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Old April 21st, 2007, 10:25 AM   #1101
brewcityfan
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I didn't forget - you're the one promoting this folly trolly at the bottom of every comment you make...as a "proud supporter."

Yes, some might be able to use it, but not many - not nearly enough to warrant it. And now this dumb-ass lobby group is wasting our money to try and waste more of our money. C'mon, $13 per day on top of a car rental?!!! Yeah, that will bring visitors to town. What a bunch of...I can't even say it.

Sorry, don't mean to dump on you, it's just so easy. I will try and refrain from this nastiness from now on.
Yeah well there's plenty of other people you could be bashing out there for their support of the KRM. I'm not the only one singing the tune of a better metro transit in the future. And I hate getting into this due to the other thread but how in the world is a $13 per day extra fee on a car rental going to affect Milwaukeeians!? We aren't tourists in our own city. Give me a break. When it comes to tourist taxes Milwaukee has it going good as it is. Just try sleeping overnight in a Chicago hotel and you're guaranteed a 15% city tax, a 9% state tax, minimum of $30 valet or regular parking (and that's at the 3-star), plus hotel fees. And here you are screaming because people visiting Milwaukee have to pay $13/day for a car! Holy crap dude. These visitors probably won't even KNOW there's a $13/day tax until they come to rent-a-car anyways. Talk about ridiculous.
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Old April 21st, 2007, 09:00 PM   #1102
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13 dollars a day might seem like nothing to us because we obviously dont need rental cars. However, people who plan conventions, come here for business, or are just coming to town will feel the affects of it. These taxes will hurt our already hurting convention lineup.

Milwaukee isnt New York, London, or San Francisco--we cant expect people to pay that to spend time here.
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Old April 21st, 2007, 09:42 PM   #1103
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Well my question to all those who don't want these particular items to be enforced, but want some kind of transit option, what's your idea?

So far, this is how it goes:

Sales tax: NO
Property tax: HELL NO
Rental Car tax: ABSOLUTELY NO
Added Hotel tax: We can't even try that for an expanded convention center!
State and Federal Aid: They're already giving us aid
Tolls: Knowing Wisconsinites - probably NO

I mean right now I'm tempted to just say why not ask Illinois to give us the money!

What's the gameplan people, without of course skyking chiming in like he infamously does with a comment of "NO RAIL TRANSIT PERIOD" because well, we already know that option.
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Old April 22nd, 2007, 12:10 AM   #1104
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The proposed tax to generate fundings for the commuter rail is on a per car rental basis, not on a per day basis.
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Old April 22nd, 2007, 02:29 AM   #1105
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The Actually Did Something

In brighter news:

http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=594188

Quote:
For metro Milwaukee, however, the trio of German executives who moved this month to New Berlin to start a U.S. subsidiary for their Hamburg-based parent, Germanischer Lloyd AG, represents a milestone.

Milwaukee had competition for the engineering firm, which also considered Chicago and Pittsburgh.
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Old April 22nd, 2007, 03:42 AM   #1106
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Apologies if this has been brought up before, as I just registered for these forvms, but am I not the only one whom thinks that WisDOT (State of Wisconsin, Department of Transportation) is sitting on a potential redevelopment goldmine with the ongoing Marquette Interchange (I-43/94/794) rebuild? I'm specifically thinking about the block (7th, 8th, Clybourn and Michigan) where the former westbound Clybourn St loop on-ramp was, which will become completely surplus with this project.

The first thing that I thought of when I saw the rebuild plans a few years ago was 'That will be a PERFECT site for a 50-60 floor signature tall building!'. One will be looking directly at that site when driving northward across the I-43/94 High Rise Bridge and it will have fantastic access, with several off-ramps feeding right into that vicinity.

Has there been any official announcement yet regarding the future of that block?

Mike
Appleton, WI
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Old April 22nd, 2007, 04:18 AM   #1107
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Hey Mike, welcome to the forum!

I never really thought of that parcel of land before as a redevelopment site. But thinking about it, it doesn't sound like a bad idea to do something with the land. As for a building taller than the US Bank Tower, I don't know if there's the will yet to top that.
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Old April 22nd, 2007, 07:48 AM   #1108
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That land probably wont be put up for bids until after the entire interchange project is finished.
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Old April 22nd, 2007, 09:06 AM   #1109
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per car, per day...tis all the same. Its just going to shake down people so we can operate a train line--which I like the idea of. Not totally bought on the location of the line though. I think we should be focusing on the Western part of the metro area.
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Old April 22nd, 2007, 10:06 AM   #1110
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per car, per day...tis all the same. Its just going to shake down people so we can operate a train line--which I like the idea of. Not totally bought on the location of the line though. I think we should be focusing on the Western part of the metro area.
Yeah, agreed that probably Waukesha or Mequon should have had the line first. I think they were hoping for a Chicago-Milwaukee connection, but failed to realize Amtrak does the same thing but faster. And while development will increase along the line, the positioning of the line makes development extremely lacking, thanks to the lakefront being there.
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Old April 22nd, 2007, 03:39 PM   #1111
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I'll never be able to figure out why we're so concerned about the KRM line when we should really be focusing on the Madison/Waukesha/Milwaukee connection. All you have to do is look at the freeway system during rush hour to see where the commuter traffic is going.

