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Old August 11th, 2008, 01:47 AM   #5521
backupcoolmen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RKOwens View Post
While I agree it's ridiculous to say it's been a hole in the ground for 8 years (it's been less than 7 years since the attacks!), I believe that excavation of the site took only 8 months with road repairs going on at the same time. If someone wants an idea of the fastest time in which the towers could have possibly been constructed had everything gone perfectly right, just look at the construction of the new WTC7, which opened in May 2006. As with the rest of the site, there was a massive debris pile in its place which had to be excavated, underground infrastructure which had to be repaired (a ConEd station, a subway line), and the design stage of the building itself.

To be fair, the other buildings are all much bigger projects than WTC7, and their designs have changed even though WTC7's remained the same, but it's still depressing just HOW FAR this has pushed the buildings behind WTC7's schedule. 3 years for WTC1 and 5 years for Towers 2-4? Easily. So, yeah, I don't think you can blame the delays on a 4 year excavation/repair period. The reasons for the delays seem more beaurocratic. Larry Silverstein owned the WTC7 site and at least had the determination to get that site redeveloped immediately, whereas the Port Authority owns the main site and is taking forever to hand the east portion over to Silverstein.
i can definitely agree with what you are saying the progress definitely isnt as fast as it should be but isnt it better to have it done slow and right?, the last thing we need is another sep. 11, but the wtc 7 was also very much needed very fast for office space, I think that is why it was built so fast
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Old August 11th, 2008, 02:19 AM   #5522
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RKOwens View Post
While I agree it's ridiculous to say it's been a hole in the ground for 8 years (it's been less than 7 years since the attacks!), I believe that excavation of the site took only 8 months with road repairs going on at the same time. If someone wants an idea of the fastest time in which the towers could have possibly been constructed had everything gone perfectly right, just look at the construction of the new WTC7, which opened in May 2006. As with the rest of the site, there was a massive debris pile in its place which had to be excavated, underground infrastructure which had to be repaired (a ConEd station, a subway line), and the design stage of the building itself.

To be fair, the other buildings are all much bigger projects than WTC7, and their designs have changed even though WTC7's remained the same, but it's still depressing just HOW FAR this has pushed the buildings behind WTC7's schedule. 3 years for WTC1 and 5 years for Towers 2-4? Easily. So, yeah, I don't think you can blame the delays on a 4 year excavation/repair period. The reasons for the delays seem more beaurocratic. Larry Silverstein owned the WTC7 site and at least had the determination to get that site redeveloped immediately, whereas the Port Authority owns the main site and is taking forever to hand the east portion over to Silverstein.
No one died in WTC7 and as far as I know it isn't in the bathtub that needed major repairs after 9/11. I believe that the leasing agreement/insurance for WTC7 was different as well.
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Old August 11th, 2008, 03:28 AM   #5523
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7WTC is a constant reminder of the superiority of private development... Overlooking the mess the city has managed to make.

Larry Silverstein for the win?! Yes.

Still love it.
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Old August 11th, 2008, 03:32 AM   #5524
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meh_cd View Post
No one died in WTC7 and as far as I know it isn't in the bathtub that needed major repairs after 9/11. I believe that the leasing agreement/insurance for WTC7 was different as well.
The biggest difference with WTC7 was that it was done entirely privately without gov't involvement. The other sites and structures have become entangled in governmental bureaucracy in every phase. It's hard to do anything correctly and fast when you have so many opinions involved. I think I read somewhere there are 18 agencies involved in these projects not counting permitting and construction. With that much government involved it will be a miracle if the other buildings are ever finished let alone on schedule and on budget!
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Old August 11th, 2008, 06:59 AM   #5525
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Msradell View Post
The biggest difference with WTC7 was that it was done entirely privately without gov't involvement. The other sites and structures have become entangled in governmental bureaucracy in every phase. It's hard to do anything correctly and fast when you have so many opinions involved. I think I read somewhere there are 18 agencies involved in these projects not counting permitting and construction. With that much government involved it will be a miracle if the other buildings are ever finished let alone on schedule and on budget!
Oh I'm not trying to defend the way the government has handled the site, I agree with you 100%.
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Old August 11th, 2008, 08:24 AM   #5526
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Quote:
wtc 7 was also very much needed very fast for office space, I think that is why it was built so fast
Well, the top 10 floors are still vacant since it was built, so tenants don't seem to be fighting each other over available office space. Though I read an article a while back where it said that a huge surge in demand for downtown office space was expected in 2012 when a lot of company contracts ended then, which would be right around the time that the new buildings open.

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I believe that the leasing agreement/insurance for WTC7 was different as well.
True. The insurers for WTC7 paid up right away and the money was almost enough to cover the full $700 million cost for WTC7. From what I understand, Silverstein has been in court battles with his insurers for the Twin Towers and WTC 4 & 5 for years. Still, I believe the court battles ended in 2006, two years before the PA will have handed over the rest of the east site to Silverstein.
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Old August 11th, 2008, 08:26 AM   #5527
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#7 WTC was redesigned, it was not the original blueprints.

