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Old April 24th, 2007, 08:01 PM   #241
kenji
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Originally Posted by Chitowner245 View Post
2 We already have a lot of quality projects u/c or proposed, and future projects that will certainly be of high quality. This thing is an immense upgrade from what is there, and that small area of the south loop is somewhat lifeless at the moment, so this project will be great for the area. Look at pictures of the south loop from 6 or 7 years ago, and i'm sure your attitudes will change about this project. We've come a long way down here, and anything that brings in more residents, more retail, and enhances street life is welcome in my book.
i don't need to look at the photos of south loop from 7 years ago, i still have vivid memories. .... all that crazy parties at the photo studios.... good times...
sure it was a rough neighborhood, but it had a unique character and a great potential to turn into something hot, where the residential buildings would coexist with printshops, art studios, and upscale restaurants or boutiques.

i was excited to watch the development of the area, but now i'm just disappointed...

there are maybe 4 new buildings, which would be worth photographing and sending to friends in eastern europe to show off. and i don't know if even that would do it. warsaw is building really nice high-rises lately.

time for me to move out to the city with smaller shoulders but bigger imagination... and less greedy developers. what was the ratio of chicago developers' profit versus new york developers per SF?
anyone remembers that?
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Old April 24th, 2007, 10:44 PM   #242
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Eco18 1818 South Wabash.

Not bad for the location. Agree with Chitowner 245. We could put up more of the cheap CMK stuff so you can get a look at your neighbors $200 Target bedroom set, and clothes piled up in the window with the bedsheets covering the sun.

I take it the lower two floors are facade, and the upper is more painted concrete...cripes throw some red stripes to make it an architectural wonder; oh, that has been done
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Old April 25th, 2007, 01:41 AM   #243
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Is CMK really cheap construction? I happen to like their designs a lot but I guess to each their own.
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Old April 25th, 2007, 01:46 AM   #244
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I think its fine. Not great, but south loop used to be a lot worse off. Hopefully with this type of design the units are also less expensive. There should be some more affordable places in the south loop so its not all the same yuppies demographic etc.
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Old April 25th, 2007, 04:16 AM   #245
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Meh.
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Old April 25th, 2007, 04:55 PM   #246
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Is CMK really cheap construction? I happen to like their designs a lot but I guess to each their own.
Their design and materials on the South Loop projects, are inferior to their other projects. The developers seem to lower their standards on highrises in the South Loop. The streetscape wall they created on Michigan Ave. with 1712 and 1620 projects is a sterile and uninspiring gray mass of ribbed aluminum siding. In total, their designs have been predictable, tired, and worn. Now, in some cases there were a lower initial price per square foot, and that is their demographic target. http://www.cmkcompanies.com/site/epage/26401_532.htm

It's Michigan Avenue for cripes sale, and that is the best you can do? When you are installing pre-cast celing/floor panels for a condo development, it is a clue you are ultimately not thinking about custom quality. Reminds me of a Days Inn

Last edited by ErmDiego; April 25th, 2007 at 05:03 PM.
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Old April 25th, 2007, 05:45 PM   #247
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Ahh another uplifting post from our resident nay sayer. I mean god I feel so good about whatís happened to the South Loop after reading his divisive slop everyday.

I would argue that diversity in style and price point are what make the area sustainable.

CMK provides a no frills housing stock that has serves the market. It may not be the Elysian or Streeterville but with 3 buildings South of 14th and more to come, their doing something right.

Options like 1720 or Vision may not be up to Erms standards (because boy that Legacy crap that he is so hot to protect has added so much to Prairie and Calumet Ave), but it does serve the neighborhood.
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Old April 25th, 2007, 07:05 PM   #248
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..

