I still can't fully understand the difference. So the ownership of the antenna makes the whole difference? I.e. if Port Authority had bought the antenna of 1WTC and made it "permanent", it would have been counted in the official height? Maybe Sears Tower can buy its antennas and increase the height to 527 m (past Taipei 101).
It's not so much the ownership as it is the intent; spires are actual design elements of a building whereas an antenna is simply an addition. In other words putting a spire on a tower is intended to (depending on how you look at it) either add the finishing touch to the design of a tower or cheat to add height to a structure Putting an antenna on a building is simply an easy way for the owner of the antenna to get better range more conveniently; 150m antenna on 400m building as opposed to 550m antenna rising from ground level on valuable realestate in the middle of a city.
If a lease were not renewed on an antenna then it could be removed from a building's roof; a spire as just a spire essentially serves no purpose but to extend the building/complete the design of the building.
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Old January 4th, 2008, 11:23 AM   #3554
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ebola View Post
The antenna is supposed to be inside the spire. That newspaper article picture makes the spire look bigger, which is good. Maybe a few lucky people will be lucky enough to go up in there.
i heard on TV a while ago that the radio waves from sears could kill you, or at least 'fry your brains out'. so if thats true i dont really think you would feel so lucky inside the FT spire
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Old January 4th, 2008, 02:31 PM   #3555
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This actually looks like an antenna, not a spire! It's not free standing like the original design and certainly looks removable. It's even got guy wires to help support it. If this is the final design it'll certainly open up a lot of debate over the actual height of the building! It looks no more permanent or part of the design than the antennas on the Sears tower. Heck, the New York Times article even describes it as an antenna.

To me it just looks like an add on instead of part of the design like the original spire. Not that I was a fan of the original design of the original design.
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Last edited by Msradell; January 4th, 2008 at 02:36 PM. Reason: Edited for clarification
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Old January 4th, 2008, 02:40 PM   #3556
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TalB View Post
http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/..._millions.html
World Trade Center owner to pay millions in fines for missed deadlines

THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

Monday, December 31st 2007, 5:14 PM


Appleton/News

Heavy equipment operates in the pit at Ground Zero during construction of Freedom Tower, as seen from the 32nd floor of the Millenium Hilton hotel.



F. Roberts for News

World Trade Center developer Larry Silverstein


The owner of the World Trade Center site said Monday it is at least a month behind on a deadline to turn over part of the site to a private developer and will pay at least $9 million in fines.

The Port Authority of New York and New Jersey had a Tuesday deadline to excavate foundations for two of five planned office towers at the site and turn the land over to private developer Larry Silverstein, or pay Silverstein $300,000 for every day it was late.

The deadline - and penalties - were worked out last year in a contentious renegotiation of Silverstein's lease that officials said would help speed up long-stalled development at the 16-acre site.

The agency's executive director, Anthony Shorris, said Monday that contractors worked 20-hour-a-day schedules for months and removed 300,000 tons of material so far, but could not finish by the deadline.

"They were ambitious goals. We did our best to meet them," Shorris said. "This is an enormous project. ... I wished we'd be right on schedule."

The agency said it would finish the foundation for one of the planned office towers in two weeks, and the foundation for the next tower two to four weeks later, meaning it will pay Silverstein $9 million to $13.5 million in fines.

Shorris said the job's contractor will not receive a $10 million bonus it was to get if it finished the project on time.

Silverstein spokesman Dara McQuillan said Monday that Silverstein is confident the site will be turned over to him "in the very near future" and said they are prepared to begin building the two towers as soon as the land is made available.

Construction deadlines at the World Trade Center site have changed several times, most notably with the iconic, 1,776-foot Freedom Tower. Once scheduled to open in 2009, its opening was pushed back three years after the tower was redesigned to address security concerns. The Port Authority recently adjusted its timetable for finishing the Sept. 11 memorial it is also building on the site, saying the entire complex, with an underground museum, wouldn't be finished until the 10th anniversary of the 2001 terrorist attacks.
That is the dude who blew up the twin towers!
Get Him!
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Old January 4th, 2008, 04:36 PM   #3557
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Nevermind the old antenna/spire debate, the Moscow "spire" is certainly an interesting way of bumping up the building height.
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Old January 4th, 2008, 05:46 PM   #3558
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Quote:
Originally Posted by germantower View Post
I found this on SSP!

That is one ugly way to top off this building.
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Old January 4th, 2008, 05:53 PM   #3559
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I like the 1WTC's design.
The only thing I would change would be the ring in-between tower and spire.
From far away, this building will look very powerful and the shape of the building is pretty interesting to me.
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Old January 4th, 2008, 05:55 PM   #3560
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Msradell View Post

This actually looks like an antenna, not a spire! It's not free standing like the original design and certainly looks removable. It's even got guy wires to help support it. If this is the final design it'll certainly open up a lot of debate over the actual height of the building! It looks no more permanent or part of the design than the antennas on the Sears tower. Heck, the New York Times article even describes it as an antenna.

To me it just looks like an add on instead of part of the design like the original spire. Not that I was a fan of the original design of the original design.
I'm wonder what the hell they're doing with the spire/antenna. I thought that since all TV broadcasts were becoming digital soon that they wouldn't be putting an antenna on the FT. But they're still trying to get deals with broadcasters, so it's like WTF...
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