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Old February 4th, 2009, 07:14 PM   #7441
christos-greece
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsc View Post
Just a little pass street level but we'll never make 818 meters, 818 feet now we're talking.
If you talking about Freedom Tower, in feet is more than 1776ft
Also i notice something:
  • 1776ft height of Freedom Tower
  • year 1776 declaration of independence
(?) (?)


btw feet is the official measure of U.S.?
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Old February 4th, 2009, 08:08 PM   #7442
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Quote:
Originally Posted by christos-greece View Post
If you talking about Freedom Tower, in feet is more than 1776ft
Also i notice something:
  • 1776ft height of Freedom Tower
  • year 1776 declaration of independence
(?) (?)


btw feet is the official measure of U.S.?
Americans tend to be kind of stubborn about that kind of thing. It's why our ancestors were were kicked out of all the other countries.
Liebeskind used the 1776 foot height on purpose. It's about the only thing that's survived from his original design. He could have gone for 1776 meters, but it might be hard to build that on a 200 foot base.
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Old February 4th, 2009, 10:56 PM   #7443
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Quote:
Originally Posted by christos-greece View Post
If you talking about Freedom Tower, in feet is more than 1776ft
Also i notice something:
  • 1776ft height of Freedom Tower
  • year 1776 declaration of independence
(?) (?)


btw feet is the official measure of U.S.?
I know how tall FT is. I was saying its going to be taller then 818 feet but shorter then 818 meters it's called a joke.
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Last edited by kingsc; February 4th, 2009 at 11:01 PM.
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Old February 5th, 2009, 01:37 AM   #7444
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Answers to user submitted questions concerning the WTC memorial have been posted at wtcprogress.com:
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Q. It's known that the two Memorial pools will be about five feet shorter than the original Twin Towers footprints on each of the four sides in order to accommodate for below-ground technical reasons. Could you give us some idea what specifically these reasons are, and is the Port Authority considering adding some sort of five-foot-wide colored band or marker to wrap around the pools on the plaza floor in order to mark the exact footprints of the original towers? -- Ryan, Baton Rouge, LA.

A. The reason why the Memorial pools are smaller than the original footprints is due to the re-establishment of Fulton Street through the World Trade Center site. The re-establishment of Fulton and Greenwich streets through the site are part of the plans to move away from the former superblock and toward a more efficient and pedestrian/vehicle-friendly street grid. The pools will be 192 square feet, in contrast to the original tower footprints, which were 211 feet, 10 inches. However, the original tower dimensions will be visible in the bedrock level of the Memorial Museum through the display of the box-column remnants of the towers, which outline each footprint.
So while it's not great news for those concerned about the footprint disparity, at least there will be some recognition of the original size.
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Old February 5th, 2009, 03:21 PM   #7445
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I was trying to answer a question in the "other" forum about the frame, and got into figuring core movement. I know that the frame will distribute the load from whatever it's attached to differently and will also make the cores more shear resistant than regular reinforcing steel where it needs it most, but suspect that the main reason it's there might be to brace the cores to each other without having to pour them as a single unit. You really don't want two cores that high and thin flexing independently.
By placing the connections between cores at the right points you can break up resonances and have a lighter, more sway resistant structure than with a single monolithic core.
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Old February 5th, 2009, 05:30 PM   #7446
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adam-albany View Post
Answers to user submitted questions concerning the WTC memorial have been posted at wtcprogress.com:So while it's not great news for those concerned about the footprint disparity, at least there will be some recognition of the original size.
I'm the one who submitted this question (I'm surprised they actually answered it, since I submitted it to Chris Ward for his Q&A a few months back and he didn't answer it). As this gentleman just confirmed, the reason for the shortening is due to the presense of Fulton Street, which is an unbelievable shame.

In the months following 9/11, we were all concerned with making the best memorial possible, not creating the best stretch of Fulton Street possible. As currently designed, the stretch of Fulton Street which runs between the Freedom Tower and the North Tower pool will be a double-lane one-way street with extra room for parallel parking spots along the front of the Freedom Tower. If they removed the parallel parking spots, they would have about 10 feet of extra room to restore the North Tower pool (and therefore the South Tower pool as well) to its original size and still have room left over. Basically, they're sacrificing memorial space for parking spaces. They're building a parking lot in place of a memorial for the darkest moment in our country's history. Simply unbelievable.
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Old February 5th, 2009, 07:48 PM   #7447
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsc View Post
I know how tall FT is. I was saying its going to be taller then 818 feet but shorter then 818 meters it's called a joke.
I knew that kingsc
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Old February 5th, 2009, 08:09 PM   #7448
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Nomadd22, you are partially correct about the function of the "erecting steel", it is there to tie the core halves together and add strength to the core.

