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Old June 20th, 2016, 06:11 PM   #1201
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
I wondered if they couldn't build a LVG linking Clemont-Ferrand and Lyon. A spur of sorts, not very long.
That was the purpose of the POCL project (Paris-Orléans-Clermont-Lyon), though it wasn't linking directly Clermont to HSR. Another highly debatable one, given its main aim was to double the current Paris-Lyon high speed line.



Let's admit the line linking Lyon and Clermont-Ferrand via Roanne and Vichy isn't exactly the shortest route ever designed. Its performances are low and Auvergne's capital city, being a cul-de-sac, remain the biggest one not served by high speed trains, only Intercités.

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Maybe the Bordeaux - Toulouse LGV section in the current state does not make much sense but if one day the Toulouse - Montpellier section will be added to the network then we might see significant traffic increase due to other routes served by the Bordeaux - Toulouse line such as Bordeaux - Marseille, Bordeaux - Nice, Bordeaux - Lyon, Bordeaux - Barcelona etc.
That's precisely why Toulouse-Narbonne section was more relevant to build first, given it would allow quicker connections with Barcelona, Montpellier, Marseille, Lyon and beyond Northern Italy, Geneva,... The approved one only connects Toulouse with Bordeaux, Tours and Paris, further Lille and in a distant future Bilbao, maybe.
If France wasn't what it is, Rhin-Rhône Southern Branch and Toulouse-Montpellier, creating a mesh network with multiple interregional and trans-european connections, would prevail on the aforementioned one which broadly follows the star network logic, conceived to fit *cough* Paris needs.
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Old June 21st, 2016, 09:16 AM   #1202
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And in terms of metropolitan areas Toulouse is also bigger according to this plus Toulouse due to Airbus is a very important city for industry. For example I know people here in Germany who travel frequently to Toulouse on business trips.
Sorry but according to Wikipedia :

"Bordeaux est la commune principale de la métropole « Bordeaux Métropole », qui rassemble 28 communes et 737 492 habitants, la deuxième de France, par sa population, derrière la « Métropole européenne de Lille » et devant « Toulouse Métropole"

The station of Bordeaux doesn't serve only the city intra-muros. And we must
compare apples with apples...
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Old June 21st, 2016, 09:37 AM   #1203
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"Métropoles" are political creations, with a loose relation to their actual metropolitan areas. As for the latter, Toulouse's is now more populated than Bordeaux's.
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Old June 21st, 2016, 12:18 PM   #1204
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcVD View Post
Sorry but according to Wikipedia :

"Bordeaux est la commune principale de la métropole « Bordeaux Métropole », qui rassemble 28 communes et 737 492 habitants, la deuxième de France, par sa population, derrière la « Métropole européenne de Lille » et devant « Toulouse Métropole"

The station of Bordeaux doesn't serve only the city intra-muros. And we must
compare apples with apples...
you wrote:

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Bordeaux, which is a much larger city than Toulouse
It seems for the actual metropolitan areas Toulouse is still bigger in population by a small margin, but in any case the two cities are comparable in size, it is definitely not much larger one over the other to advocate that the larger one needs more infrastructure due to that reason.
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Old July 4th, 2016, 04:11 PM   #1205
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From Railway Gazette:

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http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/h...peed-line.html

LGV Est Phase 2 opening completes Paris – Strasbourg high speed line
04 Jul 2016







FRANCE: The second phase of LGV Est-Européenne opened on July 3, completing the high speed line between Paris and Strasbourg. There are 16 trains a day each way between the cities, with a fastest journey time of 1 h 46 min compared to around 4 h before the opening of phase 1. Completion of the line also reduces travel times to Germany, Belgium and Luxembourg.

Phase 2 covers 106 km between Baudrecourt and Vendenheim, extending Phase 1 which opened on June 10 2007. An agreement to finance the €2∙01bn Phase 2 was signed on September 1 2009, with funding coming from the national government (€680m), former national infrastructure manager RFF (€532m), the European Union (€118m) and 16 local authorities plus the Grand Duchy of Luxembourg (€680m)

