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Old April 7th, 2009, 06:47 PM   #8201
Nomadd22
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Originally Posted by Nomadd22 View Post
Looks like the Fulton St steel is finished. I wonder who'll get to use that for staging when they get it covered.

"half of it is finished"

It looks about like a 25' span and I thought that's all Fulton was going to be.
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Old April 7th, 2009, 08:10 PM   #8202
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nomadd22 View Post
It looks about like a 25' span and I thought that's all Fulton was going to be.
Zen and NYatKnight (two people involved in the project and know what they're talking about) have said that the steel going up over Fulton Street is only temporary, to allow for a service road and will eventually be dismantled. The actual Fulton Street will probably be wider and probably even located a little further to the south (allowing for a sidewalk in front of the Freedom Tower).

A while back I did a pixel analysis of the Fulton Street location in a super hi-res overhead photo, comparing the pixels to the known width of the Freedom Tower (200 feet) and calculated that there will be exactly 72 feet between the southern edge of the tower and the northern edge of the North pool (going by the center of the NT's columns). Since the NT pool is 5 feet shorter on each side, that's 77 feet. The PANYNJ October report says that the NT pool will be 25 feet from Fulton Street. This leaves 52 feet for Fulton Street and the Freedom Tower's southern sidewalk. My guess is Fulton Street will be about 32 feet wide, and the FT sidewalk will be about 20 feet wide. (Yes, this is the trivial, minute stuff about this project I can't help but try to figure out. )
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Old April 7th, 2009, 10:35 PM   #8203
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Thanks RK. That service road oughta really help logistics around the construction area. 32 feet is about minimum to allow a taxi to stop without blocking traffic.
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Old April 8th, 2009, 08:29 AM   #8204
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RKOwens View Post
No. The final NIST report on the collapse is 10,000 pages on the Twin Towers and about 780 pages for WTC7, but if you want a very, very brief summary on why the buildings collapsed, here goes. Nothing melted. The fires in the towers reached 1832 degrees F. Structural steel loses 50% of its strength at 1100 degrees F and about 90% of its strength at 1832 degrees F, and the location of the columns did have a lot to do with why it collapsed. The towers had to collapse, they couldn't have possibly remained standing. NIST concluded that if there was no damage from the planes and there were only the fires, regardless of fireproofing, the towers wouldn't have collapsed; other engineers argue that the towers would have collapsed regardless of whether there was any damage from the planes.

WTC7's fireproofing did its job well and kept the steel from reaching temps any higher than about 400 degrees F (don't remember exact temp), which is why it remained standing for 7 hours and allowed everyone to evacuate before it finally did collapse. Still, 400 degrees was enough for key steel beams to experience thermal expansion and lead to structural failure. Again, nothing melted. Freedom Tower will be much stronger because it has a concrete core and concrete-coated external columns, which withstands fire much better. The Freedom Tower will be the safest building (from fire) in the world. (Off topic? )
You can believe that story...or believe the more logical one which is not usually talked about...but anyways...Lets go Freedom tower!
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Old April 8th, 2009, 08:55 AM   #8205
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Everyone has a difference of opinion and what is logical to you may not be to the next person.

Can we get back on topic about the construction?
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Old April 8th, 2009, 04:34 PM   #8206
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Looks like the MTVA deal might be dead, at the very least this could involve a re-design of the top of the tower and the communications mast.

Article in the NY Observer 4-7-09.

http://www.observer.com/2009/real-es...-freedom-tower
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Old April 8th, 2009, 08:52 PM   #8207
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time for the top to evolve again.
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Old April 8th, 2009, 11:15 PM   #8208
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They've started moving construction trailers off of Vesey and onto the B2 slab. I guess they've started the process of clearing stuff out so they can dismantle the Vesey overhang.
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Old April 8th, 2009, 11:47 PM   #8209
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElCrioyo View Post
You can believe that story...or believe the more logical one which is not usually talked about...but anyways...Lets go Freedom tower!
You mean the more logical story that having a steel building lose over half of its strength (90% in some areas) from fire wasn't enough to cause structural failure, and therefore a team of hundreds of conspirators must have been able sneak in and planted thousands of explosives on every floor, and on the morning of 9/11 not one of 50,000 office workers noticed them and that these were later set off even though not a single camera recorded a single explosion prior to or during the collapse? Yeah, that's the WAY more logical story. Leave now if you're going to start spreading your "9/11 truth" nonsense.