As it's name implies it is also there to make erecting simpler and therefore faster. If you take a look at the pics Econ-tim posted on page 370 you can clearly see the shear connection plates for the floor beams. Rather than embed the floor beams into the shear wall they are bolted to the "erecting steel" thus speeding up erection. After the core is cast the embedment of the ends of the floor beams into the core acts as a moment connection giving the tower greater strength to resist wind and seismic loads.

The erecting steel does one other important thing, it acts as a header above openings in the core walls.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3376/...482ae6.jpg?v=0
Below the "erecting steel" the core halves are tied together with "link beams", they are just wide flange beams covered with shear studs and encased in concrete.

Last edited by Zensteeldude; February 6th, 2009 at 01:43 AM. Reason: added pic
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Old February 5th, 2009, 08:19 PM   #7449
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Acording to the prints the pools are 198 feet square. Restoring Fulton St. isn't exactly why the pools are smaller, Fulton was moved south to get it further away from Tower One.

Personally, that 5 foot difference doesn't bother me becouse the foundations of the towers well be on display in the Musium exactly where they were placed back in the 60s.
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Old February 5th, 2009, 08:32 PM   #7450
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i know its immature, but when you say erection not construction i giggle inside
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Old February 5th, 2009, 08:40 PM   #7451
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Not next week, tomorrow!

- A
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Old February 5th, 2009, 09:06 PM   #7452
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Not next week, tomorrow!

- A
wtf

anyway here us more pics:



http://www.flickr.com/photos/javate/3250727055/



http://www.flickr.com/photos/derek7272/3249921205/



http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/3245306118/
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Old February 5th, 2009, 09:26 PM   #7453
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seems they poured the next floor already
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Old February 5th, 2009, 10:45 PM   #7454
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zensteeldude View Post
Acording to the prints the pools are 198 feet square. Restoring Fulton St. isn't exactly why the pools are smaller, Fulton was moved south to get it further away from Tower One.

Personally, that 5 foot difference doesn't bother me becouse the foundations of the towers well be on display in the Musium exactly where they were placed back in the 60s.
Except that below-ground, only a portion of the footprints for each tower will be visible. Less than half of the South Tower's foundation columns will be visible. Like I've said many times, if they need to shorten the pools for whatever reasons, that's fine, but they should at least still create some kind of visual marker for the EXACT footprints on the plaza level, such as a 5-foot wide silver band "painted" onto the plaza that wraps around each pool. It would cost nothing, would allow them to keep Fulton Street as is, wouldn't interfere with the construction already done, and would preserve the dimensions of the original footprints.
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Old February 6th, 2009, 12:22 AM   #7455
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RKOwens View Post
Except that below-ground, only a portion of the footprints for each tower will be visible. Less than half of the South Tower's foundation columns will be visible. Like I've said many times, if they need to shorten the pools for whatever reasons, that's fine, but they should at least still create some kind of visual marker for the EXACT footprints on the plaza level, such as a 5-foot wide silver band "painted" onto the plaza that wraps around each pool. It would cost nothing, would allow them to keep Fulton Street as is, wouldn't interfere with the construction already done, and would preserve the dimensions of the original footprints.
I feel the same way, but I think we just need to accept that what things aren't going to change. The Port Authority is stubborn as hell and incompetent to boot.
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Old February 6th, 2009, 01:13 AM   #7456
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RKOwens, I agree with you 100%, say a stainless steel strip embedded into the plaza pavement marking the outline of the Twins would cost very little and mean so much !
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Old February 6th, 2009, 01:58 AM   #7457
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Quote:
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seems they poured the next floor already
The next floor of what, where?
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Old February 6th, 2009, 01:58 AM   #7458
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Quote:
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RKOwens, I agree with you 100%, say a stainless steel strip embedded into the plaza pavement marking the outline of the Twins would cost very little and mean so much !
Didn't you post some drawings showing the edge of the pools over at WiredNewYork? I thought there was going to be plaques with the names of victims or something on the edge of the pool??? Or am I thinking of something completely different.
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Old February 6th, 2009, 02:08 AM   #7459
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You are correct.

My hope is they add a strip showing the exact outline of the Towers in the plaza pavement.

Here is the sketch.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/3256117631/
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Old February 6th, 2009, 02:14 AM   #7460
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zensteeldude View Post
You are correct.

My hope is they add a strip showing the exact outline of the Towers in the plaza pavement.

Here is the sketch.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/3256117631/
Ah, the plaques are included in the 198 feet. Damn. Hopefully they put some sort of strip in. Aren't you involved in the contract work? Maybe you can put in the good word?
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