I understand the reasons for the delay, I was just mentioning that this hole in the ground has been there since 2001 (about 8 years now).

Please don't read to much into a factual comment, thanks!
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Old August 11th, 2008, 09:35 AM   #5528
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RKOwens View Post
Well, the top 10 floors are still vacant since it was built, so tenants don't seem to be fighting each other over available office space. Though I read an article a while back where it said that a huge surge in demand for downtown office space was expected in 2012 when a lot of company contracts ended then, which would be right around the time that the new buildings open.
Yeah, it'll fill up sooner rather than later. Wasn't there talk of HSBC moving into the top floors just this past month?

Quote:
True. The insurers for WTC7 paid up right away and the money was almost enough to cover the full $700 million cost for WTC7. From what I understand, Silverstein has been in court battles with his insurers for the Twin Towers and WTC 4 & 5 for years. Still, I believe the court battles ended in 2006, two years before the PA will have handed over the rest of the east site to Silverstein.
Indeed. In fact I think he managed to get the double payout that he wanted by counting the two aircraft as separate incidents. For all intents and purposes the guy is flush with cash and if the government would but-out he'd have this thing moving like a freight train.

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#7 WTC was redesigned, it was not the original blueprints.

I understand the reasons for the delay, I was just mentioning that this hole in the ground has been there since 2001 (about 8 years now).

Please don't read to much into a factual comment, thanks!
The original WTC7 has the dubious honor of being the skyscraper with the shortest lifespan. 14 years.
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Old August 11th, 2008, 09:52 AM   #5529
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Msradell View Post
The biggest difference with WTC7 was that it was done entirely privately without gov't involvement. The other sites and structures have become entangled in governmental bureaucracy in every phase. It's hard to do anything correctly and fast when you have so many opinions involved. I think I read somewhere there are 18 agencies involved in these projects not counting permitting and construction. With that much government involved it will be a miracle if the other buildings are ever finished let alone on schedule and on budget!
Well, you paint with a broad brush there. The WTC site is a big transportation hub and to build on top of it requires a lot of preparation and foundation work. It wasn't just the government that held up work on the site. There was Silverstein, the insurers of the property, AND the government, all of whom did their part to delay construction.

And the state of New York interfered as well, under a REPUBLICAN governor.
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Old August 11th, 2008, 02:50 PM   #5530
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Quote:
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Well, you paint with a broad brush there. The WTC site is a big transportation hub and to build on top of it requires a lot of preparation and foundation work. It wasn't just the government that held up work on the site. There was Silverstein, the insurers of the property, AND the government, all of whom did their part to delay construction.

And the state of New York interfered as well, under a REPUBLICAN governor.
WTC7 had a subway line and a huge ConEd substation to deal with. Silverstein has been ready to get on with it for a long time and is noted elsewhere insurance claims were settled in 2006 in the only applied to Silverstein's side of the work. The PA side of the equation was not delayed because of the insurance issues. And yes, the state government was one of the group of governmental agencies that interfered and delayed the projects.
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Old August 11th, 2008, 04:47 PM   #5531
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Can we please get back on topic
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Old August 11th, 2008, 07:58 PM   #5532
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If I hear another person, call the former WTC a hole in the ground. I'm going to ******* scream, show the people who died in that so called hole some respect. The people who call it a hole, can't be from NYC and have no class what so ever.
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Old August 11th, 2008, 10:33 PM   #5533
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Have somebody high resolution pictures with 300 dpi of New York skyscrapers? It must contain Freedom Tower construction site, WTC Tower 7, Empire State Building, Bank of America Tower, Chrysler Building, New York Times tower, former World Trade Center, Citigroup Center, Trump World Tower, etc + skyline of New York. I need it for my book. Me and publisher will pay for it and for copyrights. Please contact me at [email protected].
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Old August 11th, 2008, 11:14 PM   #5534
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1) Skyscraper170891 Foff with that book, go to NY yourself to take those shots. Do you really think that someone is stupid enough to send such photo's + his bankaccount number to a gmail address

2) There are a lot of new pictures on Rebuild Ground Zero
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Old August 11th, 2008, 11:34 PM   #5535
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why we on about WTC 7 here?
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Old August 12th, 2008, 12:15 AM   #5536
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New Video

http://wtc.com/media/videos/Radii%20...Model%20Makers
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Old August 12th, 2008, 12:19 AM   #5537
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Cool video!!!!!
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Old August 12th, 2008, 12:24 AM   #5538
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Great video!

Thanks for sharing and keep up the great work.
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Old August 12th, 2008, 12:35 AM   #5539
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Quote:
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If I hear another person, call the former WTC a hole in the ground. I'm going to ******* scream, show the people who died in that so called hole some respect. The people who call it a hole, can't be from NYC and have no class what so ever.
Some bad shit happened, and it sucked, but that was almost a decade a go, let's move forward here, and let's not get all tangled up in semantics and decorum.
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Old August 12th, 2008, 03:09 AM   #5540
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Well, we could start calling it a grave. Or a mass grave.

Is that classy? It's a construction site, get over yourself, kingsc.
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