Quote:
Looks like the MTVA deal might be dead, at the very least this could involve a re-design of the top of the tower and the communications mast.

Article in the NY Observer 4-7-09.

http://www.observer.com/2009/real-es...-freedom-tower
Might this be good news for an outdoor observation deck on the roof???

Last edited by RKOwens; April 8th, 2009 at 11:54 PM.
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Old April 9th, 2009, 12:55 AM   #8210
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buildmilehightower View Post
time for the top to evolve again.
the spire and top will still be the same there will just be no communication antennas, yet. im sure that after the construction it will be attached. much like they did with the willis tower.
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Old April 9th, 2009, 01:08 AM   #8211
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North core,April 08.







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Old April 9th, 2009, 01:17 AM   #8212
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Thanks for the pics jwalas. All that re-bar swaying in the wind is actually quite beautyful. (was over there monday)
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Old April 9th, 2009, 03:23 AM   #8213
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jwalas, I love you (in a very heterosexual way). your pictures are always up to date, posted on the same day taken! thanks!

In the second picture, it seems they've closed the forms on the east side of the north core. In the same pic you can also see rebar on the B2 level. Finally, April is here and the concrete pouring can commence in full force!
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Old April 9th, 2009, 05:02 AM   #8214
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RKOwens View Post
The fires caused the collapse. Yes, you can look at it as the planes caused the fires so the plane caused the collapse, but it wasn't structural damage from the planes which caused collapse. (And, yes, this is off topic, so back to the Freedom Tower!)
right and wrong. the plane impacts blasted the spray-on fire proofing off the support trusses and, paired with the structural damage, set up the fate of complete failure that the fire would bring. - why do you think the south tower collapsed first, although it was hit long after the north tower?
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Old April 9th, 2009, 05:06 AM   #8215
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re-reading what you said: i guess you meant the fires ultimately made the buildings collapse, which is right. i'm sure the towers would still be standing today if the planes had empty fuel tanks before hitting (a scenario i've thought about a few times before).

anyway, i'm happy to see the progress on the freedom tower's core. i can't wait to see the memorial shape up some more, along with the other towers.
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Old April 9th, 2009, 05:06 AM   #8216
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I hope we'll see the north core jump this month. They gotta keep the pace up, cause it looks like 4WTC is gonna pass them later this year.

Also, any ideas when the PA could be releasing another quarterly progress report? I keep checking the PA's wtcprogress.com website in hopes it's published. Should be very interesting.
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Old April 9th, 2009, 05:28 AM   #8217
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NewYorkMantle View Post
re-reading what you said: i guess you meant the fires ultimately made the buildings collapse, which is right. i'm sure the towers would still be standing today if the planes had empty fuel tanks before hitting (a scenario i've thought about a few times before).
This is exactly what I said. Also, the South Tower collapsed earlier because it was hit lower (29 floors of weight on its weakened columns, compared to only 12 in the North Tower... so more than double), Flight 175 was travelling faster and caused more immediate damage, it hit at a corner rather than dead on like Flight 11, and because it took longer for the fires in the NT to travel to the south side of the building (the side where the collapse began) rather than in the case of the South Tower, where it collapsed on the east side and fires broke out there immediately. So, there were many reasons why the South Tower collapsed in half the time as the north.

Last edited by RKOwens; April 9th, 2009 at 05:36 AM.
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Old April 9th, 2009, 06:10 AM   #8218
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Great!
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Old April 10th, 2009, 08:10 AM   #8219
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nice up date.....
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Old April 10th, 2009, 08:15 AM   #8220
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It has been months since I last looked at a picture of the construction site here... and nothing's changed! Babies grow more than this has in the same space of time!
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