Dur.
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Old April 22nd, 2007, 06:01 PM   #1112
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1) KRM is not for travel between MKE and Chicago, it is for suburb to city transport and suburb to suburb transport. It is not a duplication of Amtrak's services

2) It is meant to be at first, an alternative to 94 traffic while the entire stretch is being rebuilt

3) Southern Milwaukee suburbs are probably some of the fastest growing right now since until just a few years ago, a lot of it was still farmland. Yes, we do need to look to the future.

4) It goes towards Chicago.. and on that note I am on my way to a Cubs game at Wrigley
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Old April 22nd, 2007, 07:03 PM   #1113
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1) KRM is not for travel between MKE and Chicago, it is for suburb to city transport and suburb to suburb transport. It is not a duplication of Amtrak's services
I didn't say anything about the line being for travel between MKE and Chicago.

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2) It is meant to be at first, an alternative to 94 traffic while the entire stretch is being rebuilt
Traffic is not bad on 94... at least south of the city. Traffic is bad on 94 WEST of the city.

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3) Southern Milwaukee suburbs are probably some of the fastest growing right now since until just a few years ago, a lot of it was still farmland. Yes, we do need to look to the future.
They may be some of the fastest growing right now but they're not that big yet. Waukesha, on the other hand, is already there and still growing.

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4) It goes towards Chicago.. and on that note I am on my way to a Cubs game at Wrigley
I think you just contradicted your first point... But anyway, hope you have/had fun at the game.
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Old April 22nd, 2007, 08:21 PM   #1114
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While I am all for updating our connections to Chicago. But we already have Amtrak--which is one of the busiest and fast growing lines in the nation. I think lines towards Madison right now would make more sense.

Stops at Miller Park/Potawatomi/Menomonee Valley, West Allis, perhaps the Zoo, Wauwatosa/County Grounds/Medical Center, Brookfield, Waukesha/GE Medical Complex, Delafield, Oconomowoc/Pabst Farms, Madison metro area/Isthmus/UW. There is a ton a traffic towards Milwaukee out there, as Mark pointed out. Not only that, but a ton of jobs available to Milwaukee residents. A train line running to Moorland Ave. with bus service from there to Bluemound makes more sense than a train stop in Caledonia.

Dont get me wrong though, I support Metra and relize my idea will never happen.
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Old April 22nd, 2007, 09:25 PM   #1115
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While I am all for updating our connections to Chicago. But we already have Amtrak--which is one of the busiest and fast growing lines in the nation. I think lines towards Madison right now would make more sense.

Stops at Miller Park/Potawatomi/Menomonee Valley, West Allis, perhaps the Zoo, Wauwatosa/County Grounds/Medical Center, Brookfield, Waukesha/GE Medical Complex, Delafield, Oconomowoc/Pabst Farms, Madison metro area/Isthmus/UW. There is a ton a traffic towards Milwaukee out there, as Mark pointed out. Not only that, but a ton of jobs available to Milwaukee residents. A train line running to Moorland Ave. with bus service from there to Bluemound makes more sense than a train stop in Caledonia.

Dont get me wrong though, I support Metra and relize my idea will never happen.
I think it will. As I've said many times in the rail transit thread, I think the KRM is the first phase out of many unplanned phases in the future. While a possibly bad route to have a test run perhaps, that's I think the game plan. Honestly I'd prefer a rail type system connecting the park and rides in the 7 county Milwaukee metro to downtown Milwaukee. At least you're promoting workers to park their cars outside the city and taking transit in.
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Old April 22nd, 2007, 09:41 PM   #1116
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Yeah well there's plenty of other people you could be bashing out there for their support of the KRM. I'm not the only one singing the tune of a better metro transit in the future. And I hate getting into this due to the other thread but how in the world is a $13 per day extra fee on a car rental going to affect Milwaukeeians!? We aren't tourists in our own city. Give me a break. When it comes to tourist taxes Milwaukee has it going good as it is. Just try sleeping overnight in a Chicago hotel and you're guaranteed a 15% city tax, a 9% state tax, minimum of $30 valet or regular parking (and that's at the 3-star), plus hotel fees. And here you are screaming because people visiting Milwaukee have to pay $13/day for a car! Holy crap dude. These visitors probably won't even KNOW there's a $13/day tax until they come to rent-a-car anyways. Talk about ridiculous.
My friend, the day we start comparing Milwaukee prices to Chicago prices we're in trouble. There is no comparing. Conventioners and visitors to Chicago (and other large, world-class cities) expect to pay ridiculous prices for just about evereything. They don't expect to pay Chicago prices in Milwaukee. And, yes, people will find out about extra fees - especially convention-planners whose job it is to cost-compare possible sites. Believe me, Milwaukee cannot afford that kind of high rent perception. And, for those unsuspecting visitors who you say won't even know they're getting screwed, I'm sure they'll think twice about hurrying back once they see their bill!!

