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Old October 20th, 2007, 06:48 AM   #1141
Mr Downtown
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Franklin Point responses

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How do you get USPS to de-vacate the Polk approach on the west side of the river?
I donít think theyíve foreclosed that in any way. They just would need to move their security kiosk around onto their driveway. The city keeps talking about a Polk Street bridge, eventually (after a Taylor Street bridge).

Quote:
would you encourage retail along Franklin, behind the riverwalk?
Iíd probably leave that to the market, though thatís the general intention behind leaving only 50 or 60 feet between Franklin and the riverwalk (not enough for a big building with the 30-foot riverwalk setback). You canít force retail everywhere, and I think itís more important on the Wells and Harrison sides.

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Why you insist that building with cheap masonry somehow "respects" surrounding older masonry buildings continues to baffle me. You yourself once said that modern buildings can look good next to older, traditional ones.
I was imagining composites like World Financial Center in Battery Park City, where a glassy modern tower emerges from a brick base. I think brick bases and sixth-floor setbacks on the west side of Wells would help preserve that streetís character. I donít want it to be schizophrenic, with all slick glass crashing to the sidewalk on one side and small masonry buildings on the other.

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Would you strenuously oppose a small increase in density for a proposed Franklin Point project over the current DX-7?
No, but I doubt it would be necessary given all the bonuses a developer can take.

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would you insist that all tower heights in any newly proposed Franklin Point development comply explicitly with the Near South Plan for this area?
I think itís the proper place to begin negotiations. The sweet spot for office developments is less than 50 stories at the moment, and for residential buildings around 35 stories. I think only in the Grant Park and lakefront areas can you sell residential at prices high enough to overcome the elevator/floorplate tradeoffs that become problematic above 35 floors or so.

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How tall?
Iím more interested in technique than size.

Quote:
Why not insist that the parking go below grade?
Impractical in Chicago. And part of this site is riverbed that was relocated in the late 20s.

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That mound of crab grass in the middle of the Congress Drive/Wacker Drive interchange?
Thereís been talk of removing part of the interchange or burying it, so that this could become a useful park.

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Why not insist the developers devote 15%-20% of the project to green space
That would be another way to go. But you want a new park to be of significant size, not just leftover lawn between the office buildings. And you want it to feel truly public, not hidden within a compound as in Dearborn Park.

Quote:
Shadows cast in a park isn't a big deal in Chicago.
Itís pretty basic in our climate: donít shadow the open space. No one with any urban design training would argue otherwise. In 30 years, when the park is filled with brownbaggers during a May lunch hour, how do you think theyíll feel about the matter? Will they be all excited about sitting at the base of some supertall that gave scraperfans a chubby in 2014? Or will they enjoy the warm sunshine that was preserved for them by thoughtful site planning?

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(all the other "articulated" facades downtown don't really cutdown on windshear.
Thatís pretty much the only prescription for windshear: use building massing to break it up into small eddies.

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Why do we need to keep replicating architecture of the past
No oneís ďreplicatingĒ anything. Weíre asking them not to thumb their nose at the existing buildings along the east side of Wells. Ever been to Society Hill in Philadelphia? Itís a profusion of mid-century and severe modern townhouses and apartment buildings. But it all holds together wonderfully because of the use of the same red brick on everything.
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Old October 20th, 2007, 11:19 PM   #1142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loopy View Post
This is from Bauhs Dring Seglin Main's website. I wish it were bigger. It shows the basic plan of "LaSalle Park"
Well the second phase of the Roosevelt Collection looks something like this


Anyone know when sales begin for RC's highrise component?
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Old October 20th, 2007, 11:51 PM   #1143
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A beautiful building. It addresses the parking podium problem well.

My only criticism is that the plaza at the base should be paved instead of grassed. People put way too much import on grass, when it lends the absolute wrong type of surroundings for a high-rise building. There's already gonna be a large grassy park immediately south of the building. This part needs to be urban, to relate to the warehouse character of the neighborhood to the north.
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Old October 21st, 2007, 12:08 AM   #1144
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Originally Posted by ardecila View Post
A beautiful building. It addresses the parking podium problem well.

My only criticism is that the plaza at the base should be paved instead of grassed. People put way too much import on grass, when it lends the absolute wrong type of surroundings for a high-rise building. There's already gonna be a large grassy park immediately south of the building. This part needs to be urban, to relate to the warehouse character of the neighborhood to the north.
Yes and no, because now, instead of having water runoff, it will seep naturally into the ground and the sewer systems won't be overloaded.
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Old October 21st, 2007, 12:59 AM   #1145
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..

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Old October 21st, 2007, 03:04 AM   #1146
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..

Last edited by Loopy; May 19th, 2010 at 02:17 AM.
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Old October 21st, 2007, 03:09 AM   #1147
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loopy View Post
Does this look like it could be the site?



That's it, Right at Polk and Financial Place. Sweet!!!!!
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Old October 21st, 2007, 03:33 AM   #1148
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Yes and no, because now, instead of having water runoff, it will seep naturally into the ground and the sewer systems won't be overloaded.
It seems ridiculous to promote grass instead of paving when the sewers will need an upgrade anyway to handle the runoff from the roofs, the newly-paved roads, and the hundreds of new residential units.

