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Old January 19th, 2016, 06:37 PM   #1121
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Originally Posted by Minato ku View Post
It was better to send the highspeed trains from the east to the Gare de l'Est (with plenty of space left) than to the overcrowded Gare du Nord.
I keep hearing this overcrowding argument, and I must confess that it confuses me. It is true that by conventional measures the Gare du Nord is the busiest railway station in Europe. However, based on my own (very unscientific) personal observations I speculate that this must reflect the very busy suburban and RER lines.

The hourly number of trains on the "Grands Lignes" terminus station is significantly smaller than what one sees, for instance, in the main railway stations in Germany. I was in Frankfurt a.M. over New Year, and there they seem to be able to roll a train through each platform every 10-15 minutes. In the Gare du Nord TGVs and Thalys trains often rest immobile for up to an hour. In which case, of course, one quickly reaches the "saturation point".
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Old January 19th, 2016, 06:46 PM   #1122
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Quote:
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The hourly number of trains on the "Grands Lignes" terminus station is significantly smaller than what one sees, for instance, in the main railway stations in Germany. I was in Frankfurt a.M. over New Year, and there they seem to be able to roll a train through each platform every 10-15 minutes. In the Gare du Nord TGVs and Thalys trains often rest immobile for up to an hour. In which case, of course, one quickly reaches the "saturation point".
This is something that always astonished me too. For example, I have been
hearing for years that the station of Lille-Flandres was saturated, with its 20+
tracks, while we in Belgium managed to dispatch, from the station of Antwerp
Central (also a stub station), before its modernization, twice more trains on
10 tracks only. Difference of operating procedures I suppose...
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Old January 19th, 2016, 10:20 PM   #1123
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This is also the difference of trains, you can roll a regional train faster than a TGV.
The seven suburban surface terminal platforms of Gare du Nord have more departures per hour in rush hours than 19 mainline platforms.
On these 19 mainlines platforms, four are reserved to the Eurostar, two are reserved to Thalys and at least four are reserved to regional trains from Picardy.
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Old January 21st, 2016, 04:29 PM   #1124
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From Rail Journal:

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http://www.railjournal.com/index.php...ml?channel=523

July opening date confirmed for TGV Est Phase 2
Thursday, January 21, 2016



THE president of French infrastructure manager SNCF Network Mr Jacques Rapoport confirmed to the French press on January 20 that the opening of the second phase of TGV Est, which was delayed following the fatal derailment of a test train at Eckwersheim near Strasbourg on November 14, will take place on July 3

Initially only one track will be operational on a 25km stretch of the 106km high-speed line from Baudrecourt to Vendenheim while repairs to the section of line damaged in the derailment are carried out, a process which is expected to take around seven months to complete

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Old January 26th, 2016, 06:13 PM   #1125
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High-speed train TGV cab. LGV Marseille Lyon Part Dieu

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Old February 2nd, 2016, 12:14 AM   #1126
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High-speed train TGV cab. LGV Paris Gare de Lyon/Aix TGV

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Old February 2nd, 2016, 08:31 AM   #1127
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Minato ku View Post
It was better to send the highspeed trains from the east to the Gare de l'Est (with plenty of space left) than to the overcrowded Gare du Nord.

About the TGV tunnel under Paris, Central Paris underground is already very crowded and a such tunnel would be very expensive
There are plenty of more important projects that are needed (new tunnel for the RER D, RER E extension...).
I remember that the SNCF once proposed such a tunnel connecting Gare du Nord and Gare de Lyon with another station at République halfway. These exact words, proposed, never came into fruition. Anyway, whatever benefits that scheme would've had, it wouldn't have created a Berlin-style uniform gare centrale for Paris at all. And I guess that this is never going to happen, that's a real bummer.
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Old February 2nd, 2016, 10:03 AM   #1128
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Quote:
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I remember that the SNCF once proposed such a tunnel connecting Gare du Nord and Gare de Lyon with another station at République halfway. These exact words, proposed, never came into fruition. Anyway, whatever benefits that scheme would've had, it wouldn't have created a Berlin-style uniform gare centrale for Paris at all. And I guess that this is never going to happen, that's a real bummer.
Too complicated... and a unique train station in the middle of Paris would be way way overcrowned...
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Old February 2nd, 2016, 11:06 PM   #1129
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We would have to find a huge space in the middle of Paris.
Unlike Berlin, Paris does not have large empty space in the center, even underground and it is not easy to built large space at deep level.
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Old February 2nd, 2016, 11:28 PM   #1130
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It might seem like a paradox, but the bigger the city the less important it is for the main station to be exactly in the middle of the city. Wherever it would be located vast majority of passengers would have to take Metro to their final destinations anyway.
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Old February 2nd, 2016, 11:50 PM   #1131
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That's right. I'd put it right under Magenta, connecting to Gare de Lyon via Place de la République and to Montparnasse via Saint-Lazaire. Parce que les gares du Nord est de l'Est forment le plus grand complex de chemin de fer à Paris et sont les gares les plus internationales.
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Old February 3rd, 2016, 02:47 AM   #1132
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Easier to say than to build.
How would you build a large underground station under Magenta?
How you would create easy access to the surface? The underground there is very crowded.