And, for one last time, can you tell me how this ill-planned line from Kenosha to Racine to Milwaukee will make metro transit better?
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Old April 22nd, 2007, 09:44 PM   #1117
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I'll never be able to figure out why we're so concerned about the KRM line when we should really be focusing on the Madison/Waukesha/Milwaukee connection. All you have to do is look at the freeway system during rush hour to see where the commuter traffic is going.

Dur.
Agreed.
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Old April 22nd, 2007, 09:57 PM   #1118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skyking2 View Post
My friend, the day we start comparing Milwaukee prices to Chicago prices we're in trouble. There is no comparing. Conventioners and visitors to Chicago (and other large, world-class cities) expect to pay ridiculous prices for just about evereything. They don't expect to pay Chicago prices in Milwaukee. And, yes, people will find out about extra fees - especially convention-planners whose job it is to cost-compare possible sites. Believe me, Milwaukee cannot afford that kind of high rent perception. And, for those unsuspecting visitors who you say won't even know they're getting screwed, I'm sure they'll think twice about hurrying back once they see their bill!!

And, for one last time, can you tell me how this ill-planned line from Kenosha to Racine to Milwaukee will make metro transit better?
Honestly if visitors are that extremely concerned about an extra $13 to rent a car in Milwaukee, then I don't know why they're vacationing to begin with! And I understand - Chicago and Milwaukee are two different sizes, but putting different ideas on the ground for Milwaukee and making it more of a tourist destination means we have to do something. Am I saying to make a billion seperate taxes like the Chicago Loop? Absolutely not. But perhaps taking in one or two of their ideas and implementing them into our city won't be as bad as everyone is claiming it to be.

I think the KRM can and will work - by what others have said on the rail transit thread, and by the new developments going on towards the Illinois border. Abbott Labs adding 10,000+ jobs in Kenosha is a big plus, their new lifestyle center and residential plots is a big plus, and the KRM line promoting development from the lakefront to a bit west of the line in some communities is also a big plus.

While I tend to agree with Mark, and I've said so in a previous post, they chose to go south instead of west or north for their test. It might not be the best option, but it is an option. Being negative about it will only guarantee its failure. There is a saying - you can't win if you don't try. At least they're trying.
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Old April 23rd, 2007, 05:13 AM   #1119
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My apologies for sounding negative about the KRM line... I do feel as though it's a great step forward in our thinking and a necessary one at that. What I don't feel good about is the fact that if this doesn't work, we're in much worse shape than we are now with regard to rail.

And sorry for continuing this rail talk in this particular forum but as long as we're at it, I'd like to throw in my two cents about the $13 per car hike in car rental fees. The raise in price is not incredibly significant... maybe it's the extra three bucks on top of ten that makes it seem over the top or maybe it's the fact that it would appear as though we're pushing our need for funds on visitors... Regardless, it's a needed source of income to make this thing work. I really don't think it's going to scare convention organizers away and I certainly don't think people are going to balk at their bill. It's just one of those things we deal with.

Perhaps a better idea would be to spread the cost over a few revenue generating options rather than just one. How about an extra dollar per parking ticket? What about maybe installing look-out binoculars along the lakeshore walkways and breakwater that charge 50 cents per view? Or we could work harder to push recycling (particularly aluminum) among city residents. After all, there is money to be made there.

Those ideas may sound ridiculous or cheap but all those coins add up to one hell of a chunk of change. Point is, we don't have to be completely set on one option for funding. There's plenty of out-of-the-box thinking that can be done to achieve the same end result... I just wish the end result was a rail line going west.
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Old April 23rd, 2007, 08:51 AM   #1120
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While you may think that the KRM line wont work, it would be a nice start to getting a line running to Milwaukee, as long as people realize that it is a start, and that for its continued success it will eventually need to grow is what matters. What the KRM line will do is it will draw people who are in the middle between Milwaukee and Chicago, and encourage them to choose Milwaukee by providing them with accessibility, and opportunity.

You argue that there is already a train running between Milwaukee and Chicago, and I say good, that means that there are people who are used to riding a train in that region, so it will be easier to get a faster growing ridership. Combine the KRM with the mayors proposal for COMET and the Circulator and Milwaukee will have the start of a decent transit system. As far as the question about a transit system that goes towards Madison, I want to ask about the future. Yes currently there is a larger portion of the metro extending in the Madison direction, but if you look at the growth projections for the metro, as well as the timetable for this project, and then estimate when they will be adding on to it, you will realize that it make sense for this project to go south. Maybe if the project was built right now, and opening tomorrow, it might make sense for it to extend towards Madison, but it isn't.

Finally, I want to ask, why do you oppose this? Is it because it doesn't affect the suburb you live in, or is it because you don't think Milwaukee should ever have rail transit. If you are not opposed to Milwaukee having rail sometime in the future, then why are you opposed to KRM?
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