For god's sake, man, this is part of the central area. It should have high-capacity sewers, both for waste and storm water.
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Old October 22nd, 2007, 05:53 AM   #1149
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ardecila View Post
It seems ridiculous to promote grass instead of paving when the sewers will need an upgrade anyway to handle the runoff from the roofs, the newly-paved roads, and the hundreds of new residential units.

You can use pavers that have holes between them to allow drainage to infiltrate or pervious concrete. The development (as each major development is required to do) will require storm water detention that should reduce the flow going into the sewers and therefore help the capacity. It is funny when people complain about how overtaxed the sewers are and how buildings will make it worseare when it is usually the opposite to happen. I laugh to myself every time I hear Fioretti mention it because I know he is being fed by ignorant NIMBYs.
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Old October 23rd, 2007, 05:02 AM   #1150
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What sparked all of this talk about Franklin Point? Has CSX agreed to sell its share of the property?
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Old October 23rd, 2007, 05:20 AM   #1151
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..

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Old October 28th, 2007, 01:06 AM   #1152
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10/21/07

1400 Museum Park

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Old October 28th, 2007, 05:42 AM   #1153
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great shot of 1400mp. Bvic this looks like you took it from the that small park at 14th and Indiana. nice job
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Old October 28th, 2007, 10:53 PM   #1154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PrintersRowBoiler View Post
You can use pavers that have holes between them to allow drainage to infiltrate or pervious concrete. The development (as each major development is required to do) will require storm water detention that should reduce the flow going into the sewers and therefore help the capacity. It is funny when people complain about how overtaxed the sewers are and how buildings will make it worseare when it is usually the opposite to happen. I laugh to myself every time I hear Fioretti mention it because I know he is being fed by ignorant NIMBYs.
I would think that people who would potentially be living directly on the South Branch of the river would have considerable interest in maintaining adequate drainage into the ground, rather than the sewer system, to minimize the amount of sewer overflow dumped into the river. It is pretty unpleasant to cross the river around there after heavy rains. I'd be interested to know how a new sewer system put in entirely from scratch would be set up. Would this area be using old sewer lines or relying entirely on new ones?
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Old October 29th, 2007, 01:32 AM   #1155
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Quote:
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the amount of sewer overflow dumped into the river
With the completion of the Deep Tunnel project, I understood the amount of this to be virtually none. No?
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Old October 29th, 2007, 03:55 PM   #1156
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Quote:
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With the completion of the Deep Tunnel project, I understood the amount of this to be virtually none. No?
I dont know the last time it overflowed. Even with the recent torrential downpour rains... did the Deep Tunnel only get 1/3rd full? Plus, in order to overflow, the water would be 99% gray water, so it really should not be much of an impact. The benefit of infiltration in the City really does little to impact the sewer. It is more environmental as it recharges the water table and allows the soils/vegetation to cleanse the water as it makes its way down to water. You still are required to have detention whether you implement infiltration or not. Many site use underground vaults/pipes for detention. I think they should allow the vaults to "leak" out and allow the storm water to infiltrate. The City of Chicago is the only place I know of that actually requires projects to encase the joints of the vaults in concrete to prevent infiltration.

However, the City just changed the regulations that you are only allowed to discharge a flow of water equivalent to a 5-year flow based on the downstream sewers even during a 100-year storm (or 10-year storm for a buliding that is lot-line to lot-line). That doesnt mean the sewers can handle every storm. What that does mean is sites that currently let storm water run off the site and into the sewers undetained should have a smaller flow going to the sewer system post-development.
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Old October 30th, 2007, 09:21 PM   #1157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BVictor1 View Post
That's it, Right at Polk and Financial Place. Sweet!!!!!
Looking at it a little closer, it seems that they're creating a new street west of Financial, immediately to the east of Paper Place, or perhaps just repositioning Financial further west.

Recently people who park in Zone 550 on Financial south of Polk got notice that the city had vacated the street to the developer and that it would essentially disappear by the end of November. (Where these zone permits will go, if anywhere, is still unresolved, as this apparently came as just as much of a surprise to Fioretti's office as to the people who park there. It seems like it may have been a parting gift to the people of west Printer's Row from ol' Madeline, because this was already a done deal by the time Fioretti took office.) Already the southern half of zone 550 on Financial is sorta at your own risk from construction equipment, and they've erected construction barriers across it, though they don't yet close it off.
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Old October 31st, 2007, 09:33 PM   #1158
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At today's CAF lecture, Lucien Lagrange quickly flashed renderings of a freestanding 60,000 sf Roundy's grocery store in the South Loop.

Afterwards I asked where, and he said "16th, 17th, Dearborn, Clark" but in a way vague enough to suggest that might not be the precise location. He said it's a city-owned property, but the city is asking them to take a look at other locations.
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Old November 1st, 2007, 06:03 AM   #1159
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Quote:
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At today's CAF lecture, Lucien Lagrange quickly flashed renderings of a freestanding 60,000 sf Roundy's grocery store in the South Loop.

Afterwards I asked where, and he said "16th, 17th, Dearborn, Clark" but in a way vague enough to suggest that might not be the precise location. He said it's a city-owned property, but the city is asking them to take a look at other locations.
^ What did they have planned for Roundy's requisite parking?
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Old November 1st, 2007, 06:58 AM   #1160
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^Dunno. He just flashed the rendering for a half-second, and all I could make out was a box floating in space.
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