We would have to build a space bigger under Magenta which is already deep and big in a very crowded underground.
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It might seem like a paradox, but the bigger the city the less important it is for the main station to be exactly in the middle of the city. Wherever it would be located vast majority of passengers would have to take Metro to their final destinations anyway.
When I was saying the middle of Paris, it means inside the lines 2 and 6 of the metro.
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Old February 3rd, 2016, 08:25 PM   #1133
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From Rail Journal:

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http://www.railjournal.com/index.php...ml?channel=523

Route approved for Montpellier - Perpignan HSL
Wednesday, February 03, 2016



FRENCH transport minister Mr Alain Vidalies has approved the preliminary route and station locations for the 150km Montpellier - Perpignan high-speed line, paving the way for a public inquiry into the project, which is expected to begin at the end of this year

The approval covers a 100-120m wide corridor defined by infrastructure manager SNCF Network as the optimal route for the line, which is forecast to cost €5.52bn at 2014 prices. The final alignment will be decided at a later stage

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Old February 3rd, 2016, 08:51 PM   #1134
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It might seem like a paradox, but the bigger the city the less important it is for the main station to be exactly in the middle of the city. Wherever it would be located vast majority of passengers would have to take Metro to their final destinations anyway.
Except that doesn't apply for connecting passengers who have to drag luggage through the metro system. And the way the French system is set up most long distance connections are through Paris.
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Old February 3rd, 2016, 10:25 PM   #1135
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Old February 4th, 2016, 04:04 PM   #1136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Minato ku View Post
Easier to say than to build.
How would you build a large underground station under Magenta?
How you would create easy access to the surface? The underground there is very crowded.

We would have to build a space bigger under Magenta which is already deep and big in a very crowded underground.
[...]
When I was saying the middle of Paris, it means inside the lines 2 and 6 of the metro.
You're right, that's exactly why I said that it won't happen. What remains true after all is that even a new gare centrale should rather be built where railway already used to be and construction under, let's say, Châtelet – Les Halles would be even more counterproductive than under Magenta or wherever you have a big terminal in Paris. And yes, Berlin had a magic combination that Paris will never have: A site in the middle of the city where there was little more than a correctional facility when it was built, where three in four directions where already made (Stadtbahn east-west, due north for itself) and where still nobody didn't want to go which made the unpleasentness of its construction site very acceptable. And of course, Paris like London had much more building stock than Berlin when their termini were built.

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Except that doesn't apply for connecting passengers who have to drag luggage through the metro system. And the way the French system is set up most long distance connections are through Paris.
In a system with one gare centrale, every TGV would serve it and transfer would happen just there.

If I browse ratp.fr and search for a connection between Gare de Lyon and Gare de l'Est, I'm supposed to take bus line 65 instead of the Métro or even line D that goes to Gare du Nord. If you don't travel by railway as if it were your job, this can be really frustrating.

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From Rail Journal:
Will they ever build an LGV Toulouse-Perpignan so that the southern periphery and run TGV trains on its own?
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Old February 7th, 2016, 04:36 AM   #1137
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What's the feedback on OuiGo services so far?
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Old February 7th, 2016, 02:28 PM   #1138
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What's the feedback on OuiGo services so far?
You mean for the customer? Well it makes the job, but has some differences with conventionals TGV, even if it's cheaper, you have to pay for luggages and also the train doesn't leave from a station inside Paris, for exemple some of them leaves from Marne la valée witch is not so close from Paris and requires you to buy a 12€ RER ticket if I remember well...
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Old February 7th, 2016, 04:13 PM   #1139
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It is not as much fortunately, the RER ticket price is €7.60 from Central Paris.
Now, subscriptions covering fare zone 1 covers all zones.
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Old February 7th, 2016, 05:48 PM   #1140
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High-speed train TGV cab. 6864 Nice/Marseille +Raccordement.

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