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Old April 25th, 2007, 07:16 PM   #249
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Originally Posted by ErmDiego View Post
Their design and materials on the South Loop projects, are inferior to their other projects. The developers seem to lower their standards on highrises in the South Loop. The streetscape wall they created on Michigan Ave. with 1712 and 1620 projects is a sterile and uninspiring gray mass of ribbed aluminum siding. In total, their designs have been predictable, tired, and worn. Now, in some cases there were a lower initial price per square foot, and that is their demographic target. http://www.cmkcompanies.com/site/epage/26401_532.htm

It's Michigan Avenue for cripes sale, and that is the best you can do? When you are installing pre-cast celing/floor panels for a condo development, it is a clue you are ultimately not thinking about custom quality. Reminds me of a Days Inn
That's a little too simplistic and your ignorance belies the fact that you don't know much about their projects or the architects they use. CMK has won many awards for their buildings, the Contemporaine was given and AIA Honor award in 2005, the highest honor given by the American Institute of Architects for individual works of architecture, and they are again working with Ralph Johnson/Perkins + Will for their new high-rise at 235 Van Buren. Their South Loop projects (specifically 1620 and 1720 S. Michigan) were designed by Brinninstool and Lynch, again, well know, well respected and award-winning architects in Chicago. The reason CMK designs might look cheap to you (and trust me, price-wise, they ain't cheap) is because they take a simpler approach to residential high-rise development, where the materials, concrete, steel, glass, metal finishes speak for themselves, instead of creating tacky, faux-old world, incorrect beaux-arts, or art-nouveau monstrosities (read: the butchers at Lucein LaGrange). As for the "sterile" enviroment along the S. Michigan streetscape, they've left room deliberately for retail, commercial developement (and even a school, which was rumored to be interested in the first floor of 1720) which that part of the South Loop desperately needs if it wants to be a lively part of the City.
Basically, even if you don't have the cranial capacity to understand modernism, or rather 21st century interpretations of Miesian Moderism, and the simple elegance that arises from it, don't knock it so easily, especially considering that CMK is doing what many other highrise developers should be doing in the City - as far as I'm concerned, CMK is doing it right, others are doing it wrong.
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Old April 25th, 2007, 07:45 PM   #250
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CMK

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That's a little too simplistic and your ignorance belies the fact that you don't know much about their projects or the architects they use. CMK has won many awards for their buildings, the Contemporaine was given and AIA Honor award in 2005, the highest honor given by the American Institute of Architects for individual works of architecture, and they are again working with Ralph Johnson/Perkins + Will for their new high-rise at 235 Van Buren. Their South Loop projects (specifically 1620 and 1720 S. Michigan) were designed by Brinninstool and Lynch, again, well know, well respected and award-winning architects in Chicago. The reason CMK designs might look cheap to you (and trust me, price-wise, they ain't cheap) is because they take a simpler approach to residential high-rise development, where the materials, concrete, steel, glass, metal finishes speak for themselves, instead of creating tacky, faux-old world, incorrect beaux-arts, or art-nouveau monstrosities (read: the butchers at Lucein LaGrange). As for the "sterile" enviroment along the S. Michigan streetscape, they've left room deliberately for retail, commercial developement (and even a school, which was rumored to be interested in the first floor of 1720) which that part of the South Loop desperately needs if it wants to be a lively part of the City.
Basically, even if you don't have the cranial capacity to understand modernism, or rather 21st century interpretations of Miesian Moderism, and the simple elegance that arises from it, don't knock it so easily, especially considering that CMK is doing what many other highrise developers should be doing in the City - as far as I'm concerned, CMK is doing it right, others are doing it wrong.
Thurstin, get me a drink!
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Old April 25th, 2007, 08:08 PM   #251
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Thurstin, get me a drink!
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Old April 25th, 2007, 09:14 PM   #252
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I like CMK's designs and Contemporaine is my favorite building built in Chicago in the past 25 years, but I have to agree that 1620 is cheaply made. I know about a lot of unhappy owners and few lawsuits. However, each CMK's building looks sooo much better than your average cheap faux-french extravaganza. And I'm not comparing the styles, I'm just talking how cheap this shit looks.
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Old April 25th, 2007, 09:45 PM   #253
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I like CMK's designs and Contemporaine is my favorite building built in Chicago in the past 25 years, but I have to agree that 1620 is cheaply made. I know about a lot of unhappy owners and few lawsuits. However, each CMK's building looks sooo much better than your average cheap faux-french extravaganza. And I'm not comparing the styles, I'm just talking how cheap this shit looks.
Lawsuits?? Regarding the construction??! That's news to me, was not aware.
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Old April 25th, 2007, 10:13 PM   #254
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I should say lawsuits that the owners wanted to file against the developer/architect/contractor trio. I don't have the latest if they actually did. Is there anyone here from 1620 who wants to share more?
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Old April 25th, 2007, 10:28 PM   #255
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I should say lawsuits that the owners wanted to file against the developer/architect/contractor trio. I don't have the latest if they actually did. Is there anyone here from 1620 who wants to share more?