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Old July 6th, 2016, 09:38 PM   #1206
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That is quite a lot of money from Luxembourg put together for the line, they didn't even get a direct high-speed link!
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Old July 7th, 2016, 12:56 AM   #1207
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I assume it speeds up connections to Strasbourg, both cities are part of the EU parliament.
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Old July 7th, 2016, 01:10 PM   #1208
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The EU Parliament is based in Strasbourg and Brussels.
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Old July 7th, 2016, 02:45 PM   #1209
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Luxembourg only payed 40M. 680M is the share for all French local authorities, plus Luxemboug.
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Old July 7th, 2016, 02:59 PM   #1210
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Luxembourg only payed 40M. 680M is the share for all French local authorities, plus Luxemboug.
That makes more sense, thanks for clarifying.
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Old July 8th, 2016, 03:29 AM   #1211
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The EU Parliament is based in Strasbourg and Brussels.
Plenary sessions are confined to those two cities but the secretariat for the EU parliament is in Luxembourg city (Kirchbourg).
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Old July 27th, 2016, 09:38 PM   #1212
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From Rail Journal:

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http://www.railjournal.com/index.php...ml?channel=523

High-speed testing begins on TGV Sud Europ Atlantique
Wednesday, July 27, 2016



AFTER four years of construction, the Lisea consortium celebrated a milestone for the Sud Europ Atlantique high-speed line on July 25, when high-speed testing began on the central section of the 302km route from Tours to Bordeaux

Slow-speed dynamic testing began in early July and high-speed testing commenced with 160km/h runs in both directions using a TGV Duplex set provided by French National Railways (SNCF). Speeds will be increased incrementally in the coming weeks and testing will be extended to the northern and southern sections of the line when the catenary is energised in September

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Old September 7th, 2016, 03:58 PM   #1213
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From Rail Journal:

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http://www.railjournal.com/index.php...ml?channel=523

Next-generation TGV to enter service in 2022
Wednesday, September 07, 2016



A joint project to develop the next-generation TGV was launched in Paris on September 7 by Voyages SNCF CEO Mrs Rachel Picard and Mr Jean-Baptiste Eymeoud, president of Alstom France

The aim of the so-called innovation partnership is to develop a train which reduces the cost of acquisition and operation by 20% and cuts energy consumption by at least 25% with recyclability of more than 90%. Another focus will be improving the passenger environment with modular interiors and improved comfort and connectivity

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Old September 8th, 2016, 02:45 PM   #1214
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So the French won't even bother this time to call for offers from other compitors and give the order straight to Alstom? French and their protectionism...
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Old September 8th, 2016, 04:25 PM   #1215
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So the French won't even bother this time to call for offers from other compitors and give the order straight to Alstom? French and their protectionism...
Just like DB and how they will never order anything besides Siemens.
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Old September 8th, 2016, 05:29 PM   #1216
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and spain to alstom and siemens
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Old September 8th, 2016, 05:39 PM   #1217
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I think that Spain might be one of the few countries that have several train brands on their tracks. It has trains from Talgo and CAF (both spanish companies) but also Siemens (Velaro) and Alstom (Atlantique) regarding high speed.

The case of Spain and Alstom could be discussed since Alstom trains are manufactured in a Spanish factory, although Alstom is french. But in the case of Siemens they are paid and manufactured in german soil.
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Old September 8th, 2016, 05:40 PM   #1218
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So the French won't even bother this time to call for offers from other compitors and give the order straight to Alstom? French and their protectionism...
To be fair the French did bought some german trains (Eurostar) and some italian trams (Lille).
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Old September 8th, 2016, 06:11 PM   #1219
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To be fair the French did bought some german trains (Eurostar) and some italian trams (Lille).
As well as Spanish trams in three cities and a very large fleet of suburban trains from Canadian Bombardier. (In fairness, the latter are produced entirely in France.) SNCF is in this respect less protectionist that most other large European countries - EXCEPT when it comes to high-speed manufacturing which is considered as a "national champion".

There may, however, be a link back to your reference to the Eurostar: Alstom lost that bid to Siemens, although the French state is a dominant shareholder in Eurostar, because their latest high-speed train, the so-called AGV (automotrice - because it has distributed motoring units), is manifestly lower quality than the newest German trains. And this problem is widely attributed to the fact that Alstom developed it on its own, in the hope of exporting it. (There was no French demand for this kind of train.) It is very dangerous for a train manufacturer to develop a fundamentally new product without being in close cooperation with a railway company who provides instant and copious feedback. I think they are now trying to rectify this mistake. This looks like industrial policy rather than transport policy.
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Old September 8th, 2016, 06:23 PM   #1220
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The AGV really turned out to be a big nothing. And there were so many expectations!

Will the 2022 TGV be designed with distributed power?
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