Well Lawsuits filed by either condo associations or owners are nothing new particullary in the South Loop in fact I think that you would be hard pressed to find a single developer who isn't in litigation regarding one or more of their south loop properties. Enterprise, the Defunct Legacy, Warren Barr, Frankel & Giles.

Letís differentiate between lower price points with cheaply built. CMK may not have the onyx floored lobbies, doorman and pools that Museum Park Towers do but, they have open floor plans and contemporary designs and a no frills price point. I watched 1620 and 1720 go up and I canít say that they look to be cheaply or poorly constructed. To the contrary I like there handling of the Garage facades and the inclusion of retail on the first floor, large balconies and the use of good looking glass and metals.

Buildings that I would put into the poorly constructed group would include the ever bitching Prairie Ave town homes and tower by legacy. There is a whopping special assessment in the tower is going to replace all the windows. The 15street towers on State Street that have had to rebuild the balconies and Tower 2 in MP which Enterprise failed to seal the underground garage. I'm sure there is more.
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Old April 25th, 2007, 11:03 PM   #256
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..

Last edited by Loopy; May 18th, 2010 at 04:49 AM.
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Old April 26th, 2007, 09:11 PM   #257
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Warman

[QUOTE=Loopy;12838948]Too bad they sued their developers before they had a chance to correct the problems. Now it's just wet floors and lawyers.


Yes because developers with history like some of those in the South Loop, are so honest, they will just come and correct the problem with a phone call. Problem is this is the track record for this developer.
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Old April 27th, 2007, 06:29 AM   #258
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ErmDiego View Post
Their design and materials on the South Loop projects, are inferior to their other projects. The developers seem to lower their standards on highrises in the South Loop. The streetscape wall they created on Michigan Ave. with 1712 and 1620 projects is a sterile and uninspiring gray mass of ribbed aluminum siding. In total, their designs have been predictable, tired, and worn. Now, in some cases there were a lower initial price per square foot, and that is their demographic target. http://www.cmkcompanies.com/site/epage/26401_532.htm

It's Michigan Avenue for cripes sale, and that is the best you can do? When you are installing pre-cast celing/floor panels for a condo development, it is a clue you are ultimately not thinking about custom quality. Reminds me of a Days Inn
^ So what do you consider quality then? Being so that you have such an anti-modernist bent, I'll gather that fake-historic is your cup of tea? Then you DEFINITELY are the minority in this forum, as well as the architectural community as a whole. Taste being what it is, if I had to choose between yours and the experts', I think I'd take the latter
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Old April 27th, 2007, 06:40 AM   #259
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Not bad for the location. Agree with Chitowner 245. We could put up more of the cheap CMK stuff so you can get a look at your neighbors $200 Target bedroom set, and clothes piled up in the window with the bedsheets covering the sun.

I take it the lower two floors are facade, and the upper is more painted concrete...cripes throw some red stripes to make it an architectural wonder; oh, that has been done
^ You lose all credibility when you say the above, being that you actually don't see anything wrong with this:



Face it, Ermdiego. It's vaguely possible that you have been focusing too much on your Prarie Avenue dreamworld and don't know a thing about architecture in 2007. Do you honestly think that nostalgic, fake historic buildings are the future for Chicago? If so, that's just a sad testament to how provincial and banal your tastes are, and it only enforces further my stereotype of the kinds of ho-hum bores that have moved into the Prarie Avenue district.
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Old April 27th, 2007, 06:48 AM   #260
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^ I got sarcasm out of his post though. I could be wrong, TUP, but the Target joke? was the giveaway. Not funny, though ErmDiego.
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